The dough does not rise

[Kuklinar]

Kuklinar maybe not enough yeast after all? Did you add sugar? I did not find it in your recipe.

Sugar really doesn't go to Italian.

Kuklinar , you should probably just deviate from your "standards" and try ours on the forum - sometimes it helps to understand your mistakes.

I'm not against. Yesterday I made "Ordinary White Bread". I am sure that you also bake like this. In the Russian instruction, it is almost the same, only the oil is different.

Yeast 1 tsp
Wheat flour 500 g
Salt 1.5 tsp
Sugar 1.5 tbsp. l.
Oil drain. 30 gr.
Water 350 ml

It turned out to be 11.5 cm high at the highest point. Last week my wife did the same thing, only she threw in a pack of yeast (7 grams or 2.5 norms) - it turned out to be high, almost on a par with the bucket and even more pleasant to smell.

In my opinion, everything is in order with the stove. You write that he did not rise even before baking,

Why didn't he get up? I wrote how he got up:

after 30 minutes the volume has not increased
after 60 minutes, the volume increased by about 40%. The bottom of the bucket in one corner is not covered with dough.
after 90 minutes, the volume has increased by about 100% of the initial
after 140 minutes, the volume increased approximately 2.5 - 3 times from the initial one. The top edge is 14 cm below the top of the bucket.
after 200 minutes, the volume increased even more, it's hard to say as a percentage. The top edge is 9 cm below the top of the bucket.

Have you tried to double or even triple the yeast rate? If the yeast is weak (after all, it's summer now), then they put much more of them in the dough.

For "normal bread" I tried to increase it by 2.5 times. The result is quite satisfactory. It didn't help much for Italian. If in the heat it is NORMAL to double the portion of yeast or more, then there really is no reason to suspect the stove is malfunctioning.
The fact is that last summer we had a cool one, and even earlier we did not have HB. So I have no experience in baking in the heat. The problems began in May, which suggests that the problem is related to the outside air temperature.

Try changing the yeast and salt first.
And analyze what components you have changed recently (bought a new pack of yeast, salt, flour, oil).

I tried it. No changes were noticed.

The weight of the bread is 620 grams. Not bad in the cut, fluffy and tasty, but, for my taste, slightly salty.
I put 6 grams for so many ingredients. salt. The height of the bread is 12 cm.
The conclusion suggests itself: everything is ok with the stove! but yeast does not interfere with adding another 1/2 tsp. , and even better leaven, home-made, home-grown.

12 cm? And do you think the bread is of normal quality? Then I seem to find fault with my HP.

12 cm? And do you think the bread is of normal quality? Then I seem to find fault with my HP.

Of course, 400 grams of flour is normal. There is a cut of the bread, you can see that there is a good crumb, only a little yeast is missing, or an increase in the proving time. Your stove is fine!

I baked bread today according to the same recipe
(400 gr flour
1 tsp dry yeast (took 0.75 h. l)
9 grams of salt (took 6 grams)
18 gr. ol. oils
260 g water), but the yeast was taken by others - Fermipan, and less, - 0.75 tsp from c / p. The result is obvious. I really like the Pacmaya yeast in the previous bread, but they are also significantly inferior to Fermipan.

At best I get 2/3 of your loaf. Even with a full pack of yeast (2.5 tsp) Below is a photo in a bucket.

I noticed a general pattern: the less flour goes to the recipe, the less bread is suitable. I thought that yeast is moistened early with water due to the fact that it is poorly separated by flour from water. I thought that they "worked" before the start of the batch.
Tried putting 1.25 tsp. under flour, as planned, and add another 1.25 tsp. at the beginning of the batch.

Italian, according to the recipe that you tried, became 5-10 percent higher. French was not influenced in any way. Today I completely put the yeast in French at the beginning of the batch: 2.5 tsp! It turned out a cake about a third of a bucket, and the loaf does not touch one wall at all - it is so small.

I noticed one peculiarity: both French and Italian are "crowned". That is, at some point, it looks like the dough was higher, but when baking or before it fell. A thin layer remains on the walls, which is then baked, creating a "crown" on the sides of the loaf:
🔗
It's Italian. The French "crown" is even higher, although it itself turns out to be much smaller.

