Bread makers Panasonic SD-2500, SD-2501, SD-2502, SD-2510, SD-2511, SD-2512 ... (4)

[Anyutok]

Anyutok, A similar case in our village



There are no them at all in St. Petersburg. Only the store is inside. ru writes available, but as far as I remember it was a razvodilovo!

Ozone canceled the bread maker, no supplier

A similar case in our village

It's a pity how. But there was something suspicious about the price.

Svetochka, the price of ozone can be very low, it looks like when stocks are being sold, I bought a so-so cartoon Redmond-01 for less than 2tyr, but now they are not there, but similar ones are from 6tyr
Okay, we'll wait or we'll buy it for mom ...
Now I started to bake rye bread, at first, when weighing products, on flour, the scales turned off, I had to pour it over my eye. Now I was adding oil, I pour oil in the middle of the batch, for some reason I like it so much, I dropped the lid into the bucket, I barely fished it out, I quickly mixed it with HP. I wonder what else awaits me ... "God loves trinity"

But there was something suspicious about the price.

Yes, it confused me too. Too cheap to be true I'll go tomorrow 2510 model in RBT for 8690 rubles to buy.

My mother said to wait ... I bake bread for them, so for now they have enough ...

[fffuntic]

fffuntic, Lena, here is my first PANCAKE (which is lumpy) fermented.

$ vetLana, Svetik, I'm sorry, I saw your question late.

But it is very difficult.
1. The volume of the product depends on two main factors.
- gas holding capacity of flour.
- the gas-generating ability of yeast.
For a short standard fermentation time, these forces are usually enough for a good volume, but when it is long ...
then you cannot influence flour in any way.
But for yeast - you can try to increase their amount and give them more sugar in the recipe. Well, they should be capable of long life and gas formation.

Look, you did everything right. You revived the yeast. Then, healthy and cheerful, they hit the dough.
There they first began to accumulate food for themselves, then gas. Well, the dough began to cool slowly.
When the dough is cooled, the yeast also slows down. After you've kneaded the cold dough, you should understand that there won't be a quick rise as in a warm one. Yeast is working slowly now.
Since they almost stopped working after the kneading, it means that the cooling was very strong, the yeast completely bit down. To enhance their work, either there must be a lot of them, or they must be more resistant to cold, or wait until the gas slowly accumulates again. Or in the refrigerator, store the dough in the warmest zone so that the sissies live warmer.
Sometimes very empty flour comes across. There is not enough nutrition for the yeast for a long time and there is little sweetness in the recipe.
Or .. it's about flour. She ceased to hold your gas properly over time, more than one run-in does not withstand. This is already worse.
You pulled out the dough, heated it up.
There is a subtle point here - the dough from the inside must warm up to about 30 degrees, so that the yeast warms up and properly revives and starts to gas again at full strength, if that's what you want.
Therefore, it is not entirely clear ... how did you track the rise ...
If you heated the dough correctly, to a good warm state inside, and achieved a high, good proofing visually, and the bread came out low, then flour is to blame. I didn't do it. You yourself understand - the yeast did its job, but the flour spat out all the gas during baking.
It may well be the case with the central lock. It contains active enzymes that weaken gluten over time.
Nothing to do.There is no way you can beat the power of flour.
It is necessary to bake after the first rise, or even reduce the fermentation time.

But if you began to bake semi-cold bread, if you achieved a little rise, then figs knows. Maybe yeast is to blame. They did not wake up to the end or they are not enough for a quick secondary cold gas accumulation.

In short ... if you had a wonderful rise before baking, as always, and the bread came out low, flour is to blame. Peks after the first ascent. Ce la vie. Doesn't pull cold long-term proofing.
You can cut down more yeast so that it stands longer until the first rise. You yourself understand that such a situation does not tolerate any longer. But not the fact that it will help. If there over time the gluten is greatly weakened, then nothing can be done. Time is evil.

