Tumanchik
Quote: Krosh

After I just smell that cream and then immediately run to weigh myself, and you ask about food ...
Krosh, delicious lope in life and past cha ...
Crochet
Chu), found something to regret ...

In the next life I'll come off ...

Mandraik Ludmila
Tumanchik, and I was sitting here in the bushes, I wrote down the recipe for the pouring cream. We have currants, that's just how it will have to be done, otherwise the mush will go into kvass and the wine!
Tumanchik
Quote: Mandraik Lyudmila
and then all the mush in kvass and wine!
hello to both of you!
k @ wka
ABOUT!!! And I need it !!
Mush is going for blueberries tomorrow. So I will attach her if from eating remains
IvaNova
Virgo, a technology issue. I'm dumb, sorry.
There is unpasteurized farm milk. Some must be frozen.
Boil it first or pour it "alive" into containers and freeze?
marina-asti
IvaNova, I ice cream alive. Mom brings 5L from the farm, so 5L to the chest)
IvaNova
marina-asti, Thank you! I will do it too
Irgata
Quote: IvaNova
"live" to pour into containers and freeze?
good if milk, why spoil it by boiling, I also never boil "live" milk
filirina
Quote: Irsha
good if milk, why spoil by boiling
Irisha, I disagree categorically! Farm milk, the health status of the cow is not known, how it was milked and whether hygiene rules were observed during milking and transportation is not known. Tuberculosis, leukemia, microbiology ..... do you need this "live milk"? I am only for pasteurization, not boiling, but pasteurization, at 85-90 degrees. If the cow is not my own and my hands are not my own, I would not risk it, otherwise the harm of fast food will seem like a child's play against the background of what can be purchased through living milk.
Tumanchik
Quote: filirina

Irisha, I disagree categorically! Farm milk, the health status of the cow is not known, how it was milked and whether hygiene rules were observed during milking and transportation is not known. Tuberculosis, leukemia, microbiology ..... do you need this "live milk"? I am only for pasteurization, not boiling, but pasteurization, at 85-90 degrees. If the cow is not my own and my hands are not my own, I would not risk it, otherwise the harm of fast food will seem like a child's play against the background of what can be purchased through living milk.
I will support 100%
k @ wka
filirina,
Irina, is it possible to destroy all these byaki that you described here by simple pasteurization or boiling?
Then it is already necessary for analysis in the veterinary laboratory
fedorovna1
Irina,
Quote: filirina
namely pasteurization, at 85-90 degrees
How much time?
filirina
Quote: k @ wka
unless all these byaki that you described here can be destroyed by simple pasteurization
It is by pasteurization that they are destroyed! Louis Pasteur was a brilliant scientist and with his discovery saved people from many health problems!


Added Wednesday 27 Jul 2016 04:22

Quote: Fedorovna1
how long
Usually, you just need to bring it to a temperature of 85-90 degrees and turn it off. The liquid does not cool instantly, so the time that it remains hot with the heating turned off is enough.


Added Wednesday 27 Jul 2016 04:29

Quote: k @ wka
Then it is already necessary for analysis in the veterinary laboratory
Well, we know how much tests are done ...
Moreover, the veterinary laboratory will check the microbiology, but whether the cow is sick with tuberculosis or leukemia is unlikely ... and these diseases are very common and ubiquitous.
IvaNova
In general, frozen without heating. Because we don't drink raw anyway. And in sauce or porridge - so after defrosting in a finished dish and boil
Crochet
Quote: filirina
I am only for pasteurization, not boiling, but pasteurization

Irish, and for the preparation of yoghurt you also do not boil?

