Dishwasher selection (1)

We have a PPM 60 cm wide, I didn’t regret it. It is designed for 13 sets. But this is taking into account that the plates are more or less the same, and our dishes are different, I will get a large set of new dishes when I make the second kitchen.
If I ordered myself a 45 cm PPM, then in the remaining 15 cm I would make myself a compartment for trays. I bake a lot, every time I put baking sheets on the windowsill - it's inconvenient.

From my own observations: I finally managed to get a package of powder for PMM (Finish) and for two weeks now I have been washing it. I can only report that the quality of washing with powder is many orders of magnitude lower than that of the tablets that I have used so far. So, I will finish this package and have sworn to buy more powder ...

And if the machine has a connection to both cold and hot water, must it be connected to hot water?

[aynat]

aynat, be sure to connect to the cold one! will turn off your hot water - who will wash the dishes? and I, too, for a full-size PMM, I often do not have enough of my 45s, besides, the quality of washing in full-size ones is better at the same cost
and for baking trays there are such wonderful boxes, they are mounted in the base of the kitchen set

🔗

Another question. If the machine is under the tabletop (not built-in, but freestanding), where is the socket? Also under the worktop or above? Still, there should be quick access to the sockets (in my opinion), then you need to make a cutout in the countertop for an electric cord ...

Either put an RCD in the dashboard in order to de-energize everywhere in case of anything, or make sockets at least 15 cm above the level at which the PPM stands. I personally made both the RCD and under the hinged shelves (it is not visible under them). I prefer to be a fast response service

In the next bedside table, make a cutout in the back wall and place the sockets there. Any holes in the countertop are much more evil (in terms of waterproofing).

In the next bedside table, make a cutout in the back wall and place the sockets there. Any holes in the countertop are much more evil (in terms of waterproofing).

And if the next bedside table is a sink? Probably not under it?

I have sockets below the stove

"You can even smoke on a barrel of gunpowder with your mind." Install a splash-proof outlet. Preferably with grounding contacts. And necessarily an RCD on this line, somewhere else, in the dashboard. Then, in the most extreme situation (a crack in the water supply system and a stream of water pounds directly into the outlet), the protection will work.

"You can even smoke on a barrel of gunpowder with your mind." Install a splash-proof outlet. Preferably with grounding contacts. And necessarily an RCD on this line, somewhere else, in the dashboard. Then, in the most extreme situation (a crack in the water supply system and a stream of water pounds directly into the outlet), the protection will work.

1. Splash-proof socket must have a third contact (aka ground)
2. The jet of water flying into your outlet will not harm you in any way. And that's it.
3. RCD serves a completely different purpose, and not protection against short circuits inside the outlet.

1. Splash-proof socket must have a third contact (aka ground)
2. The jet of water flying into your outlet will not harm you in any way. And that's it.
3. RCD serves a completely different purpose, and not protection against short circuits inside the outlet.

1. It goes without saying
2. Under the most unfavorable conditions (the RCD did not work, the earthen and neutral wire are cut off, the floor is linoleum), you walk into the kitchen in wet slippers and grab the tap with your hand.
3. I did not mention the short circuit. RCD protects against various types of leakage currents, breakdown to the case, etc.And if it is not possible to make grounding, it is allowed to do without it if there is an RCD. But it is imperative to periodically check its performance with the "test" button.

2. Under the most unfavorable conditions (the RCD did not work, the earthen and neutral wire are cut off, the floor is linoleum), you walk into the kitchen in wet slippers and grab the tap with your hand.
3. I did not mention the short circuit. RCD protects against various types of leakage currents, breakdown to the case, etc. And if it is not possible to make grounding, it is allowed to do without it if there is an RCD. But it is imperative to periodically check its performance with the "test" button.

2. In such conditions, it is possible that something will hit. Provided that the linoleum is wet.
3. How do you imagine the operation of an RCD without grounding? I personally have no idea.

2. I wrote that the stream of water hits the outlet. If the outlet is in the drawer, the drawer is closed and filled with pots, when a person discovers this, there will be a deluge in the kitchen.
3. The earth does not participate in the operation of the RCD. It reacts to the difference in currents in the phase and neutral conductors. Most protection devices do not even have a ground terminal. And in those where it is, it passes in transit, not connected to the circuit. Unlike the device of the dishwasher, I understand this issue (I pass exams annually). About the fact that if it is impossible to make grounding, you can put an RCD written in the PUE (Electrical Installation Rules), since the seventies of the last century.

