Bread makers Panasonic SD-2500, SD-2501, SD-2502 (3)

that is, if I want rye bread is it better to look at the manual settings?

Added Saturday 10 Dec 2016 06:33 PM

Panas seems to have a program for rye bread ...

In Panasova program for rye setting for yeast. And sometimes there is not enough time for proofing. It is generally difficult with sourdough. But you can ...

Yes, automatic. When there is a manual one, you can set different times for kneading, proofing and baking. In Panas, rye bread is baked in one program. If you want to change something, then this is dances with tambourines.

This is just manual programming and there are these same dances with tambourines. A tempting marketing ploy that makes the equipment more expensive. We passed, we know (I have a second HP Kenwood with the ability to create my own programs). This toy gets boring very quickly. Moreover, rye bread always requires keeping an eye on itself, well, there will never be a full automatic machine with it.
Therefore, simply on Panas, there can be two options:
1. Rye bread program, nevertheless checking how the bread came up, and, if not enough, interrupt the program, give extra time for proving and turn on baking.
2. Make only kneading, n / a interrupting the rye program, or simply knead on dumplings. Further optional:
leave to go to the HP and then turn on the baking,
transfer the dough, distance and bake in the oven.

thanks for the info, now I'm in doubt

What kind of doubt?
If you need high-quality HP, take Panas.

perhaps all the same, yes, Panas ...)

As I understand it, 2511 differs from 2501 in the presence of the "low-yeast bread" mode. How much will I lose if I take 2501? It is possible to replace it with some other mode, does the 2501 have something similar?

[Yelenka_M]

Yelenka_M, Panasonic's automatic programs are very good. The bucket is good. The spatula does not remain inside the bread after baking.

Added Saturday 10 Dec 2016 11:06 PM

Gingi, m. b. Dietary? I have to ask the owners of 2501.

As I understand it, 2511 differs from 2501 in the presence of the "low-yeast bread" mode. How much will I lose if I take 2501? It is possible to replace it with some other mode, does the 2501 have something similar?

I have 2502. I use either dietary (5 hours) or French (6 hours), depending on the room temperature, taking 3/4 of the yeast norm for the main bread recipe. In the morning, when the stove was heated (we are at the dacha) - 5 hours. I put it in French for the night. In summer, when it's hot, - 1/2 the norm of yeast and French bread for the program.

And what is the difference between French and low-yeast? Does the time seem to be the same?

Have fr. can not choose size and crust

Added Saturday 10 Dec 2016 11:52 PM

Fr. 6 o'clock

And what is the difference between French and low-yeast? Does the time seem to be the same?

Ingredients

[Yelenka_M]

Ingredients

But no. In principle, you can bake similar recipes in both French and low-yeast. The main difference is in the total duration of the program and the duration of the processes. More specifically, from the instructions in comparison with the French (low-yeast in brackets, spreads - depending on the room temperature): leveling 40 minutes - 2 hours (30-60 minutes), kneading 10-20 minutes (15-30 minutes), lifting 2 hours. 45min-4h 10min (2h 40min - 2h 50min), baking the same 55 min. Total 6 hours (4 hours 50 minutes). I like the low-yeast bread because you can get tasty bread an hour earlier, and even pour less yeast (the stomach is sick), besides, you can set the size of the roll and the color of the crust on it. Italian bread is also excellent on low-yeast (although I usually sprinkle 2/3 tsp of yeast there). The dietary regime is different, there the temperature leveling out is indecently large (according to the instructions, 1 hour - 1 hour 40 minutes). In general, given the lack of a programming function, the larger the choice of programs, the better. The difference in price used to be minimal (my 2510 was cheaper than 2500 when I bought it).
Yelenka_MDo you need 100% rye or just want "black"? If the second option, then dancing with tambourines is not necessary even for 2500, just pick up the recipe and it will be completely "black" even with 30% rye flour.