What does that mean?

The crown is most likely (in my opinion) formed during kneading, which means that the dough is liquid. And if it nevertheless forms during the rise, then I think the reason is that you put a bit too much yeast - 2.5 tablespoons is very cool and perhaps from this it ferments and finally falls off. I, in Italian, or in French, put 1 teaspoon of yeast on a full loaf and this is quite enough for a good rise, of course, provided that the yeast is good.

as if non-industrial, the furnace does not mix well

I noticed one peculiarity: both French and Italian are "crowned". That is, at some point, it looks like the dough was higher, but when baking or before it fell. A thin layer remains on the walls, which is then baked, creating a "crown" on the sides of the loaf:

"Corona" is a layer of dough or unmixed flour that sticks to it when kneading. For some reason, the dough does not knead at once into the "correct" kolobok.
Follow the kneading process, if necessary, help to form a bun with a silicone spatula.
Yeast, really for 400 grams of flour - 1 tsp is enough and you should not put more, it is better to pay attention to the flour-liquid balance when mixing.

And if it nevertheless forms during the rise, then I think the reason is that you put too much yeast

Yes, exactly during the ascent, since I controlled the kolobok a couple of times - the walls were clean.

"Corona" is a layer of dough or unmixed flour that sticks to it when kneading. For some reason, the dough does not knead at once into the "correct" kolobok.
Follow the kneading process, if necessary, help to form a bun with a silicone spatula.

Yesterday, when I played "French", I followed the kolobok attentively. Added 1 tbsp. l. flour, because the dough was thin. After the addition, the bun became normal, the walls were clean during kneading. "Crown" - 100% is formed afterwards.

I do not know what to do. Increasing the amount of shaking does not help. Change of flour, shivers, salt, water too. It is necessary to carry HP for repair. How can they prove that it is defective? If they test "Normal" bread for 500 g of flour, then it will turn out to be quite conditional.

[Kuklinar]

Kuklinar It seems to me that you have increased requirements for HP! For 400 grams of HP in general, it is difficult to mix the dough well! What I see in the photo is like a 1/2 bucket for 400g, a normal loaf! Do not equal Fermipan yeast! Such yeast is generally the exception rather than the rule.

[No need to increase]

I do not know what to do. Increasing shaking does not help

No need to increase the amount of yeast should be reduced. For a loaf of 400-500gr. put no more than 1 teaspoon.

[Kuklinar]

Kuklinar It seems to me that you have increased requirements for HP! For 400 grams of HP in general, it is difficult to mix the dough well! What I see in the photo is like a 1/2 bucket for 400g, a normal loaf! Do not equal Fermipan yeast! Such yeast is generally the exception rather than the rule.

But this "French" as you?

🔗

This is with 2.5 tsp. yeast instead of one. Gingerbread man carefully controlled, added 1 tbsp. l. flour, as I wrote above.

[No need to increase]

No need to increase the amount of yeast should be reduced. For a loaf of 400-500gr.put no more than 1 teaspoon.

Excuse me, have you looked at the previous pages? Where did I first go with the problem of a bad test?

[Kuklinar]

Kuklinar Look at here https://Mcooker-enn.tomathouse.com/index.php@option=com_smf&topic=74023.0, maybe this is the case?

[Kuklinar]

Kuklinar Look at here https://Mcooker-enn.tomathouse.com/index.php@option=com_smf&topic=74023.0, maybe this is the case?

Thanks for the link. Difficult to comment. Two weeks ago, when I first addressed the problem of low breads, there was a fever. There was no "crown". I began to put in a double rate of yeast, as I was advised - it did not help much. The temperature in the apartment is normal for the last two or three days. Maybe you shouldn't have needed more yeast?

But then it's just a disaster, not HP. It will simply be impossible to adapt to it.

And the second consideration. My HP in September is two years old. "French" has never been to the top of the bucket before, as they wrote to me here, but it was not such a bad blot, as you can see in the photo.

