Choosing a dishwasher

I have a question about salt. I used to use Calgonite salt. Salt when set to 5 was enough for 2 weeks. Then I rearranged it to 4. Enough for a month and 10 days. I bought Somat salt. Mine from April 30 to this day, the indicator is off. At first the salt was at 4, then some stains appeared and I put it at 5. It turns out that the Somat salt is enough for more, or do I have something with the machine?

It turns out that both began to be made of who knows what. Previously, Calgonite changed in 3-4 weeks. The last time the salt did not run out for almost 6 months, it got into the salt compartment, and there it stuck together in one piece. I barely split it, and I pick it constantly. I'm waiting for it to end.
The washing powder itself is also a problem. I stopped washing dishes even on long programs with high T. Now I bought Bravix, it became much better.

I use Kristall-fix, but I need to completely fill the powder compartment, otherwise it does not wash the dishes well, plaque remains on the cups, in my opinion, Domol copes best with washing, I don’t use rinse aid for about a year, I add apple cider vinegar to the rinse aid compartment, there are no streaks on the glass and no plaque, the dishes are not slippery, somewhere on the internet I read that you can use apple cider vinegar (where I don’t remember), I decided to try it - the cut is very happy - the smell from the detergents is minimal, the glass is perfect.

Doesn't it smell like apple cider vinegar?

Surprisingly, there is no vinegar smell at all, when you open the PMM, there is only a faint smell of powder, the dishes practically do not smell, I stopped adding rinse aid and the dishes stopped stinking of powder, I came to the conclusion that the rinse aid gives the strongest smell.

[zoyaaa]

zoyaaa, and you do not dilute the vinegar, do you pour it?

No, I do not dilute, I buy 6%.

The girls, have finally installed the kitchen and this is the first time I load the PMM, tell me the salt and rinse aid then add to the maximum each time, or what?
And how do you measure the amount of powder, because each program has its own measure ...

[RybkA]

RybkA, Congratulations! let it be a good helper !!!

Load salt and rinse aid next time when the corresponding indicator on the machine comes on.

powder I put 1/3 of the cell volume, that's enough!

[Lisss's]

Lisss's , Thank you! I really hope that my expectations will come true!
So the powder is so on the "eye"? And then I have my own number in the instructions for each program ...
Salt poured a whole pack of 1.5 kg of Calgonite, it seems to be on the very edge, but the indicator is still blinking What to do? Opening a new one?

Did you pour water into the salt compartment first?

[Lisss's]

Lisss's , I'm sorry I didn't answer right away, the Internet has been working poorly lately ...

Yes, the water was poured first. The salt dissolves and dissolves, I opened the second pack, poured it straight in with a slide, no longer wanted to fit. And the indicator kept blinking. I "spat" on it and put washing sink. After the end of the program, it no longer flashes.

Yesterday I washed it for the second time, this time with powder from a bottle of Calgonit. It was cleaned normally, only in a saucepan after boiling corn, a strip of boiling water did not wash off, but this probably needs to be rubbed myself?

For the first time I took some pills (?) Or what, they came with the PMM. In the store I found similar ones, like Calgonite All in one... I put it in the powder compartment, but the washer was also poured. And if you use such a tool constantly, then you need to use the washer additionally?

In general, for the first time I took everything Calgonite. Although in our city I haven't looked for other means yet.On Fozzy I also saw Somat and in the DC there was some other product of a German company, I don't remember the exact name, but it is only in the DC.
Is it possible to use different companies at the same time, for example, Calgonite salt and Somat powder?

Is it possible to use different companies at the same time, for example, Calgonite salt and Somat powder?

Sure you may!

some other means of a German company, I don't remember the exact name, but it is only in the DC.

This is Domol! Highly recommend! It costs less, and washes better than Finish-Calgonit! One small "but": soft packaging, so do not rush to throw away the container from the previous detergent.

about slippery dishes - I noticed that with diluted 1: 3 rinse aid on long programs the dishes are not slippery at all, but on short programs they are still slippery

Lisss's, so where did you finally settle - the amount of powder, salt and the dilution ratio of the rinse aid? Did you replace the rinse aid with vinegar or finally removed it? after the first washing, the dishes are slightly bitter (of course, licked - you read a lot of experts here) at the water utility they told me the level of hardness for my area - my dear mother, I have to set it to 4, otherwise I'm afraid of the typewriter ...