3. The earth does not participate in the operation of the RCD. It reacts to the difference in currents in the phase and neutral conductors. Most protection devices do not even have a ground terminal. And in those where it is, it passes in transit, not connected to the circuit. Unlike the device of the dishwasher, I understand this issue (I pass exams annually). About the fact that if it is impossible to make grounding, you can put an RCD written in the PUE (Electrical Installation Rules), since the seventies of the last century.

Most likely you understand. Now describe the circuit for connecting an RCD for two wires. With the participation of a person, of course, who touched the crane, for example (and our crane goes to the ground, of course).

Two wires are connected - phase and zero, like an electric meter (that is, two came and two went). The circuit inside the RCD compares the currents in these two wires, "how much has gone in, the same should come out." If any leakage occurs "to the side", then the current in the neutral conductor becomes less than in the phase conductor and the protection is triggered. The difference in currents at which the protection is triggered is indicated on the device case. The lower this current, the weaker you will get banged if you take hold of the water tap and touch the bare wire. Usually it is 10-30-40 milliamperes (more is impossible and less bad - it will work every time the computer is plugged into the outlet). Such protection will not save you from "two fingers in the socket", because the currents are equal and the protection will not be able to distinguish a person from a dishwasher. When the "test" button is pressed, the required operating current is started "bypassing" the current sensors and the operation of the circuit can be checked, since it, like a brake, can fail once in a lifetime.

[aynat]

oh how much bukoff aynat, I have sockets for PMM, oven and cooking behind the lower pedestals 30cm from the floor and 50cm from the PMM

Two wires are connected - phase and zero, like an electric meter (that is, two came and two went).

Yes, perhaps you're right, but I'm dull. The current is measured in one direction and in the other. If there is a leak, it will be seen.

Girls, please tell me if it is possible to wash ceramic dishes in PMM.

Not pouring? The one covered with glaze - I wash it.

cubic, my plates (they said that Italy when buying) are multi-colored and there are also pots, inside there is clay. Where I did not look for information, there is no, only about foreign baking dishes, that is definitely possible.

I wash our pots and pots, but inside too - clay .. true, to be honest, I don't often use them (and mine, respectively)

[grandmothers]

grandmothers, you can not wash pottery in the PMM! this is a porous material and during the washing process it will absorb all the chemistry, see what they write in the instructions for your dishes, if the dishes need to be soaked in water before cooking, then this is impossible. totally both inside and outside covered with glaze IMHO theoretically possible, but not at high temperatures - it can crack, and it will not always be immediately noticeable. I ruined the teapot, I washed it once on the machine, it looked like I got it clean, and then I brewed tea in it and all the tea leaves were on the table and the teapot was completely covered with craquelures, and so beautiful that it was a pity to throw it away

chantal, I have the lowest temperature 45 and drawn a wine glass and a cup. It looks like this is an economy mode, and three more are 50, 55-65, 70. A low temperature is usually 30, I don't have one. The plates are smooth on both sides, there are no badges on them, and the store said. that it is not required to soak them, but they do not know whether they can be washed in the PMM.

low temperature is up to 45 * or even up to 50 * (you don’t wash the dishes with your hands, it’s already cool)

Do the dishes have a name? how was it determined that she was Italian? you can search the internet for the manufacturer

Kpili in the sperm market, you have to go and find out the manufacturer, they look for the administration. The store is large, but they don't give you packaging and carry it as you like, not to mention questions about the manufacturer. And there was no thought of PMM three months ago.

My dear dislikers to wash the dishes by hand! I turn to you for advice, because there is nowhere to find a large number of PMM users
Most recently, I noticed that the upper rocker arm of my PMM (CENTURY) does not spin during washing, although water under good pressure flows out like fountains. I push with my hand, it turns with difficulty. I push the lower one - 2-3 turns, and the upper (with the same effort) half a turn and that's it, it stops. Maybe something is jammed somewhere? She asked her husband, he took off the top basket. looked at everything ... No visual problems were found. Who can say anything on this issue?