All of the above makes me think that something is wrong with HB, and not with temperature, yeast or something else.

[Kuklinar]

Kuklinar Take the HP to the service! In order to dispel all doubts! Panasonic has a very high quality! Just look that he has authorization from the company!

[Kuklinar]

Kuklinar Take the HP to the service! In order to dispel all doubts! Panasonic has a very high quality! Just look that he has authorization from the company!

Understand what business. I live in Germany and I bought HP over the Internet. I will need to send it to the service by mail. If I don't find a killer argument for the fact that the HP is faulty, the service, having formally checked it, can return it back, saying that no faults have been identified. After all, everything is spinning, kneading, heating, baking. Insufficient "level of lifting" thing is rather difficult to prove.
And shipping back and forth will cost me a quarter of the price of a bread machine.

Here on the forum I'm trying to find something that will allow me to get conclusive proof that my oven is faulty. Or it’s because it’s all about crooked hands or ingredients, although I don’t really believe it, since everything was quite decent for 1.5 years.

since 1.5 years everything was quite decent.

you yourself have just answered your own question. Maybe this will help 🔗
I'm not good at German, sorry

Excuse me, have you looked at the previous pages? Where did I first go with the problem of a bad test?

It seemed to me that you were a little annoyed by my advice, but I want to say in my own defense that, judging by the roastiness, the oven bakes well, and judging by the crown, the dough also rises well, but for some reason it falls off. Hence the impression is that the yeast is still fermented because of the large amount (maybe in your case half a spoon will be enough), otherwise you would not have the so-called "crown". It's hard to find other explanations
By the way, I once baked gray Rustic bread according to the Mulinex recipe, so there is 700 gr. flour (wheat + rye) you need only 2/3 tsp. yeast and at the same time the bread has time to rise remarkably.

[I was advised to increase the amount of yeast]

Hence the impression is that the yeast is still fermented because of the large amount (maybe in your case half a spoon will be enough), otherwise you would not have had the so-called "crown". It's hard to find other explanations

Means did not drop in. I began to put in double and triple the rate of yeast due to the fact that some types of bread did not fit well. I connected it with the heat, since everything began, one might say, in May. I was advised to increase the amount of yeastto make sure that the yeast is not working poorly (old, moist, overheated, etc.), but HP does not work well.

Doubling and tripling of the norm slightly added volume to the loaves, but began to give a "crown", which, however, does not interfere, but does not give an answer to the question "why the bread stopped coming".

I still don't have a compelling argument for service to easily prove the HP is out of order.

Can someone suggest some kind of test (recipe, etc.) that will clearly determine the normal performance of HP?

🔗

Thank you, I'll read it carefully.

[Kuklinar]

Kuklinar Try to cook this one https://Mcooker-enn.tomathouse.com/index.php@option=com_smf&topic=3328.10 "Answer # 19: 21 September 2009, 11:52:11" or this one "Answer # 20: 21 September 2009, 11:57:17" https://Mcooker-enn.tomathouse.com/index.php@option=com_smf&topic=3328.20
If all components are missing please contact Stеrn https://Mcooker-enn.tomathouse.com/index.php@option=com_smf&action=profile;u=579
maybe she will tell you where to buy everything
PS: If I began to contact the service, I would definitely write them an email with a link to this topic. Maybe everything will be solved in the most unexpected way for you ...

Doubling and tripling of the norm slightly increased the volume of the loaves, but began to give a "crown", which, however, does not interfere, but does not give an answer to the question "why the bread has ceased to fit".

I'm talking about the "crown" again.
Your bread, judging by the "crown", still rises. The question is why he then falls off. It is possible that the temperature in the Bread Maker rises too high during proofing, or for some reason it deboned at the beginning of baking.
By the way, in my Ponasonik there was once a similar jump: when kneading the dough on the dumplings program, for some reason it began to heat up and as a result, not even a warm dough came out, but hot, almost scalding. True, it later disappeared by itself, I still did not understand what it was. Perhaps you have a similar failure somewhere. Check if you are not too lazy to observe 4-6 hours.