I dilute the Domol rinse aid 1: 3, and today I poured apple cider vinegar for the first time, let's see what happens

bitter - a lot of powder and high salt. put salt at 1, and put no more powder than the lowest mark, and there you will adjust for yourself

Thank you! I already understood about the powder myself, although the Iplon bottle indicates the quantity for one wash of 45 ml, but I think this is for full-size pmm ... but how can I reduce salt if I have a hardness of 4.5 mmol per liter? this corresponds to level 4 ... but I will try to put a smaller one, let's see ... oh, how clean everything is !!!!!!

Girls, I've read horror stories about the means for PMM. I don't even know what to pour now. Amway is sold only in Ukraine. I bought Kristall-fix German. They write without chlorine.

and today I poured apple cider vinegar for the first time, let's see what happens

And I'm very interested! And you diluted it or so filled it ??

here they wrote above that apple cider vinegar is poured without diluting ... although it is a natural product, but somehow scary

Omela look here https://Mcooker-enn.tomathouse.com/index.php@option=com_smf&topic=27350.230 Answer 239, I wrote about Japanese gel, I really like it.

[tanya1962]

My husband once poured vinegar into the washer tank of the six, diluting it with water. The effect is amazing - no dirt, no streaks. BUT all the rubber in the tank lid is corroded. I just think there will be nothing to corrode?

tanya1962 , thanks - went to look. And then she was already upset. It's okay to poison yourself, I wouldn't want a child!

the effect of vinegar is great - it does not slip, there are no drops, it tastes nothing - I mean, neither bitter nor salty, but the horror story about corroded rubber scared me

apple cider vinegar 5%, not diluted

yes, I also remembered. I tried the finish tablets, put half on the wash. on the one hand, the dishes are not slippery and tasteless, but on the other hand, white drops are dried on the glassware

[tanya1962]

Answer 239, I wrote about Japanese gel, I really like it.

tanya1962, and where to look at it at least approximately?

Omela, we have a Karusel hypermarket on Kolomenskaya and there is a department of Japanese goods, that's where I buy laundry detergents and gel, besides that, there are a lot of cosmetics, baby diapers, etc.
I think so many large stores have such departments.

yes, I also remembered. I tried the finish tablets, put half on the wash. on the one hand, the dishes are not slippery and tasteless, but on the other hand, white drops are dried on the glassware

Do the tablets divide the finish line? there is a red circle in the middle, how to divide it? at least these were included with my boss, and I really wanted to try them, but they are so big for her, it seems

[tanya1962]

tanya1962 , I realized thanks! I tried the finish tablets that came with the PMM, did not share, I liked it, everything was washed. Today I tried the remedy that I bought - crystal fix, 1 \ 2h. l. too, everything is fine. On the advice of experienced people, I licked dishes, not salted. The salt is at 2.

Do the tablets divide the finish line? there is a red circle in the middle, how to divide it?

so otzh, and shared - with a knife

yeah, of course, otherwise I was looking at them - like a multi-colored powder then spill out? and the shell, I thought, should not be broken, probably soluble? oh, how dark I am in hmm-business

Today I washed dishes + a saucepan + a bowl of dough immediately after lunch without powder and rinse aid, on the + 60C program. Everything has been laundered !!!

well, Duc at 60 degrees, almost everything will be washed without powder, only a dirty machine can remain - she also needs a bathhouse with powder from dirty dishes

Of course, you know better, I just tried to wash this way for the first time. I went and looked - clean.

;) well, this is imperceptible, the fat will settle somewhere, the smell will go, and so on ... of course, not the first time all this will come out, so you can experiment! but not for long

[Lisss's]

the effect of vinegar is great - it does not slip, there are no drops, it tastes nothing - I mean, neither bitter nor salty, but the horror story about corroded rubber scared me
apple cider vinegar 5%, not diluted

Lisss's, I also poured the apple undiluted - there is no super Smell at all. You don't have to be afraid about rubber, the vinegar is diluted there decently with water and the rubber is not the same as in the washer system in the car.