But no

We are talking about someone who does not have 2511 or 2512, that is, in principle, there is no low-yeast program.
In the morning I took off 13g milk with live yeast (instead of 18g according to the recipe) on the 8th program. I use live yeast (I multiply by three according to the recipe), because there is a problem with good dry ones. There are always living ones.

🔗

I forgot to write that I replaced 100g of wheat flour with 100g of rye.

[nata_zvezda]

nata_zvezda, I understand that Gingi, also chooses a bread machine model and is interested in the possibilities of MODES, not RECIPES. If we discuss recipes, then I will not argue - in the French mode, you can bake a "French" recipe from the instructions and make it in low-yeast by unauthorized decrease in the amount of yeast, and write it down at the same time in the bran by adding a couple of tablespoons of the corresponding substance)) And bread you've got a pretty one! On the contrary, I still use dry yeast, because I doubt the quality and liveliness of others (taking into account the conditions in which they are in the windows), but it's too lazy to check.

Veronica agrees with you. If you buy a new one, then buy a new modification. But, probably, many still take into account the price. We, of course, adapt to our outdated ones))) Buy of course Panasonic.
We sell quality live yeast. And dry, namely instant, buy a problem. I don't want to risk it either. Although I calculated, baked goods are cheaper with dry ones.

[Natalia]

We are talking about someone who does not have 2511 or 2512, that is, in principle, there is no low-yeast program.

Natalia, You are wrong.
I have 2511, there is a low-yeast mode, my favorite mode, I bake almost everything on it.

Svetlana, read the post carefully. I'm talking about 2501 and 2502. I know that there is low-yeast in 2511 and 2512.

[nata_zvezda]

nata_zvezda,

[VENIKA]

VENIKA, everything is correct, as long as I choose and try to understand what I will lose if I take an older model. Relatives asked me to pick up and buy them a not very expensive stove, but for me it is a dark forest.
I choose from used. 2501 sold several pieces and they cost about one and a half to two times cheaper than 2511. Hence the questions.
The modes seem to be similar, French is there and there. As far as low-yeast is in demand, someone wrote that bread on it is different from bread in French.
If you put less yeast and bake in French, you get the same thing as with low yeast, but it will take more time?
I've already looked after myself, I will take 2511 as soon as I find a place in the kitchen. And the problem with relatives, suddenly I choose the wrong ...

Galina, can I answer you, my personal IMHO. I, as I already wrote 2502. At my neighbor in the country (only with her filing I bought HB) last year the stove flew. I advised her only Panasonic. She bought 2512. Having tasted it low-yeast, she wondered how to bake such one at home. I read her instructions, the difference was, in principle, in a decrease by 1/4 of the yeast norm and an increase in time by 1 hour. I began to stay. And she stopped at the French regime. It suited me very much. But I take into account the temperature in the room. In the summer I even take half the yeast norm. Now, when the temperature in the kitchen sometimes reaches 10 grams. (until we melt the oven) I take 3/4 of the rate and the French mode. When we heat the oven, then 3/4 of the yeast rate and the dietary regime. I just already feel when and how much. We already have experience. so if it’s price, don’t bother, take whichever is cheaper. An experienced baker will bake fine bread in the simplest oven.
The same is with me with multicooker. I have 4 of them. At the simplest one you can cook no worse than the most sophisticated one. Now it became clear to me that in MV it is not the number of programs that is important, but the ability to change the time and temperature during cooking. Sorry, Ostap has suffered.
Only experience will teach you how to bake bread. After I got HB, we don't buy it in the store.And pies, and pizza, khachapuri and so on and so forth ... Although many people have it unclaimed on the shelf.
Dispensaries (and they do not bother me at all) also do not play a big role. Put yeast on the bottom, either dry or live, and no problem. I chose 2502 only because of the stainless steel. I have a CF in a stainless steel case.

