Choosing a dishwasher

[Bijou]

Bijou, and what's this about? What is this dead resin?

Lil, I don’t know about you, but I don’t understand, they are with sazalexter on their own wave

Found an article on salt. there she is:
Regeneration electronics

The regeneration electronics are one of the important features of the new Bosch dishwashers, which fundamentally improves the quality of washing, and not only that. What do these not understandable words mean for everyone?
The word "regeneration" means the ability to repair damage. What kind of damage we are talking about and how they are restored with the help of electronics - let's figure it out.
This interesting and important function of Bosch dishwashers relates to the hardness of the water used. Indeed, in nature there is no absolutely pure water, it always contains mineral impurities, in particular calcium and magnesium salts. When the water is heated in the dishwasher, these salts are deposited on the heating elements and on the dishes. Cookware becomes dull and heating elements can be damaged. The machine then has to spend more energy to heat the water. In addition, these salts can react with detergents and precipitate as an insoluble residue.
The content of calcium and magnesium salts in one liter of water is estimated as water hardness. Hardness is expressed in degrees of hardness (French or German) or in milligram equivalents per liter (in units of meq / l). Soft water - up to 10 German degrees, or up to 4 mEq / l, semi-hard - from 10 to 20 degrees, or 4 to 8 mEq / l, hard - from 20 to 30 degrees, or from 8 to 12 mg -eq / l, very hard - from 30 degrees, or 12 meq / l and above. The permissible limit for the hardness of water used for centralized water supply is 7 mg-eq / l.
The harder the water, the more detergent, water, time and energy it will take to achieve the desired dishwashing performance. If nothing can be done about it with manual washing, then Bosch dishwashers solve the problem of water hardness. This is not to say that this problem is solved simply, but rather successfully!
Reducing the hardness of tap water is achieved by passing it through a special ion exchanger in a dishwasher, which makes the water soft and increases its detergency. The ion exchanger is like a mini-factory for the production of soft water. Here excess calcium and magnesium ions are extracted from the tap water. For this, an ion exchange resin is used, this is a high molecular weight organic compound. The ion exchangers of Bosch dishwashers use the polymer compound Levatite. We will not go into the structure of multiply charged levatite ions; suffice it to say that due to their properties they bind ions of the opposite sign from the solution surrounding the grains or resin granules.
As a result, on the surface of the resin granule, one double-charged calcium ion (Ca ++) is replaced by two single-charged positive sodium ions (Na +). Calcium ions are taken from the water, and its hardness decreases, the water softens. And the sodium ions that replaced them, contrary to popular belief, do not affect the hardness of the water: sodium carbonate is formed here, and this is ordinary soda.
After the ion-exchange resin has done its job - softened the water and helped us wash the dishes with a shine, it is already clogged with magnesium and calcium ions and is not suitable for further use. However, it would be irrational to throw away the resin after every wash. Here comes the process of regeneration, which puzzled us at first, that is, the restoration of the ion exchanger damaged by calcium and magnesium ions.If sodium salt is added to the ion exchanger, then the opposite process occurs on the surface of the resin granules: one double-charged calcium ion (Ca ++) is replaced by two single-charged positive sodium ions (Na +).
The regenerating sodium salt is poured into a special container before starting the machine. In Bosch dishwashers, the salt container lid is located in the base of the machine.
When the dishwasher is turned on, part of the water from the tap flows into a special water tank for regenerating the ion exchanger. This container consists of three chambers of different sizes. Depending on the manually set or automatically set hardness, water from the first, second or third chambers enters the salt container, and then, in the form of a saline solution of the required concentration, into the ion exchanger. During regeneration, calcium ions leave the surface of the resin granules, and sodium ions again take their place.
The saline solution remains in the ion exchanger until the next dishwashing cycle. When the machine is turned on again, it first of all drains this saline solution into the sewer, this is accompanied by the characteristic abrupt sounds of the pump.
When used correctly, the ion exchange resin remains functional for the entire service life of the machine, that is, 10 years.
But why does the machine have three containers of regenerating water to obtain a particular hardness? After all, the softer the water, the better?
But no, the hardness of the water should be reduced to a reasonable limit. Too soft water not only requires additional costs for its production, but it can spoil the surface of the glass, taking ions from it. Corrosion of the glass occurs from this, it eventually becomes covered with characteristic scratches and becomes cloudy.
It has been established that the optimal water hardness when fed into the washing chamber of the machine is 1.1 mg-eq / l. And the function “Regeneration electronics” that puzzled us in the title of this article is precisely designed to ensure optimal operation of the ion exchanger. This function allows not only to avoid unnecessary waste of regeneration salt, but also to optimize the process, automatically providing optimal conditions for effective and gentle washing.
Some dishwasher owners, due to misunderstanding, neglect the requirement to control water hardness. Yes, for some time you can wash the dishes without adding salt, but soon the ion exchanger becomes clogged, and the dishes come out of the machine, dull, with whitish spots. Continuous use of the machine with an empty salt container may damage the water softener. If the matter has not gone far, the ion exchanger can be restored to its proper working capacity by filling the container with regenerating salt and performing the usual wash cycle 4-5 times.
The recommendations of some consultants to use cheaper table salt for dishwashers should be viewed with skepticism.
Article taken from the site