[Lika]

Lika, oh, there are like-minded people! I also liked the vinegar more rinses

I wonder if the girl used to write that she used vinegar, I wonder how long she has been using it?

[Lisss's]

I use Kristall-fix, but I need to completely fill the powder compartment, otherwise it does not wash the dishes well, plaque remains on the cups, in my opinion, Domol copes best with washing, I don’t use rinse aid for about a year, I add apple cider vinegar to the rinse aid compartment, there are no streaks on the glass and no plaque, the dishes are not slippery, somewhere on the internet I read that you can use apple cider vinegar (where I don’t remember), I decided to try it - the cut is very happy - the smell from the detergents is minimal, the glass is perfect.

Lisss's, here is her message, it doesn't say how long ago. I think everything will be fine with our sinks

[Lisss's]

Lisss's, here is her message, it doesn't say how long ago.

Lika, why isn't it said ?? very much even said, I quote

I do not use rinse aid about a year, I add apple cider vinegar to the rinse aid compartment,

Lizok, you are smart, that found this post! I think that in a year the machine would definitely have died if it had eaten away! so it's time to stock up on apple cider vinegar!

Girls, just do not be offended, but I suppose that your cars from vinegar will definitely get bad. True, not right away ...

And normal apple cider vinegar is more expensive than a washer, which (Domol) suits me personally.

Wow. You ladies are risky! I wouldn't do that for sure. Firstly - no buzz for plastic and rubber. Well, not good at all. Secondly - long contact with high temperatures. And the consumption is small, it will definitely stick out in the dispenser for several months. What will this vinegar eventually turn into (organic after all)? Plus mixing with detergent ...

Kievans, who are from Obolon, what is the roughness of our water? I'll turn by 2, then by 3 (out of 5) .. where can I find the info?

Firstly - no buzz for plastic and rubber. Well, not good at all. Secondly - long contact with high temperatures. And the consumption is small, it will definitely stick out in the dispenser for several months. What will this vinegar eventually turn into (organic after all)? Plus mixing with detergent ...

Firstly, he was there not for several months, but only for 3 weeks, depending on how often he washes the dishes. It doesn't turn into anything stash because of T. We pickle cucumbers with vinegar, pour it into boiling water - everyone is alive.
Secondly, rinses are still made on the basis of citric acid + it is not known what, a more aggressive composition is obtained than vinegar. There is acid and there is acid. For plastic and rubber, it doesn't matter which acid is citric or apple. But the absence of a chemical smell from the dishes is essential for me.

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The rinse aid does contain acid. But within the limits of norms that are safe for PM.
In addition, it contains surfactants, surfactants:
preventing the formation of drip marks on dried dishes.
By the way, these same surfactants are added to almost all detergents and almost all soaps, even baby ones. Well, probably it's not added to the household one.

Let's do the dishes and laundry with baking soda, rinse with food vinegar, and wash our face with laundry soap.

Shl. For a short short period of operation of the PM, we somehow by itself became the custom, immediately after washing, to "ventilate" the dishes in the most half-open PM, and / or already on the shelf. Everyday dishes are available with a margin, so they are rarely used immediately after washing. During the "additional ventilation" the chemical smell from the non-plastic dishes disappears completely, on the plastic - yes, it rarely sometimes "sticks for a little longer", but this is already a matter of compromise "wash with your hands or wait and ventilate" ...

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Moderator

[Acetic acid forms many complex salts and dissolves plastic very well and dissolves in it itself.It is necessary to descale it with citric acid, although it also "eats" platics. But it's better to buy a mixture]

Secondly, rinses are still made on the basis of citric acid + it is not known what, a more aggressive composition is obtained than vinegar. There is acid and there is acid. For plastic and rubber, it doesn't matter which acid is citric or apple

Acetic acid forms many complex salts and dissolves plastic very well and dissolves in it itself.
It is necessary to descale it with citric acid, although it also "eats" platics. But it's better to buy a mixture

A piece of the quote refers to the issue of descaling, but it is quite valuable in this topic too. Because it turns out that while fighting the smell of dishes, you slowly rinse the dishes in a plastic solution (even if it is weak).