[Gingi]

Gingi, The overwhelming majority of modes really coincide for all models (for those ending in 1 or 2 + rye, in 10 and older + low-yeast and + with a filling (little in demand and strange), the rest is all the same). If the difference in price is so significant, it is better to take a used 2501, only when buying, inspect the bucket with a spatula for chips / scratches and, probably, ask to turn on the kneading mode to check how it interferes and whether the spatula is not warped (here I am not the best advisor , search through the search - the forum had advice on how to check, but I don't remember where). In the French mode, the low-yeast recipe is really baked without problems, it just takes 1 hour more and you cannot choose the size, color of the roll (the last 2 points are completely unimportant - the roll is quite large and the crust is always perfect without any choice). If relatives do not have serious stomach problems and fastidious taste, they will probably most often use the "basic" mode - quite tasty bread in 4 hours and the vast majority of recipes (including from the forum) are perfect for it.

The number of programs increases the cost of both HP and Multicooker. This is a standard trick, in fact that many are not used, others are generally mysterious. Low-yeast from the same series. Any bread will rise to a certain size only when the yeast in it multiplies to a certain concentration. These are common chemistry and biology. If they were initially put less, they will multiply longer until the time when th is enough. So, such bread will be low-yeast only in terms of consumption of purchased yeast, and not their total amount in bread. And for people they make an advertising move and profit on the sale of something new, as it were: some kind of useful name. There are a lot of such razvodilov on sale, because people really want something good.
There are also modes that can be safely removed, they are not used.

in fact, so many of them are not used, others are generally mysterious. Low yeast from the same series

I strongly disagree. Even if you do not go into the intricacies of fermentation (which depends not only on time), the low-yeast mode is banally longer than the main mode (which gives, using your terminology, "yeast multiply to a certain concentration", although "The purpose of fermentation is the accumulation of flavoring and aromatic substances in semi-finished products and dough and bringing the dough in terms of gas-forming ability and physical properties to the best condition for cutting and baking" (Quote from the information portal "Pishevik"), besides, the rate of doubling the number of yeast cells is like at least 2 hours at +33 (at a different temperature - up to 5 hours), therefore, they do not have much chance to multiply to a teaspoon in the time available to them in a bread maker))), but in fact - really allows you to use 0.5 tsp. instead of 1h. l. dry yeast. The use of the dietary regimen for such purposes is less acceptable - there all the processes are almost similar in duration to the "main" one, only the temperature equalization is very long, which gives a total of 5 hours). Of course, using the French mode allows you to achieve similar or better results, but, you know, it is not always convenient for me to spend an extra hour on this. And believe the old gastritis - the difference in the amount of yeast is really noticeable.

[an_domini]

I fully subscribe to what Olga said an_domini, the biochemistry of the fermentation process has not yet been canceled. Yes, and yeast in a live form in bread does not remain, only the protein "shell" Saccharomycetes yeast in unfavorable conditions can form spores, but when it reaches 70 ° C, even yeast spores die.
The temperature of the inner layers of the crumb during the baking process reaches 96-98 ° C.At this temperature, the normal yeast microflora almost completely dies. 🔗
Another thing is the acidity of bread, which increases, with an increase in the initial laying of yeast, that's what the ventricles feel.

Here, the Guru came and put everything in its place!
Thank you!
I also do not regret that I bought Panasik five years ago. Even without a low-yeast mode, in French, it bakes excellent bread! Yes, and basically normal. I knead rye in HP, bake in a slow cooker. Let it be a little more fuss, but the result is excellent!

the biochemistry of the fermentation process has not yet been canceled

Actually, I tried to prove that it affects the properties of bread in general and the amount of end products of fermentation in particular (regulated by the presence of salt and sugars in flour, including), and not trivial reproduction, and at the same time was included in the ranks of opportunists Or by my message can be assumed that, contrary to the laws of physics and logic, autoclaving has a beneficial effect on bacteria ?!

[Veronica]

VeronicaSo no one argues, we are about the regimes that manufacturers impose on us, which are often unjustified.