I'm talking about the "crown" again.
Your bread, judging by the "crown", still rises. The question is why he then falls off. It is possible that the temperature in the Bread Maker rises too high during proofing, or for some reason it deboned at the beginning of baking.

In the cases that I have described, it seems to be my oversight. There was no longer a lot of heat, and I kept throwing out the double portion of yeast.

Check if you are not too lazy to observe 4-6 hours.

Ready to check. But how? I was already thinking of throwing a digital sensor inside and monitoring the temperature. The main thing then is not to forget to take it out before baking. What temperature should it be at what moment?
_____________________

The last two days there is no heat at all, and I began to put everything according to the recipe. Italian is quite tolerant. And no crown. Today the French is a third of a bucket or a little higher. If we assume that it should be less than "Normal" by 500 grams. flour one and a half times, then I would not have twitched.

But I have already met here more than once that French should be up to the top of the bucket or even higher. Everyone has French from 300 gr. flour to the top of the bucket is obtained? Or are there such "lucky ones" as me?

[Kuklinar]

Kuklinar Try to cook this one

For this I will probably pick everything up:

Dry active yeast, for example "Lvovskie": 1 tsp.
Wheat flour, premium grade ("Kievmlyn"): 260 gr.
Peeled rye flour, second grade ("Kievmlyn"): 150 gr.
Salt: 1.5 tsp
Sugar: 1.5 tbsp l.
Olive oil: 2 tbsp. l. (you can use ordinary sunflower seeds, for example, "Chumak" refined)
Water: 290 ml.

Normal mode (4 hours), size - M, dark crust, normal scapula.
With such proportions, it turns out with a slightly convex roof

I'll try one of these days with local ingredients.

Ready to check. But how? I already thought of throwing a digital sensor inside and monitoring the temperature. The main thing then is not to forget to take it out before baking. What temperature should it be at what moment?

Here I measured the temperature in the bucket at all stages of kneading and baking, see if it can help #

We now have a heat over 40 and at home, in the kitchen during the day in the region of 30-33 degrees. Against this background, I tried to bake Italian bread according to your Kuklinar recipe. The bread turned out one-to-one like yours. Low, with a light and cracked roof, though without a crown, but I also put 1 tsp of yeast. I was shocked, I don't even know what worked. I usually bake Italian according to a different recipe: 1 tsp. yeast, 500 gr. flour, 1 tsp. salt, 320 ml. water, sometimes (if not sure about the flour) I add panifarin (improver) 1 tbsp. l .. Such bread turns out wonderful even in the heat. I have long discarded Italian bread recipes containing butter. Such bread invariably comes out denser and correspondingly low, and I like airy with a crispy thin crust.Maybe it's just the oil and the reason?

Against this background, I tried to bake Italian bread according to your Kuklinar recipe. The bread turned out one-to-one like yours. Low, with a light and cracked roof, though without a crown, but I also put 1 tsp of yeast.

Excuse me, is there an "Italian" mode in your stove?

[I think it's worth returning to "French", since I and everyone else have such a regime. How high do you get it?]

Tried with local ingredients:

Dry active yeast, for example "Lvovskie": 1 tsp.
Wheat flour, premium grade ("Kievmlyn"): 260 gr.
Peeled rye flour, second grade ("Kievmlyn"): 150 gr.
Salt: 1.5 tsp
Sugar: 1.5 tbsp l.
Olive oil: 2 tbsp. l. (you can use ordinary sunflower seeds, for example, "Chumak" refined)
Water: 290 ml.

Normal mode (4 hours), size - M, dark crust, normal scapula.
With such proportions, it turns out with a slightly convex roof

Added 1 tbsp. l. flour, because it was very batter. In theory, one could add one more, but it seems that with rye flour the dough should be thinner on average? The size of the bread turned out to be quite decent for 410 gr. flour.

True, I did not find any similarities with "Darnitsky", but that's another question.


I think it's worth returning to "French", since I and everyone else have such a regime. How high do you get it?

Excuse me, is there an "Italian" mode in your stove?