I boil for yoghurt, but I ferment kefir, yogurt and yogurt in pasteurized milk, without boiling ...
marina-asti
Quote: Krosh
I boil for yoghurt, but I ferment kefir, yogurt and yogurt in pasteurized milk, without boiling

Are you boiling pasteurized for yogurt?
I don’t ... maybe of course I should ... I thought about it

Mom then puts 5 liters on cottage cheese or in porridge / cocoa for children - that is, milk in any case, milk is heat treated.
filirina
Quote: Krosh
and you can't boil for yogurt too
I don't boil for anything. Heat treatment by pasteurization is usually more than enough! It is not advised to boil milk, because when boiling, the B vitamins present in milk are destroyed, and pasteurization practically does not affect them. But in recent years, alas, you have to use packaged store milk with a short shelf life. It's straight out of the bag for yogurt ...
Admin
Quote: filirina
Heat treatment by pasteurization is usually more than enough!

Ira, you write correctly! If we are talking about the usefulness of yoghurt and other fermented milk, then pasteurization is quite enough, this is still living milk.
Ultra pasteurized and long shelf life, this is "dead" milk for any application.
filirina
Quote: Admin
If we are talking about the usefulness of yoghurt and other fermented milk, then pasteurization is quite enough, this is still living milk.
Admin!
Anatolyevna
filirina, Irina, in spring and autumn, a cow is vaccinated against dangerous diseases and we donate blood for analysis for tuberculosis.
Always like this! Regular customers for sour cream and milk.
Tusya Tasya
I remember that Koch's tubercle bacillus does not die during normal boiling.
filirina
Quote: Anatolyevna
in spring and autumn, the cow is vaccinated against dangerous diseases and we donate blood for analysis for tuberculosis.
Antonina, good for your regular customers! They have found conscientious cow owners! But, alas, not everyone is so decent ... so you have to reinsure yourself.


Added Wednesday 27 Jul 2016 1:55 pm

Quote: Tusya Tasya
I remember that Koch's tubercle bacillus does not die during normal boiling.
Google to the rescue!
when heated to 85 degrees - dies after 30 minutes, when heated to 100 degrees - after 2 minutes.
P.S. I understand that Koch's wand was valiantly confused with botulism, which, yes, when heated to 100 degrees does not die for long hours ...
marina-asti
filirina, Admin, you reassured me!
Alex_Fil
Quote: filirina
botulism, which, yes, when heated to 100 degrees does not die for long hours ...
Botulism is a disease caused by botulinum toxin poisoning. The toxin is produced by the spore-forming bacillus Clostridium botulinum. The toxin itself decomposes upon boiling (100 * C) for 25-30 minutes, in an autoclave, under pressure, at 120 * C - in 10 minutes. Vegetative forms of Clostridia die at 80 * C within 30 minutes, with boiling - within 5 minutes. But the disputes, indeed, withstand prolonged boiling. For their complete destruction, use tyndalization, fractional heating to 100 * C for 1 hour, with an interval of a day - and so on up to 3 ... 5 times. In between, if the surviving spores become vegetative, subsequent heating kills them.

When I hear about drinking raw, fresh milk, I remember the fate of the actress Ekaterina Savinova, remember - Frosya Burlakova from Come Tomorrow ...
Sorry for the offtopic topic.
Crochet
Quote: marina-asti
Are you boiling pasteurized for yogurt?

Yeah, pasteurized boiling, Marish ...

Quote: RepeShock
For yoghurt, milk must be sterilized (ultra-pasteurized), that is, all bacteria must be "killed" in it (for the proper development of the yoghurt culture). And already from what sourdough is introduced, this or that fermented milk product will be obtained (different yoghurts, bifidums, acidophilus, etc.)

This is not required for curdled milk. Here milk itself sour, any.The introduction of any sourdough only accelerates this process, although milk without any additions is perfectly leavened by itself (in fact, this is how yogurt was always done).

Anna1957
Quote: Alex_Fil
When I hear about drinking raw, fresh milk, I remember the fate of the actress Ekaterina Savinova, remember - Frosya Burlakova from Come Tomorrow ...
There is not a story about botulism, but about BRUCELLOSIS
Scarlett
Girls, throw in a recipe for inexpensive, but large rolls, preferably with a filling. I completely messed up with my business - I WANT more and cheaper. I also have expensive goodies in my assortment, but a bun would still be cheaper and a lot more
Alex_Fil
Anna, I know!
My comment about botulism referred to the term itself, that "botulism" does not die when boiling, botulism is a disease.
But the tragic fate of the actress was predetermined by the steamed milk drunk. The reason, as you mentioned, was brucellosis. Who knows, if she hadn't drunk fresh milk, how would her further fate have developed ... But history, alas, does not tolerate the subjunctive mood.
Anna1957
Quote: Alex_Fil
botulism is a disease.