You have very little room for maneuver. Increase-decrease yeast and truncation. If you need to speed up the rise, you need more yeast or heat.

Here only in practice can you determine.
1, You heated the dough and it rose well - the bread is low. The flour is to blame - it spat out all the gas, could not hold back. Reduce fermentation time. Loosen the gluten mixture even more. Bake after the first rise. Flour dictates its terms.
Well, there are all sorts of acids and improvers added to chemically enhance the flour. But this already changes the taste and recipe unpredictably. We're not in the laboratory.
2. You bake in a semi-cold state - something with the rise is incomprehensible. Yeast may not work as well. Here you can increase the yeast a little and at the same time feed in the form of sugar (fig knows, maybe the flour fell for a little sweetness and there is not enough food for a long time) to look at the result. If it doesn’t change, flour is to blame again. Again, as in the first paragraph.

Peks after the first ascent.

Lena, I'll try this.

Helen, as always - many thanks. If not for your posts, I might not have baked a lot.
I didn’t expect, but you answered.

At the family council, they finally decided to take the sd-2501. Tomorrow I'll go to redeem for 10499

[Anyutok]

Anyutok, Good luck!)

[Svetik.]

Svetik.

Specifically according to your recipe.

Made a gorgeous dough in HP programmatically. It is almost already ready. Theoretically, right after the program, you can proof and bake in the standard version.
We decide to improve it by cold fermentation.
But we only have a weak CH and we do not need to bring it to a ripe state in the refrigerator, already HP tried.
In fact, we no longer need a rise in the refrigerator, but only for baking.
Do you understand?
It makes sense to cool the HP dough as soon as possible. Spread itto cool quickly in the refrigerator. And ... try not to bring it to a strong rise in the refrigerator. If it continues to grow - twice - not higher !!!! - rose - crush. If allow strong fermentation with a rise in the refrigerator - rather bake immediately after rising, and you can even bake it cold. You can then not keep the dough additionally warm, loading it with fermentation.
HP has already fermented and kneaded, we only need to let the cold bacteria work, not the yeast.

That is, from 0 to 10 hours, according to your description, it was necessary to knead at least once or twice. No maximum climb. No gluten overload. The refrigerator does not need a lift at all.

If you do everything right and you have there will be no growth dough in the refrigerator - then you can ideally do -
well let the dough heat up and let the usual good proofing. But not full, but half. The flour is weak. Can you after good heating from the inside, give even weaker proofing. But heating from the inside must be mandatory.
Do you understand - why exactly?
HP has already issued almost ready !!!! dough on the weak !!! flour. Therefore, then we can quickly preserve it without stress, only with the accumulation of tasty substances in the refrigerator. Then let the yeast come to life in the warmth and begin to gas just before baking, heating with dough and proofing - that is, a symptom of normal yeast functioning, and bake.

The stronger the dough rises in the refrigerator for the second time, the weaker the proofing should be given after heating the dough, or even the cold oven. To do not overwork... And if you cool the dough quickly without excessive rise, then you can give a proofer higher. It will be tastier with proofing and heating, provided that the dough has not stood in the refrigerator.

Shine if the flour is strong and the dough is raw, not nearly ready, then the approach to the refrigerator is different. There the dough should ripen.
Should ripen raw dough.

You put yeast in the dough, it fermented a little in the heat - (or did not ferment)))), - then make a hot batch), and sent it to the refrigerator. There for 8-10 hours it grew to the maximum and stalledbut not disgraced. The main word here is maximum and necessarily without subsidence, that is, degradation. Truncated .. and wandered and grew completely. Enough. The dough is ripe. Fermented and already developed.

Now you don't need any more growth before baking. You crush him and let him sit. What does not grow is well... So cold. Now, if it continues to grow, then you need to monitor and re-wrinkle so that the gluten does not break.

