Italian sourdough (Levito madre) - cultivation and care

[any]

I understand this ...
Since I succeeded, I don’t come here, don’t tell and keep quiet ...
(Well, since we find fault with the words ...)
Good. Will be done.
Forgive everyone, PLEASE!
So I started a leaven to calm my nerves.
God forbid, someone to lecture .... I did not strive.

Well hello, New Year! What a mood this is!
Girls, we’re going to fight right now.

I'm absolutely interested any opinion, even of such an amateur as myself. And the pros need to listen and look into their mouths.

What to share then? Someone will be useful one information, someone else. Everyone chooses for himself.

I understand this ...
Since I succeeded, I don’t come here, don’t tell and keep quiet ...
(Well, since we find fault with the words ...)

I want to learn to breed leaven. And that's all that interests me, forgive my selfishness.
I want people to advise me something sensible, and not "well, I somehow succeeded and I'm already baking."
And I need a theory and people who know it.
The rest does not concern me.
Your experience and the experience of other lucky women will help someone else, it didn't help me, I'm looking further.

Before the first feeding, it was the fluffiest, although it was only a quarter fat. That is, not very active at once.

So I would get thoughtful from here. My putty rose so well the first time. And what, it was all five times - not very active the first time?

[the most]

So I would get thoughtful from here.

It was the most active of all! Neither honeysuckle with sugar, nor apple peels, nor fresh bananas, nor Turkish grapes had such a reaction. Do not raise the starters and that's it! Don't they have the yeast you need? So I said at the very beginning that fig grapes are here, apples processed with chemistry, that there is no normal yeast, there is no one to originate !!! But what if the fruits are all either re-canned or chemical?

[Tricia]

Tricia, Anastasia, if you want to get a really correct Levito Madre, and not pick up God knows what in your leaven, wait for a new grape harvest, it is advisable to buy from familiar sellers or in the garden. Even flour, in the end, does not play a leading role in the breeding of this leaven as much as the starting material (grapes). Re-read the thread about leavens on our website, yes, there is a lot written there, but from the height of your experience you can find answers to your questions, not amateurs, but experienced bakers. And do not despair, dilute, for now, for training, a lighter starter culture, maybe you will also like it.

So I said at the very beginning that fig grapes are here, apples processed with chemistry, that there is no normal yeast, there is no one to originate !!!

No, well, how do your St. Petersburg bananas differ from ours near Moscow? We do not live on different planets. I actually took a half-rotten banana for the starter (and all my greed, it was a pity to throw it away). Do you have any other flour in your arsenal? If I stir it up again, I will try another flour, because with the correct proportions I had a very soft bun. By the way, I took water from the tap.

get a really correct Levito Madre, and not pick up God knows what in your leaven, wait for a new grape harvest, it is advisable to buy from familiar sellers or in the garden. Even flour, in the end, does not play a leading role in the breeding of this leaven as much as the starting material (grapes)

Yes, I completely agree with you. I do not have fresh grapes right, even in season they are all processed with chemistry. This will never grow in our garden, so.
And on bananas - this is no longer Levito Madre, kmk, but my colleagues will forgive me.

for training, lighter starter culture

A very reasonable option.

And on bananas - this is no longer Levito Madre, kmk, but my colleagues will forgive me.

ah, that's where the dog rummaged. That is, grapes give special yeast cultures that you never dreamed of? A-a-a-a ... I feel like a 100% sucker

[Novichok_ya, Svetlana]

Novichok_ya, SvetlanaInitially, the Italians had this sourdough on grapes, everyone whose videos I watched and what I read about. This is canon. Probably not just like that. I dont know. Wrote "kmk" = as it seems to me.
If you came out on a banana or persimmon or something else, who cares if it's canon or not ?!
Only those who did not succeed are sorted out. We continue to search and try.

[Tricia]

Tricia, Nastya, and you can find clean raspberries in season in my beloved St. Petersburg, or rather in its suburbs. So, the best yeast for sourdough lives on fresh raspberries, and then they need to be added if the purity of the grapes is in question. Wait until summer and you will have an excellent leaven.

Novichok_ya, Svetlana, originally from Italians this sourdough on grapes, from everyone whose videos I watched and about what I read. This is canon. Probably not just like that. I dont know. Wrote "kmk" = as it seems to me.

Tricia, I will try and stir up on grapes, there will be something to compare with. KMK - I thought, that's what sourdough is called, shame on my gray head

Wait until summer and you will have an excellent leaven.