Cucumbers here have no business at all, because we obviously marinate them not in plastic jars, and this is not about the dangers of vinegar for humans, but about the consequences of using it in PMM. By the way, standard caps usually have an additional coating on the inside just to avoid corrosion.

he is not there for several months, but only for 3 weeks, depending on how often to wash the dishes.

If the rinse aid disperses so quickly and you do not like the smell, then maybe it is worth reducing the consumption corny?

I don't know, maybe it all depends on the set flow rate or on the model of the machine, but two weeks ago I poured less than half of the dispenser into Boshik. With a daily wash - it is not in a hurry to end. There is no smell, except on the plastic - a little, if you smell it. Rinse aid calgonite, consumption - 2 (by default, factory, did not change). But even if it's a month, every day, several times a day, high temperatures + contact with the remains of detergent.

And so - all for an amateur, of course. Someone even throws grated household soap into the washing machine for the sake of ecology and for saving.

[Acetic acid forms many complex salts and dissolves plastic very well and dissolves in it itself.It is necessary to descale it with citric acid, although it also "eats" platics. But it's better to buy a mixture]

Quote: forum of the city of masters
Acetic acid forms many complex salts and dissolves plastic very well and dissolves in it itself.
It is necessary to descale it with citric acid, although it also "eats" platics. But it's better to buy a mixture
The quote piece refers to the issue of descaling,

When descaling the water boils, when rinsing, T is much lower - unequal conditions. Moreover, we are not talking about acetic acid 70%, but only about 6% vinegar + diluted with a lot of water, in relation to the volume of a pot or a double boiler.

If the rinse aid disperses so quickly and you do not like the smell, then maybe it is worth reducing the consumption corny?

Maybe you should set the consumption based on the quality of the water and the cleanliness of the washed dishes (no stains and smudges), and not the amount of the consumed product and the presence of odor? Otherwise, it makes no sense to use rinse aid.
Ernimel , you are satisfied with the rinse aid and zaph from it and thank God!
For me, if there is a smell on the surface of the dishes, then there are residues of rinse aid or powder. Something smells ...
Everyone chooses for himself what he likes and suits. Nobody is agitating to throw the rinse aid in the trash and pour the vinegar.

Girls, my PMM is still alive, nothing is corroded, the result suits me personally, I do not use apple cider vinegar in order to save money, because good vinegar is more expensive than rinse aid, I react very badly to foreign unpleasant odors, so for me this is a way out if Someone has doubts it is better to use your usual means. I often wash plastic containers and lids, too, until they dissolve. The relationship with the rinse aid did not work out, just how do not regulate it, but white spots remain on the glass, this does not happen with vinegar

... The relationship with the rinse aid did not work out, how do not regulate it, but white spots remain on the glass, this does not happen with vinegar

White spots? This is very strange. Rather, the stains should be from vinegar, because, unlike rinses, it does not contain surfactants, especially from the stains intended.
What is your PM model? How many years of operation? What is the hardness of the tap water? Is the regeneration salt level (water hardness) set correctly in the PM? What kind of rinse aid did you use?

I have a narrow BEKO, I used both somat and calgonite.

Does your ion exchanger still work? Didn't you put powder in the salt hole? White drops are kind of like a sign of rinsing in hard water, if I'm not mistaken. If yes, then probably only your acid (vinegar) will eat the excess calcium in the water. However, perhaps together with something else ...

"Quote:
I would like to read in more detail somewhere about the principle of operation of dishwashers and their design. It is especially interesting what kind of thing it is - an ion exchanger.