Secondary growth is needed either only in proofing, or in the oven, if you bake cold immediately.
When baked with heating and proofing, it tastes better and requires less yeast.
Heat the inside to 30 degrees and let it stand for normal normal fermentation. Well, we in HP can cram into a regular program.

When baking immediately in a cold state, more yeast may be required, they also sleep and will work half-heartedly.

Flour must withstand such a mockery, and the amount of yeast should be enough for the rise.

But your recipe is different.
There, at the exit from Xn, it is almost ready-made dough on low flour. You don't need to develop gluten already, that is, lifting in the refrigerator is not needed. We just need to diversify the taste.
Well, before baking, revive the dormant yeast, again without overloading the gluten.



If the quality of the bread does not improve without overloading the gluten, then, without options, it is necessary to reduce the standing time in the refrigerator or reduce the amount of CZ in the recipe.
This means that the composition of the flour is not resistant to long fermentation even in the cold.




more .. if not laziness, then spread the warm dough from HP and send it to the freezer for about 10 minutes, if not laziness. The bottom line is to cool the dough as soon as possible and slow down the yeast and any destructive warm processes after the HP program. Then let it sit in the refrigerator and not grow at all. So that only cold processes work. It should grow normally only in proofing before baking.



Or .. in another way.
Stick the dough straight with the KOMOM from the HP after the program, let it continue to ferment intensively in the refrigerator.
But then how only it will grow two-three times in the refrigerator - at once for baking, you can even cold.

It's faster and more convenient. Although it can lose to taste.
You understand what the point is: to allow it to rise again with a parallel accumulation of taste in the cold. These cold processes, of course, not quite the same as with good cooling of the dough, but still partially cold.
In this case, the secondary rise in the refrigerator is equated to proofing and baking goes right away. You can let it warm up a little. But you have to watch out so that there is no outgrowth. If it continues to grow in the warmth - run to bake
Whichever method you choose, do not let the dough grow in the refrigerator more than 2-2.5 times, well, 3 maximum. Do not bring to maximum tension. Crush much earlier. Specifically in your recipe with CZ.

Girls! and unsuccessful bread can somehow be used? except to dry the croutons
Speckled the other day .. and well, it didn't work out ...

it is impossible to climb into the kitchen in a sick state or without a mood

I bought yesterday 2501. While it is in the box. I set myself a condition - until I do general cleaning in the kitchen, do not unpack the bread maker. So that the incentive was ...

[Mirabel]

So that the incentive was ...

Congratulations!



Mirabel, Vika, I always have crackers ...
Finely chop, sprinkle with herbs ~ seasonings, salt or a bit of sugar and put in the oven for a while.
The son takes to work for tea.
I don't know where anymore ...

[Vika]

Vika, well, you can add partially to the cutlets. But you can't put the whole bun in there.

you can partially add to the cutlets

If it's white, then yes, just like cutlets! You can also (if you use it), grind into breading and pour into a jar!

You can make French toast.

[Vika]

Vika, the girls have already advised to mince. And there is also a recipe for a classic charlotte:

Charlotte with apples (from a loaf) (Vilapo)

I bought yesterday 2501. While it is in the box. I set myself a condition - until I do general cleaning in the kitchen, do not unpack the bread maker. So that the incentive was ...

It must be different.
Unpack the bread maker and bake French bread with milk and butter, or Natasha's with whey
And then allow yourself to bake the second bread only after harvesting. Then, for sure, this cleaning will come very soon

Girls! and unsuccessful bread can somehow be used? except to dry the croutons
Speckled the other day .. and well, it didn't work out ...

it is impossible to climb into the kitchen in a sick state or without a mood

Well, the birds also need something
for me, it's just breading all over the place. And in everything else - we are dumb. You put in effort - and it may still not turn out tasty because of the tasteless additive.
Sometimes it's best not to be greedy.