There is. I have two Panasonic: 253 and 255. So in 253 there is just a mode
"Italian". I took it after 255 just because of this regime. I really wanted to get hold of Italian, but one stove was still not enough.

Well, well, then everything is clear with “Italian”. This is how it should be. It remains to deal with "French".

No, I don't think he should be like that. Rather, according to this recipe it will turn out like this, but yesterday I baked bread from 2nd grade flour in the Italian mode, but without sugar, and it turned out to be a wonderful bread. you need to change something in the recipe. I once came across something at the expense of sugar in Italian bread, they wrote that it should not be there, but I came to this only recently. Without sugar, this mode really works better.

Help pliz, maybe someone knows what's the matter. I have had a cookie for a long time, everything has always been wonderful, but for the last three months the bread has not completely risen. I tried to bake different types, changed yeast, flour ...

By the way, my French didn't go well tonight: wow: Pechka is also third year old ...

Help pliz, maybe someone knows what's the matter. I have had a cookie for a long time, everything has always been wonderful, but for the last three months the bread has not risen at all. I tried to bake different types, changed yeast, flour ...

Try to bake bread on your own in x \ n, that is, not in an automatic program, but knead the dough on pizza mode, let it rise a couple of times and put it on baking. Perhaps an electronics failure has occurred and some programs may not work correctly or not work at all. Maybe after a while everything will be fine. I wonder if they do a flashing of x \ stoves in service centers?
Sazalexter can answer this question, but you can't see it ..

[Margit]

Margit I will not say about Panasonic's firmware, I don't know
And there can be many reasons for not rising. Starting with drafts, electricity failure (undervoltage in the network) and ending with the deterioration of the properties of bread components It is necessary to understand, by the method of exclusion and replacement

Try to bake bread on your own in x \ n, that is, not in an automatic program, but knead the dough on pizza mode, let it rise a couple of times and put it on baking.

Here I fully agree with you

People, help with advice, pliz! I used the saber device successfully for 2-3 months, I was not happy. But for some time now, as chopped off. THE DOUGH STOPPED TO RISE !!! In any mode. I do everything the same as at the beginning, when the bread was excellent. The sequence is the same. The components are the same.

Good morning everyone!
Same problems with my bread maker (model SD-255).
Five months of daily baking of wonderful bread and now - bam, it turns out not bread, but some kind of biscuit.

I noticed that after two hours of operation of the oven in the main mode, the dough is now cold, although it was warm before.

[Lenchik]

Good morning everyone!
Same problems with my bread maker (model SD-255).
Five months of daily baking of wonderful bread and now - bam, it turns out not bread, but some kind of biscuit.
I noticed that after two hours of operation of the oven in the main mode, the dough is now cold, although it was warm before.

Lenchik
I had the same problems with the stove a couple of times, now everything has gone by itself. What I did: I stopped baking on the mode that stopped giving me tall and lush bread, and there were bricks at the exit. I began to use dietary and French programs. The very first time I had such a story in French, I switched to the usual one, I baked on it for a long time and it also stopped working. Now both are working again.

[Lenchik]

Lenchik
I had the same problems with the stove a couple of times, now everything has gone by itself. What I did: I stopped baking on the mode that stopped giving me tall and lush bread, and there were bricks at the exit. I began to use dietary and French programs. The very first time I had such a story in French, I switched to the usual one, I baked on it for a long time and it also stopped working. Now both are working again.

Margit
I will definitely try! I already thought about doing this, but every time I baked in the main mode, thinking: maybe it will work out now!

I tried to bake French bread, it still turned out to be a shortbread.
But if you first put on the "Pizza" mode, then let the dough stand and turn on the "Baking" mode, then you get bread as in the "Basic" mode.

[Lenchik]

I tried to bake French bread, but it turned out to be a shortbread anyway.
But if you first put on the "Pizza" mode, then let the dough stand and turn on the "Baking" mode, then you get bread as in the "Basic" mode.

Lenchik, be sure to unplug the power cord after baking. It seems to me that recently this was the reason for a malfunction in my stove, especially since I live in a private house. Try to bake bread on a diet mode, so I was advised sazalexter... I hope that everything will return to normal for you!