Yes, I also like correct wording.
filirina
Quote: Anna1957
Yes, I also like correct wording
Well, call me, this is not a medical portal and not all honey. education! She named it as is popularly accepted, otherwise if you throw in Latin, then hardly anyone will understand anything at all!
Although I also like correct wording.
Anatolyevna
Scarlett, Tatyana, came for the rolls and there is no one!
filirina
Quote: Scarlett
inexpensive but large rolls, preferably stuffed
Tanya, do you need sho for the rolls? Sweet, salty? Unclear...
Scarlett
Irina, AntoninaWell, I opened a stall in the market, with coffee and my own pastries. It seems that everything is slowly getting better, there are buyers for expensive (in their opinion) baked goods, cakes, pies in the sense, but there is also a contingent from the series "cheaper and larger", with one roll to replace breakfast, lunch and dinner at the same time, and mostly people noticeably not poor. So I want to diversify the price range. Nearby there is a point where I sell all sorts of nasty things belyashi, they had similar things before .... good, but now there is no oven, but people are used to it .... So I plan to lure more people for a cup of coffee using cheap pastries. Provided that the milk is all smarter for free - Mona and take a chance The main thing here is SIZE!
I have all kinds of croissants, and puff pastry tubes, and baskets with mushrooms, it got a little colder for a couple of days - I baked samsa and khachapuri, but now it's hot again, I need to store it in the refrigerator, and then warm it up, I'm waiting for the microwave. But the people desperately demand exactly the buns - with jam, poppy seeds and other delights. "Neighbors" today were treated to donuts with blueberries - I spat the whole dinner, but people sweep - it's cheap and a lot
celfh
Tatyana, Tan, do as in public catering. The dough is universal - the filling is different)
Tusya Tasya
Quote: filirina
Google to the rescue!
when heated to 85 degrees - dies after 30 minutes


From a conversation with the director of the Moscow City Scientific and Practical Center for Tuberculosis Control, Academician, DMN, Professor V.I.Litvinov. Vestnik HLS 204g, No. 15, p. 10-11
For a long time, tuberculosis was considered an incurable fatal disease, until in 1882 scientist Robert Koch discovered a microbe that causes tuberculosis (Koch's bacillus). Koch's wand is not exactly a bacterium, but a cross between a bacterium and a fungus - mycobacterium. It has the shape of a slightly curved stick. The causative agent of tuberculosis is very tenacious. Koch's tubercle bacilli do not die even at a temperature of 250 degrees, they are not afraid of concentrated acids, alkalis and alcohol.

More details: 🔗

I remember from my youth (I don't remember where I found out) that boiling does not kill a tubercle bacillus.
Irgata
Quote: filirina
Farm milk, cow's health is not known,
Irin, I agree with you about the unknown milk

although, to be honest, for many years we have been drinking curdled milk from not boiled milk, mmm, but this is our business, I do not advertise

a freeze always raw, if it is intended for porridge - why should it 2 times subject to heat treatment, then it is easier to buy dry, and not to be fooled with safety

although, again, nowadays milk powder is so unpredictable
Vasilica
Scarlett, a Rosan won't fit?
Tumanchik
Quote: Scarlett