It must be different.
Unpack the bread maker and bake French bread in milk and butter, or Natasha's in whey
And then allow yourself to bake the second bread only after harvesting. Then, for sure, this cleaning will come very soon

I also wanted to write something like this ...
In a slightly different way:
It is necessary to set the HP, put the Bread to bake and while it is baking ... Finish cleaning! And then drink some tea!

[fffuntic]

fffuntic, mamusi, thanks for the advice: girl_haha: Today I only had enough strength for the upper part of the kitchen. : crazy: Tomorrow morning I will put, however, French and will do the lower classes. Come in 6 hours I will manage

don't put French empty, but be sure to choose a recipe with a little baking or with whey.
Let the most ordinary one be later. He is already an amateur.
This mode is very good for any delicious recipe. The bread is very crispy.
But in general, it is possible in the usual mode to speed up and familiarize yourself at the beginning with any recipe with milk and butter. It will be delicious.

Tomorrow morning I’ll put on French, however, and go to the lower classes. Come in 6 hours I will manage

Baked
Wheat-rye bread with whole grain flour "Krestyansky" # 18

Apart from Panifarin, everything is according to Sasha's prescription. I was not enthusiastic. The tastes are different.
I don't think it can be "Childhood Bread". IMHO

[Sveta]

Sveta,

Well, look, there is 50x50 wheat flour and half of its weakening substances. Especially important is the rye additive, which completely weakens, therefore, without panifirin - that is, the reinforcement with gluten, the taste can suffer dramatically.
And there are so many ingredients in the recipe that are critical in quality.
1. CZ - should be fresh, peeled rye - too. It is generally difficult with rye flour. It tastes so different, it tastes delicious, depending on the freshness and the manufacturer.
Peeled rye is in the middle between seeded and wallpaper. Wallpaper adds more flavor, but it also spoils the wheat gluten more.
Well, this type of malt needs fermented, red, as I understand it, as a flavoring additive for rye breads. As well as maltose syrup. All this will add nuances of taste. It is tastier and sweeter with them than without them.
It is from them that rye breads have such a leavened - burnt-sugar taste.
Powdered milk is also needed fresh.
BUT ... milk powder, non-bakery which is special- but we don't sell this, it also weakens gluten.
In short, whatever one may say,
you should bake the recipe one more time.
Shove all the same gluten, choose wheat flour stronger.
CZ and rye are tastier. If you take wallpaper it will not be worse, it is just that without panifirin it is definitely impossible then.
It is better not to neglect malt and maltose; at worst, shove the wort from the kvass concentrate.
This taste of sweetness is also imparted by the yummy for yeast.
Then you will make complete conclusions.

It should be a wheat bread with a rye slant. Moreover, with a sufficiently elastic crumb.

If wheat flour is long-lasting and without panifirin, it had to be done with pre-mix on dumplings.In this recipe, it is very important to extract the maximum strength from the wheat flour. The whole frame is made of it.
In fact .. the dietary regimen is not so important, you can basically do it with panifirin, but give the wheat flour enough time to swell if it is long-lasting. Otherwise, the taste will suffer greatly.

Well, this kind of malt needs fermented

I put that malt. Baked in fresh milk + water. V. s. I have a good one now. CZ and rye medium.
I can't buy Panifarin now.

you should bake the recipe one more time.

I will note to myself - bake with panifarin.
The gingerbread man was cool. Sasha wrote that a rye comb should be used, but I had the usual one. HP was hard to knead.

[wheat]

Actually, this recipe has classic proportions. For complete happiness, there is not enough acidification with kefir, beer or an additive in the form of prunes, and so on.
Should be delicious, actually.

Look and compare, which we all love,
Wheat-rye bread with prunes and pumpkin seeds
https://Mcooker-enn.tomathouse.com/index.php@option=com_smf&topic=219607.0

there the sour component strengthens the flour and prevents rye flour from spoiling wheat flour and a little more wheat flour, so it is easier to do without panifirin.

And in your case, less wheat flour and no acid. There it is necessary to preserve the strength of wheat flour and panifirin is desperately needed, that is, dopgluten.