Everything is very simple. At the entrance to the PM, the water passes through an ion-exchange filter, where it leaves calcium and magnesium ions in exchange for receiving sodium ions. During a full cycle, the ion exchange resin depletes the supply of sodium ions and accumulates calcium ions, and in order to prepare the resin for work for the next cycle, it must be regenerated. Regeneration takes place with a saturated saline solution. The water in which the salt floats, poured into the brine container, is precisely the saturated brine solution. Once during the entire cycle, a valve is opened between the brine container and the ion exchanger, and then the water from the regeneration dosing device flows down into the container with salt, displacing the same amount of saturated brine into the ion exchanger. There the resin absorbs sodium ions and releases calcium and magnesium ions. The regeneration process may take several minutes. The ion exchanger is then rinsed with a little water. Regeneration usually takes place during a long rinse cycle. The regeneration valve opens slightly after the water has already been collected and rinsing has begun. When the water is drained from this rinse, the ion exchanger is also rinsed out.
Ion exchange resin is a chemically active substance that easily forms a compound with any substance. The compound with metal ions is easily broken by a high concentration of sodium ions. But if other chemically active substances get into the ion exchanger, then they quickly form a connection with the ion exchange resin and this process is already irreversible. That is, it is enough to get the detergent into the resin once and the resin is hopelessly spoiled. In addition, the resin combined with the detergent changes its physical properties, becomes sticky, sticks together into a solid mass and becomes an obstacle to the passage of water during filling. "

Pay attention to "The ion exchanger is then rinsed with a little water. Regeneration usually takes place during a long rinse cycle. The regeneration valve opens a little after the water has already been collected and rinsing has begun. When the water is drained from this rinse, the ion exchanger is rinsed out."

Perhaps you have vinegar "woven bast shoes" to the ion exchanger?

The drops were up to vinegar, the powder did not pour anywhere else, except for the compartment provided for it. In stores, I met a rinse aid that was quite expensive, an order of magnitude more expensive than somats, colganites, etc.etc., the manufacturer indicated on the label that the composition contains vinegar, in any case, I'm not going to change anything.

[Japanese powder for PMM Lion "Charmy"]

Got me Japanese powder for PMM Lion "Charmy"... In a bottle with a dispenser cap (very convenient). What can I say. Full delight! A full load of PMM for 9 persons requires 10 grams of powder (the dispenser, by the way, measures 5 grams each). I usually put in other funds 2-2.5 times more. All dishes are shiny! Including a pot of semolina porridge, a pot of pasta, plates of oatmeal (other means, as a rule, did not cope, especially since the bowls are so deep, apparently the water does not hit too hard there, inside the plates because of their shape). The main advantage for me is no chemical smell from PMM and from dishes (plastic cups from Ikea suffered especially from this). In general, solid advantages. I will definitely never return to calgonites, somats and others like them! What I wish everyone
P.S. I'll post the photo later.

I stumbled upon your message about the dishwasher-va. I am also from Nizhnevartovsk and am now looking for these funds. Recently I bought a dishwasher in Expert, where I immediately bought calgonite products. then I took some powder in Violet, but the quality of the washing of the pots still does not suit. You wrote about "Lion" "Charmy", can you tell me where you can get it from us? And another question, I set the value of salt to 1, I don't know if this is right or not for our water? I will be very grateful for the answer !

sorry if already discussed ... does anyone use this -

DISH DROPS ™ Automatic Dishwasher Powder
If so, do you need additional water softeners, etc.

I have the same thing, to be honest, I do not really understand why it is not spent so much. Siemens machine. Somat's salt is clearly coarser, maybe it dissolves more slowly? But I don’t know how good it is for the car, because the fact is that this salt must restore the ion-exchange resin in our car, and if less salt ions go there, it turns out that the resin does not regenerate normally. I did not find anything about this on other forums.

A similar situation. For the third month now, what kind of salt I do not fall asleep - the float does not float (I do not have an electronic sensor, but a float is built into the cork). Salt, calgonite, and somat are consumed much more slowly. I open the plug when the float does not float - and all the salt is visible, does not dissolve. I think another fake has gone. Previously, it was worth filling up to the top with salt and a maximum of an hour later the float floated up.

After washing, there are no streaks or smudges on the dishes. The water hardness level did not switch. This means that tap water has not become softer / harder. It is very confusing that the float does not float. You have to be guided by the eye - whether the salt is visible or not.

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ABOUT! Miracle! I washed the cork with a float. Now he swims again!

Japanese detergents for PMM appeared at OZONE.