[Anastasia]

Anastasia, maybe then try to withdraw the French thick one? For her, it seems, only whole grain rye flour is needed, if memory does not fail.

[Tricia-Nastya]

Tricia-Nastya, try to buy a gray raisin and put it on it, there are still tails on this raisin! Look from our south! You can also find white raisins unprocessed, there will be a more approximate result! Recently I bought blue grapes inexpensively, it seems ours. You can also try it if the hunt is strong! In Narodnoye there is excellent strong flour, take a look! Good luck!



Anastasia, this is not the easiest leaven, you will make it!

As she rushing, she was not like that .. and now .. in the morning I fed at 9 o'clock, left ... I come in 6 hours, and then the stink of Th!

Now I put it in identical glasses ... on the left (light lid) with Nordic, on the right (dark lid) with Alekseevskaya! So look, how much higher .. more active, with 1st grade flour

[Loksa, Oksanchik]

Loksa, Oksanchik, Hi!

try to buy a gray raisin and put it on it, there are still tails on this raisin! Look from our south!

Yes, such raisins are called "medicinal"! And with ponytails and bones.
I already mentioned it here at the very beginning, yes, as soon as the opportunity arises, I will definitely buy it. And Nordic flour.
Anchic, Anya, I just need a sourdough for white bread. Gray and black are unpopular at home

As she rushing, she was not like that .. and now .. in the morning I fed at 9 o'clock, left ... I come in 6 hours, and then the stink of Th!

Now I put it in identical glasses ... on the left (light lid) with Nordic, on the right (dark lid) with Alekseevskaya! So look, how much higher .. more active, with 1st grade flour

Are you feeding her now twice a day? Here she is rushing, and even warm!



Flax, and the dough is already completely mixed for how much it raises!

Are you feeding her now twice a day? Here she is rushing, and even warm!



Flax, and the dough is already completely mixed for how much it raises!

Yes, twice ... but not about, but how it grows differently ... from flour ...

sourdough for white bread. Gray and black are unpopular at home

Nastya, have you tried to remove liquid fruit yeast?
They are universal, if you want it on white flour, if you want it on rye then you start a starter.

grows differently ..

Well, yes, its own torment is closer to the body

[Nastya,]

so Nordic has tighter gluten, more difficult to stretch. Feel with the pen for elasticity. But the aroma already depends on the flour. If the aromas differ greatly, it is immediately clear which one is much richer.

Nastya, and why exactly a leaven for wheat? just for taste or with a purpose only on wild yeast?

[fffuntic]

fffuntic, Lenayou know how I feel about you.Therefore, curtsies are unnecessary, I think, between us.
Do not try to give up your "educational" work because of our words. Many girls are interested. And you yourself like to "get the theory".
It costs a lot"
It is visible to all: You do it "at the behest of the heart." The most interesting, interesting to share. So why are you taking the words "inside out"? Do not dare!)))
... Everyone is expecting something new from you.
It's good that we are all different. We can do different things. And "different" is exchanged.
Otherwise it would be boring.

[Funtik]

I report: I came home, and she was already at her peak. I run to feed. The cat is hungry - yes, pofik, the main thing is that the leaven is starving I smell it. Oh no ........ smells like an apple !!! I tried it - sour, yes, but the taste is just an unripe apple. She fed. The gingerbread man already zhamkala, zhamkala, zhamkala, zhamkala - saturating with oxygen (my poor little hands). She cut it open and flopped into the glass. Let's take a look.
The second part fed (since the taste turned out to be noble) and muddied the dough for bread. Tomorrow I plan to bake the little black one, the acid there is just in time.
Well, good luck to me.
Funtik, Helen, thanks for the advice about the workout, it came in handy.

Girls, I love you

Oh, I forgot to write, I have flour with 13g of protein

[Ritus]

Ritus, girls, I wrote that there are no offenses. I'm an adequate person, I understand everything. But, damn it, to throw the leaven out of fear is also not the case. Everything should be fun. And then how will everyone scatter in the subject, and in FIG then all these theories are needed? The theory should help, not spoil the fun.

Novichok_ya, Svetlana, originally from Italians this sourdough on grapes, from everyone whose videos I watched and about what I read. This is canon.

and I know what I was thinking - bananas do not grow in Italy! And grapes - heaps

13g protein

Wow!)))

Everything should be fun.

Will be !))))

But, damn it, to throw the leaven out of fear is also not the case.

I just need a sourdough for white bread.