To be honest, I don't expect more flavor from this recipe than from our favorite with prunes.
But for the purity of the experiment, you can also try it. If you are doing it with fresh milk, then .. first of all, do not be lazy then shove the boiled. Secondly, it would be necessary to count so that the milk component would be the same, this is a nuance of tenderness in taste.

Thirdly ... on a kolobok.
This is the purest wheat- rye dough with 0.25 percent rye flour. The rest is wheat + CZ. From what Budun there should be a very dense dough, I don't understand.
Slightly denser than usual with the addition of rye.
The wheat component should get moisture behind the eyes and swell. I don’t think that a normal regular neat bun will spoil the bread.
Look at the resulting bread. If the density suits you, then do so. And if it is dense, increase the moisture.

Look and compare, which we all love, Wheat-rye bread with prunes and pumpkin seeds

I haven't baked this yet. Are prunes and seeds important or is it possible without them?

[Ritusya]

Well, I didn't bake with seeds either, and I didn't put in mustard oil either, but just sunflower oil, and with prunes - like a candy. To me Ritusya showed this bread.
Very tasty, but as a dessert it goes, not for the soup for my taste))))
Although .. if the sweetness is reduced, the additives are removed ... it becomes the usual tasty from mixed types of flour.
Kolobok is the most usual wrinkle, with a soft ball, at the end of kneading without smearing, and normal bread is obtained.

A lot of people have baked this bread here.
The composition is winning. And flour of different types, and there is sourness to curb rye flour.
And the bun should depend on the quality of the flour purchased. As I understand it, you need to start with a normal kolobok at the end of the batch, not the softest one like a comma, but just a neat ball. And there to look - to reduce or increase moisture.
Dense dough is for rye flour. And wheat loves moisture. There is a lot of wheat here, so if you don't add moisture, it will be tasteless

Ritus, and what kind of bun was you?

Well, the birds also need something

aha! so I gave them to them, All the ducks of the pond were near me.

Girls! and unsuccessful bread can somehow be used? except to dry the croutons

I liked freezing the ripened bread I also freeze the remaining pieces, crusts ... When I have enough accumulated, I defrost this sobiruha overnight in the refrigerator, if there is room, which is rare, or in a microscope in a quick way. Then everything in a combiin and in a crumb. I pour this crumb into a box with a lid, and back into the freezer. The crumb, even if it freezes in a lump, easily crumbles with little effort and you can take the right amount for any purpose. I often do here THESE pancakes but a little differently (I add bread crumbs instead of bread).Breading again - the crumb is ready! In some cases, I can replace semolina with crumbs.
That is, ready-made crumb in the freezer is convenient and can be stored for a long time. While in use, the pieces are already being collected to prepare a fresh portion of the crumb!

I am reporting. I cleaned the working half of the kitchen, took out a panasik and put on the oven for milk bread, now I have 4 hours to finish cleaning and taste the first bread

[Anna]

Anna, I had to put French

[Sedne]

Sednelong strong.

My parents had the 206th Panasonic, I found the recipe for "Butter Orange Bread" in the instructions, although the orange is not mentioned in the recipe. He burned in the 206th Panaonica and in his own (I have 255). This recipe is for the "sandwich" program, the program lasts 4 hours, and in my oven I baked in the main mode. Delicious bread turns out! Yes, and it took less water ~ 280ml.

[Helena]

The bread is ready. The daughter did not give him a rest, demanded to urgently give her a crust. He says it's delicious. A bun with 400 g of flour in the same height as 600 g from Redmond 1905, while soft and airy, and not "brick"



Helena, I once had an LG bread maker, there in the recipe book, in my opinion, there was such bread, on orange juice. But I never baked.

The daughter did not give him a rest, demanded to urgently give her a crust.