Irina, AntoninaWell, I opened a stall in the market, with coffee and my own pastries. It seems that everything is slowly getting better, there are buyers for expensive (in their opinion) baked goods, cakes, pies in the sense, but there is also a contingent from the series "cheaper and larger", with one roll to replace breakfast, lunch and dinner at the same time, and mostly people noticeably not poor. So I want to diversify the price range. Nearby there is a point where I sell all sorts of nasty things belyashi, they had similar things before .... good, but now there is no oven, but people are used to it .... So I plan to lure more people for a cup of coffee using cheap pastries. Provided that the milk is all smarter for free - Mona and take a chance The main thing here is SIZE!
I have all kinds of croissants, and puff pastry tubes, and baskets with mushrooms, it got a little colder for a couple of days - I baked samsa and khachapuri, but now it's hot again, I need to store it in the refrigerator, and then warm it up, I'm waiting for the microwave. But the people desperately demand exactly the buns - with jam, poppy seeds and other delights. "Neighbors" today were treated to donuts with blueberries - I spat the whole dinner, but people sweep - it's cheap and a lot
Tanya is great! God help you in your business! Try to fry potato pancakes as it gets colder with meat. And also a great option

Public catering grease (Tumanchik)

I am looking for a recipe on our forum
any filling is possible. even fried onions and cheese.



Added Wednesday 27 Jul 2016 09:32 PM

here's a version of an not expensive test

All-purpose Sweet Dough Peter Reinhart (Anise)

I am looking for a recipe on our forum
take vegetable oil instead of olive oil. add sugar to make it sweeter and yeast to make it faster
V-tina
Quote: Scarlett
But the people desperately demand exactly the buns - with jam, poppy seeds and other delights
the cheapest, probably, will come out of ordinary yeast dough, twisted with a snail and sprinkled with sugar on top, we call it "Vitba", something like thisI am looking for a recipe on our forum
subject to free milk - pies and pancakes with cottage cheese, it also seems to me that an ordinary charlotte will come out quite budget
Tumanchik
V-tina, yes, we have all the buns in the shops will suit her.
here's a good recipe. replace current oil with vegetable oil.

Bun "Kuntsevskaya" according to GOST (k @ wka)

I am looking for a recipe on our forum
Well, come up with the filling yourself. elementary jam
Alex_Fil
Quote: Tusya Tasya

From a conversation with the director of the Moscow City Scientific and Practical Center for Tuberculosis Control, Academician, DMN, Professor V.I.Litvinov. Vestnik HLS 204g, No. 15, p. 10-11
Natasha, if we are to quote an article, then the original is better, and not a repost on some dubious narodn resource--
The original article can be read in the archive of the magazine "Healthy Lifestyle" for 2004 (204g is, apparently, a typo in your link)
🔗

Vitaly Litvinov said that "tubercle bacilli do not die even at a temperature -269 ° C"
This temperature, minus 269 ° С, is very low, corresponds to the boiling point of liquid helium, only 4 Kelvin above absolute zero temperatures.
The temperature of + 250 ° С was not discussed in the article.


Once again, I apologize for the offtopic in the subject and for the tediousness. I am for the accuracy of the wording.
Scarlett
Girls, I sincerely thank everyone for your help, advice and good wishes! And I apologize, if I didn’t save anyone - I almost always go from my phone to take a clean shot, well, I don’t come off the forum at all - and go straight to the kitchen or pour coffee.
Olka44
Girls, I was treated to a jar of jam ... I opened it - there is gray mold on top ...
Throw out everything or can you collect this muck on top, and boil the jam?
kirch
Olka44, Olya, everyone, of course, scares you with mold and advises you to throw it away. But, if this happens to me, I remove the mold and even do not digest the jam. It is like a film on top and can be removed easily
Tusya Tasya
Alex_Fil, well, that's what I found, so I shared, including my recollection. And only in order to show that you cannot relax and believe the very first source on the internet, especially when it comes to dangerous things. We really did naofftopil here, so let's end the discussion
Irgata
Quote: kirch
I remove mold and even do not digest jam.
I usually put this on the filling in pies, or instead of sugar I add to the dough
Tumanchik
Quote: Scarlett
Girls, I sincerely thank everyone for your help, advice and good wishes!
grow big ... fat and rich
Mirabel
Girls boys! I bought ready-made wafer cakes in a Russian store. How to spread them to get a delicious cake?
celfh
Vika, I have a good one Waffle cake

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