[Bijou]

Bijou, Lena, everything is simple to the point of banality, rarely anyone changes the pitch, they simply send the trash heap to the scrap.

[sazalexter]

sazalexter, uh, don't tell me. Curious craftsmen are a dime a dozen. And there are a lot of videos with pictures (as well as comments with a description of the process) - they disassemble, assemble, wash, track, change, hook sensors and cameras ... What's with washing machines, what's with dishwashers. And suddenly there was such a total conspiracy of silence. Something is unclean here.

Well, look. My car ran without salt for several years. With off-scale hardness, on tablets. Then I introduced the gel into use and after a couple of weeks a white bloom appeared. I returned the pills. But the result was strange - everything is fine, then no, no, and whiteness will appear on the glasses.

Of course, the thought flashed that everything, you bastard, jumped! Those who said that such negligence in depriving the machine of its lawful regeneration would lead to premature death were right. I poured salt. She continued to wash with pills. The raid began to appear less frequently and less frequently, eventually disappearing completely. It was over a year ago. There is still salt, there is still no rinse aid, and no whitish coating.

And what was that?

Girls, has anyone tried Synergetic dishwasher? How is it?

[Tanyusha]

Tanyusha, Thank you for the article!
Salt bought the soul calmed down!

girls / boys, are there any reviews for fairy pills? Did anyone compare them with the finish line? Are they different? And also, I found Cinderella powder for ppm in the carousel yesterday, it is very inexpensive, is it really G, or not bad? My car will just be delivered tomorrow, I'm getting ready now

My Faerie tablets do not wash away tea plaque from cups very well. The finish copes with it without any problems, however, like the Somat tablets (I like them the most).

[Sonadora]

Sonadora, thank you very much, then I will not suffer, I will go in the morning for somat

[Evgeniya]

Evgeniya, they are periodically discounted at the Crossroads.

[Jenealis]

Jenealis, we also have hard water, the mountains are alone.))

Buy you and really yourself a Finish to begin with. Then, when you learn how it should be as a whole, you will buy other means and use in parallel to draw conclusions in comparison. Surely some options will not be so hot, then they can be used in those sinks that are not the most grimy dishes. And some will like it better.

[Lena]

Lena, Thank you! and in a typewriter, which rigidity is better to set?

Oh, but I have to look, I haven't touched it for several years. Probably a C grade, just with my pills. If powder, then almost the last.)))

I found Cinderella powder for ppm yesterday in the carousel, it is very inexpensive, is it quite G, or is it not bad?

Eugene, I recently took Cinderella, I really liked it, especially at this price. The only thing you need to put on a longer washing cycle (I still had a light white bloom), but this is my only remedy that washes away tea bloom on the mugs. Finish powder did not wash

Finish has not been washing away the tea plaque lately, and some mugs inside are very much scratched from him and the price has become insane for him. Now I bought several new other media, I will try, then I will unsubscribe which one is better.

Maybe our tea plaque is very different or mugs? Even cheap Lentovskie tablets wash this plaque off. But the program is always long, and I always pour a little soda ash on the front wash.

I always just my long program. Maybe I bought a fake for a promotion, or maybe the mugs have already been erased, the girls wrote that this happens, or maybe the Finish just became bad (I have tablets) salt is always in the car. In any case, I don't want to finish, because the price has already become sky-high.

or maybe the Finish just got bad (I have pills)

Yes, it is possible. ((
I had a big box. Once.)) It seems that this business was called Calgonite, all-in-one. He washes so well that it was simply a sin to use it every day. And so it happened, for the daily washing of the tablet from Lenta with five rubles per wash or so, for the dirty one - a normal Finish still lasts. This is when fried grates from the stove, filters from the hood, heavily grimy pans and similar abnormal cases.)

I bought Somat powder a month ago, I haven't bought it for a long time, and started washing it a couple of weeks ago. And I noticed that the drawing began to wash off on cups, saucers and on several plates. Moreover, I've had this dish for a long time. Moreover, this is how the drawing began to wash off, almost became invisible. What they began to add such a thermonuclear to it is not clear. But the fact is on the face.