This is how the French woman eat for white bread - the French do not eat rye bread. This is a gorgeous sourdough, only it takes a little by the hour, so it's dreary at the beginning. It starts up on rye wallpaper flour, since there is also yeast on the grain shell. And then it feeds on wheat. I found the recipe here: French traditional sourdough (thick)

[Anchic]

as far as I know,

Indeed, the aroma and acidity of the sourdough directly depend on the types of microbes that sit in the flour and on the fruit. But the whole trick is that it is not the eco-purity of the grapes that is important, but the yeast, which has settled on a specific bunch and specific flour. Ordinary ones can sit, or they can get caught upright super-duper.
The second part of the marlezon. Only the lazy does not do this Levite in Italy. And she is considered awesome only by the chefs. This means that it is not only about grapes with manitoba. More details are important. Well there is consistency, feeding
The third part. Well yes. If you are looking for an ideal, then you probably need a very special grape and a special flour, so that the microbes there are disintegrated. But it seems like on the site the girls do it on just fruits and delicious. And the ideal does not really suffer if it is there or not, if it is very tasty. Maybe the Levite on a banana is not the same as the legendary one, but maybe if it is worse, then by a little bit
As far as I read, there seems to be no particular difference in taste for these fruits, but the aromas are simply fabulous, and there are ordinary ones.

And you can heat the grapes, give a little sugar and let it sour. If fermented normally fizzy with yeast - alive. You can put the brew in the sourdough, it will not be lost. Or you can mix several fruits, since we have them weak. More and more variety

Anchic, Anya, so I'm just a Frenchwoman on Calvel

I looked and did not see the difference with dry Levita, except that French yeast and microbes are taken entirely from flour, and they put fruit grapes into this one. And so the lead and the consistency requirement are almost identical. Or why don't I understand?
The wet Levite is swaddled and bathed. And this one is also kept in a dish, like a Frenchwoman, and fed.
The Frenchwoman is also non-acidic and thick

[Lena]

Lena, well yes.That is why I advised Nastya to look in the direction of the Frenchwoman, since she suspects that the wrong fruit comes across to her. Flour will not be processed like fruit. I just didn’t like the Frenchwoman very much that we had to take her out there by the hour. There, no matter how you start, you need to do something once at night, because each next feeding goes in fewer hours. Well, I personally buy wallpaper flour is problematic.

[Anya]

I don't really see it right on the clock. I mean from Calvel

Kalvel's sourdough and bread made with it
there is a link to Luda with pictures, a feeding plate, and also with pictures, you can see her preparation by Sergey

in Google Sourdough in 48 hours. Raymond Calvel's method. Bread and Bread Sergey

and so
🔗

CZ is completely rolling, Anya... Which have. I bred my KMKZ on the highest grade + CZ just with a bang of excellent quality. Fresh is needed, of course. If there is malt, generally lafa.

[Lena]

Lena, I mean French traditional. Above gave a link - French traditional sourdough (thick)

Does it seem to me that a thick traditional French woman will be sour than Kalvelevskaya?
did you do it
In general, it seems to me that the addition of grapes to Levito is still the coolest. Levito looks more advantageous against the background of both French women. Probably, it's still better to do it with the addition of fruits.

[Lena]

Lena, I was just making a Frenchwoman - this was my second leaven. The first was hoppy. But I didn't do it according to Calvel. Therefore, I cannot compare. But the bread on the Frenchwoman was not sour. He acidified on hop. But when I bred a Frenchwoman, I was young and stupid, I didn't know yet that a good leaven could be dried. Therefore, when, six months later, I needed to leave for a long time (for a month), I simply drained all the leaven into baking and that's it. Upon arrival, she began to withdraw a new Frenchwoman, but she turned out to be not as frisky as the first one. Well, I bored on it for a while, and then brought out hop for rye. And the white one began to bake on ripe dough

[just two ingredients]

I'm an adequate person, I understand everything.

I would also like to convince you to stop deleting the text, which you usually do neatly with the help of a spoiler.

Only the lazy does not do this Levite in Italy. And she is considered awesome only by the chefs. This means that it is not only about grapes with manitoba. More details are important.