I bought a Panasonic SD 255 bread as a gift to my parents in February 2009. I sent them to the village, explained how to use it, and they were happy. After 1.5 months, I decided to make my family happy with this miracle of technology, and we had happiness. But, after a year of operation, a parental call that bread does not rise made me shovel this forum. He made me change everything: flour, yeast, butter, etc., etc. Nothing came of it. Then he asked to put a bread-maker on a gas boiler (they have their own house and they heat themselves from the boiler) and bake bread. The bread turned out great. And then one day, when I came home, I found that our stove was making the same freak (the bread did not rise). The temperature in the apartment at that time barely reached 20 degrees (winter heating was turned off). I tried to change all the ingredients listed above, the result is zero.
The stove was left to gather dust until more free time in order to take it for repair.
Bottom line: I bought both stoves in the same online store, with a difference of 1.5 months, the breakdown is the same. So the marriage of this party?

[Ingredients]

I tried to change all the ingredients listed above, the result is zero.

First of all, one should not Ingredients change and check the quality of yeast: mix yeast with a small amount warm water and flour and put in warm (28-30 * C) place, and if the yeast does not rise in 15-20 minutes, then it is they who are to blame.

[GOGA]

GOGA
Bake while on a different program, I've already had this twice, baked on other programs, then came back again and the same program started baking as if nothing had happened. With what it is connected - I do not understand. You see, many have such problems, possibly from the voltage in the email. networks.It should be on the advice sazalexter install a voltage stabilizer.

GOGA, I have a Panasonic 257, worked for 2 weeks and started having problems with raising the dough. I was convinced that this was not yeast or flour, because a tall loaf was obtained from the same bag, and the next time it was a brick. I took it for diagnostics, I'm waiting for the result, and now I bake perfectly in Moulinex from the same flour and yeast and at the same voltage. Here is the confirmation ...

Greetings to all. Who has the French mode on Panase SD-255 and the bread rises to the edges of the bucket, can you measure the temperature inside the bucket while raising the dough?, I do not rise more than 30 C in this mode, although the mod test gives a temperature of 38 C. In the main mode and the dietary temperature in the bucket is 35 C.

The most optimal temperature for proofing the dough should be 28-30 * and not higher!
This is provided by the baking technology.
And this mode must be provided x \ n.

The dough does not need to rise quickly at high temperatures. The dough must stand for a normal time to rise, the quality of the finished bread depends on this.

I fall asleep with proven ingredients (I've been baking for almost a year), turn on the French mode, the temperature in the kitchen is 25 C. The temperature is equalized for exactly 2 hours 5 minutes, then the kneading takes 15 minutes, this is 2 hours 20 minutes, plus 60 minutes of baking. And then three hours 20 minutes, the program remains for two hours and forty minutes to raise, while the dough should fall a couple of times. At a temperature of 30 C in a bucket, the dough does not have time to rise well enough during this time, and as a result, the bread turns out to be low and not beautiful. But if, before baking, you turn off the HP and let the dough stand for another half an hour, then it rises acceptably and now you can put it on baking. Manual mode, and hunting as before, automatic. These 4-5 degrees are just not enough.

Help!
Tell me, pliz! I'm a beginner, just got HP (Panasonic), I couldn't get enough of it. And then suddenly something happened. Once I forgot to insert a spatula (I was very tired, I put the bread overnight). After that, no bread was baked properly.
I put the spatula on, check it.
Flour, recipe, yeast - everything is the same as before.
The scapula interferes (I spied on, and the sounds are appropriate)
Based on the temperature, it bakes normally.
BUT! Instead of good tasty raised bread, there is something white, flat, sticky, with unmixed flour falling on the sides.
Is this an electronics failure? Or after forgetting the paddle, could something get there? (Into some rotating element, I don't know). And on the other hand, on the "Baking" program, you can also bake without a spatula.
The most offensive thing is that we bought HP on the 8th, a little more than 2 weeks have passed, and you can't change it ...

[zine @ ida]

zine @ ida, did you say anything sensible in the diagnosis?