[Alexander]

Respected Alexander, risking to earn a reputation as a harmful bore, I agree with you only partially. In my humble view, regimes like "stuffed" are really some kind of curiosity unworthy of extra money. But "low-yeast" is really very good, it allows you to save an hour of time with results similar to the "French" and, as far as I know, is actively in demand not only by me (in fact, because of him, the whole dispute arose)

We are talking about someone who does not have 2511 or 2512, that is, in principle, there is no low-yeast program.
In the morning I took off 13g milk with live yeast (instead of 18g according to the recipe) on the 8th program. I use live yeast (I multiply by three according to the recipe), because there is a problem with good dry ones. There are always living ones.

🔗

I forgot to write that I replaced 100g of wheat flour with 100g of rye.

I bake only with fresh yeast. Which is luxury. I use it .. For 500g of flour I put 4-5 grams in total.
I do it in a mini sponge way, but I just threw everything and left, too.
My favorite type of Italian is the Elenki method65.

Good day!

Please tell me the height of Panasonic SD-2500, SD-2501, SD-2502 bread makers with the lid open?
For some reason, there is no such information in the characteristics, but there are suspicions that you will have to move it all the time to the edge of the countertop so as not to rest against the hanging cabinets.

Please tell me the height of Panasonic SD-2500, SD-2501, SD-2502 bread makers with the lid open?

For those without a dispenser (2500 for example) 61 cm, maybe +/- a couple of millimeters.

[Veronica]

Veronica, the dispenser does not affect the height when the lid is open, it remains behind ...
2501. The same 61 cm.

the dispenser does not affect the height with the lid open, it remains behind

Thanks for the clarification! There were such suspicions, but since I had not seen these models "live" for more than a year, and next to "without" and "with" and never at all, I did not dare to generalize

Hello everyone! After much thought and sleepless nights, I decided to buy HP Panasonic 2510 (thanks to this forum). Now I'm not overjoyed! I tried egg, milk, plain white and French bread. I didn't notice much difference, all are delicious! The husband says "peki without yeast", it is easy to say to someone who does not understand anything about this. I put an eternal sourdough on rye flour, but I don't expect an excellent result, I'm afraid it won't work the first time

CONGRATULATIONS ON YOUR GOOD SHOPPING !!! True, I am a biased person (I have the same one - a favorite toy) You will probably notice the difference over time - at first we also hated everything for joy, but now I want it, I don’t want it. , but judging by the large number of recipes and tips on this topic on the forum, over time everything will definitely turn out Successful to you buns in the New Year

yeast-free pitches

Matza and Armenian lavash will not work in KhP, if only the cake on soda, the rest of the bread is yeast.

I really want to bake a loaf (of course to taste, not in shape)))). About baking with handles and in the oven, I found milen recipes, but I did not find those adapted by Panasonic. Bad looking?
Please share the recipe or links in the topic.

Happy holidays everyone!
According to the instructions, I made bread completely from whole grain flour (we did not appreciate it, we decided that it was a helluva lot of expensive pleasure, I will continue to add 50-100 grams to the usual recipes), from the forum I tried the recipe for Darnitsa bread from fugaska (I also did not like it for our taste, I wanted more of a pronounced rye taste), from one site where they sell CP in the reviews I found Darnitsky's recipe (1.5 tsp. yeast, wheat flour 250 g, rye flour 150 g, salt 1 tsp., honey 1 tbsp. l ., olive oil 2 tbsp. l. water 300 ml) at first I liked it, but the roof was concave, baked the second time, I arbitrarily changed the proportions of wheat flour 225 g, rye 180 g and reduced the water to 270 ml, because there is no in my stove " rye "mode, I had to dance a little - I turned on the main mode, size L, then at around 2:05 I turned off the main mode and turned on the service mode for an hour, and after baking for 57 minutes, my son said that he didn't eat bread tastier, although the roof was again flat. I watched the kolobok, helped with the scapula, and my heart broke at the sight of this heavy dough compared to wheat dough.
During the holidays, friends came, tried the dairy and this experimental Darnitsky of mine, they said super tasty, they had to bake their experimental one with them again. A friend said that about 10 of her friends have different brands of HP (not Panas) and she tried bread and did not like it !!! and the owners themselves, having suffered for 1-2 months, removed these devices away. I persuaded to buy only Panasonic as a gift for her mother on DR!
I also baked custard bread with malt according to the recipe from the instructions using the technology described above, it turned out to be large with a perfectly flat roof to taste like Borodino bread. Made it low-yeast, we liked it. Our family does not eat very much bread, distributed almost everything to relatives, everyone is delighted, and my husband, looking at my experiments, said that he would not buy more flour (where will he go)
I plan to buy corn flour (it was my favorite bread from the store) and dough for pies from Chuchelka
While I'm baking everything on yeast Saf the moment suits me, but I read that it is tastier and healthier when fresh? I can't work with sourdough yet, I'm not that baker yet