And lately I have been using tablets "Eared Nanny", the price is very reasonable and the quality of the sink suits

I bought Claro, powder, salt, mouthwash. I like the result, it washes everything, there is no plaque, mine is 50 eco
I have not adjusted the hardness of the water yet, my hands do not reach

And lately I have been using the "Eared Nanny" tablets, the price is very reasonable and the quality of the sink suits

I also like these pills, especially since they are not toxic, they can be classified as Eco

I bought a large bottle of Somat powder, I have my first machine, no one has one with my friends, I started washing it with it. And now, in reality, the stains from tea were not washed off, food too, and the smell I thought it was supposed to be, until my husband was outraged that the dishes smell bad (just vigorous chemistry). And I accidentally bought okeevskie tablets, for 60 pcs 300 re. I'll tell you a colossal difference! Everything is clean, without plaque, washes the stainless steel from soup and porridge with a bang! I am delighted! And most importantly, neither the car nor the dishes now smell anything at all.

The very first powder I also had was Somat in a bottle. And she also spat farther than she saw.))

Now, too, my inexpensive pills (I think, very close relatives of yours) from Lenta. Perhaps all the private labels of chain stores are made in the same place. Germany is indicated on the tape.

But the Ribbon powder is terrible in our water. It is worth the second year, neatly poured into a bottle from its predecessor, Somat.

I bought a large bottle of Somat powder, I have my first machine, no one has one with my friends, I started washing it with it. And now, in reality, the stains from tea were not washed off, food too, and the smell I thought it was supposed to be, until my husband was outraged that the dishes smell bad (just vigorous chemistry). And I accidentally bought okeevskie tablets, for 60 pcs 300 re. I'll tell you a colossal difference! Everything is clean, without plaque, washes the stainless steel from soup and porridge with a bang! I am delighted! And most importantly, neither the car nor the dishes now smell anything at all.

Nothing! And Somat is very nra to me ... When I see him for the action, I always take it. Maybe it depends on water?

Nothing! And Somat is very nra to me.

And me too ... and there are many different soaps - maybe it also depends on the manufacturer .. .. Now the somat is generally mixed with cheap sanit - everything is the same - the wash is perfect.
And yet .. in view of the fact that I had 2 PMMs (some here know my epic with the courts), I can safely say that in one PMM it was not laundered on a program with 70C, it easily washes in another PMM on a program of 60 C with the same composition of powder / salt / rinse aid ... In particular, it was exactly tea bloom and even on top of the stains on the notches of the mug .. so for your PMM you need not only to select a set of tools, but also programs for them (funds ) you need to adjust: girl_pardon:

[* Anyuta *]

* Anyuta *, and in Voronezh never met Claro powder? I used to buy in Auchan, I really liked it both in terms of quality and price, but now it disappeared ((and in general, the choice of funds has greatly decreased with the advent of sanctions, mostly Fairy and Finish

And in Voronezh you have never seen Claro powder anywhere? I used to buy in Auchan

the same problem ... .. my sister ... used to take it in Auchan too - now I don't really see it anywhere ..... eh .. I would have bought it myself, because both the price and quality (in the new PMM ) was pleased, but in the old PMM I did not wash the plaque ...
But I don't go to Lenta or Okey - they are not on my way at all - maybe they are there ..

... I was satisfied with the price and quality (in the new PMM), but in the old PMM I did not wash off plaque ...

Anh, and who is this new car? Looks like old Beko, right?

and who is this new car? Looks like old Beko, right?

Yes, the old one was VEKO, the new usual Indesite - there is no program at 70 C (as it was in VEKO), however, the quality of washing (including tea bloom) is different .. the dishes remained the same and all the means from VEKO migrated to Indesit , and the quality of the washing became much better ... The plaque began to be washed off once or twice ...

Oh how. Thanks for the information!

But I do not go to Lenta or Okey - they are not on my way at all - maybe they are there ..

suddenly you find-whisper

suddenly you find-whisper

Well ... I also need to look at the carousel, I saw some of Claro's products, but in my opinion it was a rinse aid ...

[Anyuta]

Anyuta, there is no claro in the carousel, but the finish is 599 2.5 kg. Maybe someone needs it?

Ukrainian girls! And what is better for the price / quality - Finish powder or Domol powder?

[Julia]

Julia, my Domolom is already the fourth year. I am satisfied with the quality. But Domolovski's tablets are the most sophisticated - a hundred times worse than the cheapest from an unknown manufacturer. I tried the finish only with the rinse aid - I didn't like it, it was uneconomical. A pack of powder (Domolovsky) lasts for 3 months (mine at least once a day), and a rinse aid lasts for a year.