Yes, it’s impossible to resist. When I pass hot bread to my parents on a passing electric train (they return home from their dacha), they do not stand the same - they break off and grump right in the train, and all the other passengers swallow saliva. Mom now asks me to cut off a couple of pieces in advance, so that it would be cut evenly, and not break at random

[Anyutok]

Anyutokbut the recipe doesn't mention orange at all, liquid is water. Maybe you missed some candied fruit or a typo? But it's not that important, just thinking out loud.

Ritusya showed me this bread.

Yes, I am!
It's nothing you can do!
I love this bread. I don't put pumpkin seeds. While without them. Sunflower, or sesame seeds.
Prunes are always aaa!
Or you can have large blue raisins. And yes, of course it's not for soup !!! What a soup, are you "crazy" ... Well this cake turns out. I walk and slap my hands to stop it to eat there is!

But everyone's tastes are different, I look, he didn't suit the others!

[Natasha]

Natasha, you are not soaking slices of bread, but ground croutons? Am I getting it right?

ready-made crumb in the freezer is convenient and can be stored for a long time. While in use, the pieces are already being collected to prepare a fresh portion of the crumb!

Ritus, what kind of bun was you?

Lenus, with a skirt. I make wheat ~ rye and rye ~ wheat with yubocheya. So juicier!
Oh, reminded ... I want it again.
Well, wait at home ~ he's not! Give him from Talia "Daily" and Darnitsky from Fugaska (but with my modification)))

to what it came to ... I cut my finger (already pah-pah, better he), so the muSh attached the recipe of these breads with tape and bakes himself: such a day, another day! Baldee!

[Ritochka]

bakes himself

Ritochka, my husband will slowly take the stove from you

Ritochka, your husband will slowly take the stove from you

I'm afraid myself, Lud !!!

[mamusi]

mamusi, Rituel, what wonderful helpers you have: they cut apples for pie, bake bread.
Natasha, you need to throw your frozen recipe into Temka with useful tips. Is there such a thing?
I really liked your version. The main thing is not to go rancid and the crumbs will always be fresh.

[mamusi]

mamusi,

My husband has mastered a small cartoon, I had to buy a second bowl, otherwise he sometimes wants not milk porridge in the morning, but rice and curry, and I can't do it without oatmeal and milk. My personal drug is hercules-dependent. does not break, the more rye bread still needs to be looked at and corrected

and I can't live without oatmeal with milk, my personal drug, I am a Herculean addict

sIstraaa! Straight in many ways ...

Because I have Phillips fiberboard ~ baby boil porridge for the morning!

[Ritochka]

sIstraaa! Straight in many ways ...

Ritochka,

well, you and I seem to have understood for a long time

[crumb]

Natasha, you are not soaking slices of bread, but ground croutons? Am I getting it right?

Yes, I'm soaking crumb, which I make from just bread, do not dry, but store in the freezer so that it does not deteriorate

[Nataenka]

Nataenka, I realized, oh, I have a sorely lack of space in the freezers. We need to invent something, because, as you say, it is very convenient to store the breading and does not go rancid!

[Svetik]

and even cooler if you start a vacuum sealer. And store in sachets in a vacuum. In such bags and just in the refrigerator, products lie for a long time.
I had a pump with jar lids at one time. I liked it. Thing is not superfluous if a lot of food remains.
No tastes or smells.
And as a quick marinator could be used.



Svetik, pay attention.

Lenus, with a skirt. I make wheat ~ rye and rye ~ wheat with yubocheya. So juicier!
Oh, reminded ... I want it again.

I'll try it too, as good as I asked.

even cooler if you start a vacuum sealer. And store in sachets in a vacuum.

yes, probably Len.
I do not have. I'll start with the freezer.

[fffuntic]

and even cooler if you start a vacuum sealer. And store in sachets in a vacuum. In such bags and just in the refrigerator, products lie for a long time.

There is a vacuum device, there is no room in the freezer, so vacuum it up and store it in the refrigerator. fffuntic, thanks for the idea