The number of programs increases the cost of both HP and Multicooker. This is a standard trick, in fact that many are not used, others are generally mysterious. Low-yeast from the same series.

Without a bread maker with such a regime, you cannot say that. Since the dough not only rises in the bread maker, but the bread maker automatically crumbles it, and this in turn leads to better use of gluten and a better rise in the dough. So, first you need to count the number of strokes in normal mode and in yeast-free mode, and only then say that they are the same thing, only the time is different .... I am sure that not only the time has been increased, but the number of strokes has also been added. Remember, in the main mode, the oven interferes several times, only then the dough rises, and in the French bread mode, after the dough is allowed to stand and rise, there is an additional thorough kneading of the dough in the middle of the kneading mode, which leads to a dough decline and a new rise in the dough,

In Basic mode, there are two exercises.

Laaluu, I don't have the habit of blaming anyone and making conclusions from scratch!
What makes you think that I don't have something there, and even try to limit my right to express my opinion?
I have two Panas, 255.2502 and a programmable Kenwood 450, with HP I have been for 8 years. Enough experience to draw conclusions

The number of programs increases the cost of both HP and Multicooker. This is a standard trick, in fact, so many of them are not used, others are generally mysterious.

Olya, you are right, an increase in the number of programs increases the cost.But this is not out of the blue, at least because someone develops these programs, and someone implements it into the device itself, and it also increases production costs, etc., etc.
One person does not need so many programs, but the device was originally designed for masses. People are all different: with different tastes, different needs, restrictions and vice versa in bread products. For this calculation, to satisfy the maximum possible so that the device is in demand among a wider range of consumers and is bought. This is not a piece goods
Many different programs are not just coming up with, it's all for different breads. Taste, texture, color, crust thickness, satiety or lightness ... there is such a variety of programs for that. If you do not feel the difference or do not understand the essence, this does not mean that everything invented is nonsense.
I wonder, but why do you need 3 HP

And for people they make an advertising move and profit on the sale of something new, as it were: some kind of useful name. There are a lot of such razvodilov on sale, because people really want something good.

Yes, this is how they called the regime in Russian "low-yeast", and to some extent you are right that this is a publicity stunt, but not the fact that the Japanese made this regime for the sake of increasing the cost. Rather, they expanded the capabilities of the device and thereby satisfied some of the buyers.
There are people who buy a certain HP just for the sake of one program, which is not in others. Is it not realistic to produce piece-by-piece cheap HP with one or two programs at the request of the client?

Interestingly, why do you need 3 HPs? Yes, they called the regime "low-yeast" in Russian, and to some extent you are right that this is a publicity stunt, but not the fact that the Japanese made this regime for the sake of increasing the cost. Rather, they expanded the capabilities of the device and thereby satisfied some of the buyers.
There are people who buy a certain HP just for the sake of one program, which is not in others. Is it not realistic to produce piece-by-piece cheap HP with one or two programs at the request of the client?