[Scarlett]

Scarlett, Thank you! Tanyusha, but not in the know how much powder is finished grinding now? And another nuance - if you take Domol powder, then you need a rinse aid and salt? How much are they about now? And then there is no Watson nearby, you have to go to the city center purposefully, and the car has not even been brought yet)))

And another nuance - if you take Domol powder, then you need a rinse aid and salt?

What is the connection ??))
Of course not! Salt in general must be exactly the same for all manufacturers and consist exclusively of salt, and whoever uses the rinse should choose according to their taste-smell-drying quality.

Yulchik, here's the word - no idea! I stocked up at the beginning of the year for a promotion so that at least another six months would be enough, and now I can't leave the house for a couple of days - they are finishing the heating! If not in a hurry - the day after tomorrow, maybe I'll get out. I personally liked Finish salt more, but it was twice as expensive with less quantity, it was larger. The girls wrote about some kind of Belarusian, there seems to be good large crystals, dissolves more slowly and lasts longer. So you can safely take everything different - and then you yourself will slowly decide what you like more. And be sure to buy everything for the arrival of a new guest - you can start the tady immediately and enjoy! I still remember my delight - I washed a box of dishes, I changed my mind about giving away to the village - everything is like new! I was especially impressed by the glasses - the old model, but after the car they played like crystal

[Bijou]

Bijou, Helen, I've met reviews that rinse without powder leaves stains, etc. Somehow they wrote that.
Maybe it seemed to people)

Scarlett, Well, you stocked up)))) I already dream at night about how I wash something there)))

Scarlett, Okay, you stocked up)))) I already dream at night about me washing something there)))

I'm a bastard myself! Such is I a thrifty rat, if I have a dumb stock - and my mood is at zero And I know for sure that there is another unaccounted pack of powder lying around somewhere - I could only find it, after the repair half of the property is shoved into some secret corners
And at night ngado to sleep - let the machine work for us!

I'm a bastard myself! Such is I a thrifty rat, if I have a dumb stock - and my mood is at zero And I know for sure that there is another unaccounted pack of powder lying around somewhere - I could only find it, after the repair half of the property is shoved into some secret corners
And at night ngado to sleep - let the machine work for us!

Here it is with me! It was packed so that I don't even remember how much I have and what! We arrive at the store, walk through the ranks of the household, ask the price, I’ll stretch out my hands, take a thread, and then I don’t take it !!! This is how I save money! First, really invested

[Tatyana]

Such is I a thrifty rat, if I have a lot of stock - and my mood is at zero

Tatyana, Olga, also the same, stocked up, now live well and life is good. I remember how one woman I knew said, if the dishes in the kitchen are clean, then the house seems to be clean. Therefore, I stock up on all sorts of means so that at any time I can get it and wash it and my soul is calmer

Girls, about a year ago I bought Faberlik gel. Liked it SO! Thick, like jelly, does not flow into the tray, but flakes off straight. And recently I bought it-fuuu. Liquid like shampoo. Who else used it?

I!!! I take it regularly, it is like jelly, it flops down in pieces of the required volume. I use it every other time, because it washes everything perfectly except the tea bloom! Therefore, I alternate with other means.

Very strange ... I also liked the first bottle ...
Can contact the main office. Although what will it do? I already bought it.

[iris.ka]

iris.ka, and maybe there will be some result.

I once bought candy, made coffee and sat down at the computer. I bite off a candy - but it turned out to be such disgusting. I immediately, as they say, without leaving the checkout, that is, from the computer, found the manufacturer's address on the wrapper. Well, I wrote to them about it.
They immediately responded to me, asked what and how, where I bought it. And then, as an apology, they sent a parcel of all kinds of sweets of their production, they turned out to be tasty by the way.

Sometimes complaints to higher authorities even give very good results ...

Not at all about the kitchen, but on the topic: Not so long ago I went to the Rostelecom office to make a payment, the time is 16-35, two ladies are sitting, there are zero people, playing solitaire .. They don't want to take the payment, they already, they say, have removed the cash register. She was indignant, rudely politely, like: we, of course, will take it, but you will have to wait ... wait a long time ... about thirty minutes Here they are, honestly !! I sat down more comfortably and asked for a book of reviews, wrote a very colorful review, paid and set sail! The next day they called from Moscow, apologized, reported that the whole shift was devoid of bonuses, and as compensation I was offered a 30% discount on all services received for a period of three months I use ...

You directly inspire me to feats. Okay, I'll sleep off the night shift and call. There seems to be a free phone.

[Dishwasher nano bag]

And someone used such a tool for PMM: Dishwasher nano bag (The bag is rated for 1000 uses, which is 3 years of daily use)? I found not very positive reviews on the Internet