I also have Veko (in the Turkish version Arcelik), she is 11 years old. I went to twist - the result is the same as yours, so it was intended that the rocker arms rotate at different speeds.

Zanusya seemed to be praised ........

People, please help!
The dishwasher broke forever (it was very cheap), only worked for 2 months. We have to go to the store, change. I don't want this one anymore, but there is no money for a good one (like Bosch). Looked at the mediocre Hotpoint-Ariston. Who can say anything about this firm? It is written in Italy, but I read somewhere that the company is not very good. What to do? I don't want the situation to repeat itself. I also saw Veko, but it is even cheaper. Although the reviews about her are not bad.

That Veko, that Ariston. I cannot tell you anything encouraging.
However, what did you want for that kind of money? But you yourself look at your wallet and situation.

People, please help!
The dishwasher broke forever (it was very cheap), only worked for 2 months. We have to go to the store, change. I don't want this one anymore, but there is no money for a good one (like Bosch). Looked at the mediocre Hotpoint-Ariston. Who can say anything about this firm? It is written in Italy, but I read somewhere that the company is not very good. What to do? I don't want the situation to repeat itself. I also saw Veko, but it is even cheaper. Although the reviews about her are not bad.

I have Ariston. I bought it 1.5 years ago. No complaints, it works fine. And about the price - it's not that cheap. Such as I have now costs 3700 UAH (for comparison Bosch 4100). But when I bought more nikoi on sale, I had to take what they give, and I do not regret it. If you will use salt + powder + rinse aid separately, take it with indicators, it is very convenient

Owners of ZANUSSI!
Please tell me how many directions of water supply and holes in the rocker arms are in such a dishwasher. Something I can not find such information.

[lilian]

lilian As the owner of Electrolux (this is the same Zanussi), I can answer that there are 2 pieces of sprinkler (as in most PMs) But why do you need this?

I read a bunch of information, everyone claims that the more directions of water supply, the better. It turns out that the rotating rocker arms are these very directions? then I also saw them everywhere only 2. But it seems to happen also 5. Something the more I read, the more I get confused. It is also said everywhere that you need to count the holes in the rocker arms, the more of them, the better. And you also need to know how many rinses the machine does during a normal cycle. If 2, then this is all right, but 1 is not at all. But where to find such information, I don’t know.

Oh, this marketing with its own troubles !!! They will get to the bread makers one day. With one stirrer is the last century, but with two it is cool! When choosing HP, you need to pay special attention to how many revolutions it makes when settling the dough, if one is complete bullshit, it is better if two!
Zanussi cannot wash dishes badly! I do not believe in this. And the quality of washing does not depend much on the number of holes in the rocker arms! And the number of rinses is different for different programs. And the standard program is also standard in Africa. It determines the class of the car. And if it says A, then you don't need to look for something else!
The level of service and ease of use are much more important. Here they already wrote correctly: pull out the basket and mentally arrange your dishes in it. Personally, my baskets are very similar to Ariston's. And everyone writes inconveniently. And I can subjectively say that it seems uncomfortable. But this does not prevent you from washing the dishes and enjoying life.
Yesterday Yulia Vysotskaya said something in the spirit of "dishwasher is good" in "Let's eat at home", so today a delegation from the accounting department came to me to tell me in more detail. And when I used to brag about my purchase, everyone grimaced and shrugged their shoulders

Yesterday Yulia Vysotskaya said something in the spirit of "dishwasher is good" in "Let's eat at home", so today a delegation from the accounting department came to me to tell me in more detail. And when I used to brag about my purchase, everyone grimaced and shrugged their shoulders

Dishwasher manufacturers probably pay extra for her

And at some forum, the question was asked: who knows, what is her combine model?

Advertising is a great power!

Dishwasher manufacturers probably pay extra for her
And at some forum, the question was asked: who knows, what is her combine model?
Advertising is a great power!

By the way, Bosch pays her for advertising her combine. She had a MUM 47, now the new Bosch, it seems, is the 8th model. Red is so ...

Indeed, advertising ...

And my Bosch 3-week buggy became a new model, but in the lower section it stopped washing dishes plainly. The husband is now washing everything he can, but everything is clean. They called the master.