Why do I need 3 HP? To bake bread, of course! We do not buy bread at the store, the family is quite large.
8 years ago I got my first Panas 255. I got acquainted with the site, I wanted a programmable HP. Kenwood 450 appeared. It was a period of mastering new technology. All the programs were studied, and how they were programmed! Already, I equated all the programs and thought up as many as I did.
Therefore, there was an opportunity to compare everything and draw conclusions. Their. For others, these very conclusions may be different, naturally, I express my opinion and do not insist that everyone should have the same. And I do not draw conclusions on the capabilities of other people, I just report it as a personal experience, I myself always try to collect more information, and in order to look at some problem from the other side as well.
And the third HP Panas 2502 was bought in 2016 to replace the first, he went to a permanent residence at the dacha instead of Ken sent there long ago. My Kenwood has the traditional bucket problem for all Kenwoods.
At first, two HPs lived in my house - Panas and Ken, they had enough work. Then Bosch, a good mixer, came along and Ken went to the dacha.

Why do I need 3 HP? To bake bread, of course! We do not buy bread at the store, the family is quite large.

We also do not buy in the store, but we are only 3rd. And we don't have a summer residence. And I bake a small loaf of bread every day. One stove is enough.

Therefore, there was an opportunity to compare everything and draw conclusions. Their. For others, these very conclusions may be different, naturally, I express my opinion and do not insist that everyone should have the same.

Yes, everyone has their own opinion, including Panasonic - they make a product for SHIRpotreb. A good product like this makes "wide"

Added on Tuesday 17 Jan 2017 11:29 PM

Then there was Bosch, a good mixer

But yes, there are overlays - bread is baked, but I need to knead the dough

Laaluu, I don't have the habit of blaming anyone and making conclusions from scratch!
What makes you think that I don't have something there, and even try to limit my right to express my opinion?
I have two Panas, 255.2502 and a programmable Kenwood 450, with HP I have been for 8 years. Enough experience to draw conclusions

I have a bread maker for 10 years, I am wiser. Or are you trying to limit my right to express my opinion? See, I can also hit the keys aimlessly.
Only the essence of the issue is not covered. An experienced person immediately, briefly said how many strokes in the main mode.
Now I would like to know how many puddles in low-yeast mode.

You do not know nifiga on this issue! So why mislead people? Why do you need your opinion, which is built on the basis of other bread makers, where there is no such regime? It is not just subjective, it is simply not at all, you simply cannot compare, because you don’t know the sequence of actions of the bread maker, but simply looked at the time in the modes. And that's all.

I often bake bread in 2 doses. First, knead the dough. Then the control went up. And then baking. therefore I combine different modes and the more, the better. And if someone else writes down what exactly the bread maker does, then make a decision whether to overpay 1-2 thousand for this mode, or not ... But so far no one has described the actions of the device inside the mode.

[i am wiser]

I have a bread maker for 10 years, i am wiser.

Please change your tone, on our forum it is not accepted to communicate like that!

Laaluu, I won't even take the trouble to answer insults and accusations!
YOU have already been offered to change the boorish manner of communication, if you really want to communicate on our forum.
All the answers to the questions you are supposedly interested in have long been in the forum topics, if you really need it, take the trouble to read them in other topics.
Something suggests that your appearance on the forum in such an aggressive form is connected with other intentions, either trolling, or an unbalanced psyche, or such a manner to promote sales ...

aaluu, I do not have the habit of blaming anyone and drawing conclusions from scratch!
What makes you think that I don't have something there, and even try to limit my right to express my opinion?
I have two Panas, 255.2502 and a programmable Kenwood 450, with HP I have been for 8 years. Enough experience to draw conclusions

Fine, fine .... but still, tell me how many times does Panas 2511 and 2512 knead the dough in low-yeast mode?

P.S. Yes, I see, you have hazing here, for 8 years with three bread makers - nothing, but for 10 years and 1 bread maker - a reprimand with censure, ha-ha, I can't get through this, because I don't believe there is no reasoning and that someone does not need it at all, but I believe stupidly to the technical data. Maybe someone doesn't need such a regime, someone has enough of their own bread machines, but I was impatient to buy a new one, and moreover I like long kneading recipes, not so long ones, but the taste of the product obtained ...