And my Bosch 3-week buggy became a new model, but in the lower section it stopped washing dishes plainly. The husband is now washing everything he can, but everything is clean. They called the master.

Oh, how sad ... The master will look, unsubscribe later, what's the problem, okay? I hope all be fine!

Kosharik, please unsubscribe !!! I also decided to buy Bosch, it is very important for me to know what your problem is!

I will definitely report back! The master will only be on the 2nd. And this is an authorized Bosch Siemens center. And this is in Moscow! It's good that this is a PM, not a refrigerator.
This model is assembled either in Germany or Turkey or Spain. I specially bought Germany. Worked for 17 days.
Although, everyone praises Bosch, and he works for at least 10 years without breakdowns.
In general, I am disappointed. That they will fix it - I have no doubt about it, but somehow it is sad all this. Only a year has passed under the sign of a coffee machine (5 repairs, a lot of nerves, and as a result, a replacement for a new one) and here's a surprise

[Kosharik]

KosharikAs I sympathize with you Bosch is not the same as it was 5 years ago. The quality is sometimes lame. Refrigerators are already being assembled in Russia 🔗
There were fakes in the network

sazalexter, thanks a lot! And you get used to the dishwasher - horror, you don't even want to cook now. Although this is my first experience of communicating with this unit.

[Kosharik]

KosharikIt will be repaired, and everything will be fine.It is really hard without PM, you quickly get used to good things

Yesterday I personally dispelled the myth that 45 cm PMM is washed worse than 60 cm. This statement is based on the fact that a circle inscribed in a rectangle is smaller than a square, and narrow machines should have a "dead zone" in the corners ... I was impatient to wash my favorite plate and not with my hands, but with an overglaze pattern (that is, it is impossible). I put it in the very corner and covered it with a plate of much larger diameter. I think there cannot be a direct hit of the jets there, the spray will touch a little and that's it - yeah, of course, nothing like that. My little pale little drawing has become. In general, if there is an opportunity to put 60 cm, then of course it is better. And if not, then there is no need to suffer from an unnecessary complex "oh, my machine washes worse because it is narrow." Yes, there are fewer dishes. And for some reason, it turns out so that it is not enough, then something does not fit. I personally do not need the half load function at all, the upper basket is more "sharpened" for cups, saucers, glasses. And the number "1/2" and something else in the lower basket does not work. Although theoretically the washing solution gets there, the dishes clearly cannot be washed there.

Sorry for a little almost offtopic.

Bosch is no longer the same as it was 5 years ago. The quality is sometimes lame.
There were fakes in the network

An acquaintance of mine left for permanent residence in Germany, and recently came to visit. Here he was a highly qualified electronic engineer, but there he cannot find a permanent job. But he has a contract with an intermediary firm, which for a certain percentage arranges him for temporary work in various enterprises. This is very beneficial for the owners, the salary is already lower than usual, plus no social benefits and all that. Thus, he worked for three months at the Siemens washing machine factory. In the quality control department. So if some not very obvious assembly defect was found - guess three times what you did with such a machine? That's right, they adapted it to the Russian language. And here it goes like "high-quality German assembly". So if you want one hundred percent guarantees, go to Germany and bring the car from there.

I have an ASKO dishwasher, Sweden
I, too, without her already like no hands.

Yesterday for myself I personally dispelled the myth that PMM 45 cm is washed worse than 60 cm

this is not a myth, it washes worse in the corners, so I put in the corners which is cleaner

Thus, he worked for three months at the Siemens washing machine factory. In the quality control department. So if some not very obvious assembly defect was found - guess three times what you did with such a machine? That's right, they adapted it to the Russian language. And here it goes like "high-quality German assembly".

Offtop of course, but I'm shocked !!!! I just looked at a Siemens washing machine, almost ordered it ...
Although there are no complaints about the Boshevsky dishwasher (already the second) and the dryer. So maybe it's better to take a Turkish or Polish assembly?

While I am waiting for the master ... I am tormented by the following doubts:
1. The machine came wet inside (although it was seemingly factory sealed). The instructions stated that there may be traces of water. But these are not traces, it was really raw.
2. After drying, the walls are wet. Very wet (water runs off). Condensing type drying. This is normal?