I reviewed the information on the Internet, and interestingly, all sources, as one, believe that for obtaining sourdoughs are necessary "just two ingredients and a lot of patience"(from).
"Il lievito madre si può preparare in casa con due soli ingredients e molta pazienza".(from)
A source:

🔗

... The two ingredients are flour and water, flour is usually type 0 or 00 at W 250.
La prima deve essere forte, quindi con un valore uguale o superiore ad almeno W 250, poi deve essere biologica e macinata a pietra (per mantenere le sue proprietà) e di tipo 00. Il consiglio è di usare la farina manitoba.(from)
A source:

🔗

.
Separately, mention is made of the existing recipe options with the addition of sugary substances that accelerate and improve the work of bacteria, such products include sweet fruits, yogurt and honey, and they also call manitoba flour as a possible base for sourdough. It was also interesting to mention the creation of a suitable good environment for the ripening of the starter culture from two ingredients:
"Incidete la superficie dell'impasto con un taglio a croce e coprire il contenitore con un panno umido e della pellicola trasparente. L'impasto va lasciato riposare per 48 ore a circa 18 ° -25 °, meglio se vicino ad un cesto di frutta matura "(c).
"The dough is left for 48 hours at a temperature of about 18 ° -25 °, preferably next to a basket of ripe fruit."
A source:

🔗

.
For clarity, a video clip on working with sourdough from Sara Papa, author of the book "Lievito madre vivo":

🔗
🔗

, and just two ingredients, flour and water, for making the sourdough.
And yet, the author is already different, a table on the maintenance of the leaven:

🔗

.
Lena, perhaps you will be interested in more detailed information about the processes in the preparation and preservation of the sourdough, the author recommends using flour with at least 13% protein:

🔗
🔗

, the source is in Italian, but a fairly literary translation can be obtained using the usual "Translate this page" option.

Separately, mention is made of existing recipe options with the addition of sugary substances that accelerate and improve the work of bacteria, such products include sweet fruits, yogurt and honey,

This is very interesting ...
So I started with 5-6 grapes (my own from the garden, but frozen, one slice of dried apple - again "mine" and 1/4 tsp of honey), mixed it all together.
The fact that the grapes were frozen, apparently, did not interfere))) Well, I think so, but in fact I will find out when I create this: my freezer is full of currants (my own from the garden - unwashed), so I'll check.
I'll put it on it for interest ...
Already bursting. Although this leaven is now "a lot" for me.

And I seemed to be happy early ...
Yesterday I had it so fluffy before feeding, but today it practically did not rise, well, maybe 1 cm, and there are almost no bubbles either!
Day will be at 12.00, why should you feed this way or wait until evening?

But, damn it, to throw the leaven out of fear is also not the case. Everything should be fun. And then how will everyone scatter in the subject, and in FIG then all these theories are needed? Theory should help, not spoil the fun.

No, we're kidding! It is interesting and useful to read, but immediately thoughts, what if something else started up there
I feed her, groom her, and there IT is!
I have never tasted sourdough, read the forum, licked it today, sour! But bread, however, no! The bread is not sour.

Today I was embarrassed, I fed both banana and grape, but I didn't sign the cans. So I look at them, where is what. I will watch and leave the more cheerful one. That's what a girl's memory creates! But nothing, in baking they were the same, so there won't be much damage.

I want to learn to breed leaven. And that's all that interests me, forgive my selfishness.

I'm really sick for you! I hope it will work out!

so Nordic has tighter gluten, more difficult to stretch. Feel with the pen for elasticity.

yes, the leaven with Nordic, when you start it, it is elastic ...
She grew up the same today

And today I left only one with Aleseevskaya flour ... I will not carry two of them ..

Yesterday I had it so fluffy before feeding, but today it practically did not rise, well, maybe 1 cm, and there are almost no bubbles either!
Day will be at 12.00, why should you feed this way or wait until evening?

Get it out of the middle and feed, the first month the leaven is considered young and will behave differently. Mine, too, grew up, then sat, but I fed and fed. The main thing is not to drop it and keep it warm, not in the refrigerator and not in the light.

[Ksyusha]

Ksyusha, we have one to one! It's the same. I left until the evening, and maybe until tomorrow!
Oh, while I was writing Anastasia answered. Then I'll go and feed!

The dough is left for 48 hours at a temperature of about 18 ° -25 °, it is better if next to a basket of ripe fruits. "

There was no ripe fruit nearby, but there was tea rib, milk kefir and Indian rice nearby.

[Bozhedarka]

Bozhedarka, Nastya, it turns out what to feed regardless of the fact that it has grown or not?

[his]

[/ quote]

licked today, sour!

DeFchonki, damn it! How can it be "not sour !? Huh?"
Well this is a leaven !!!! From the word "ferment"!
If she were not "sour", how would she raise bread? A?
Of course sour!




Nastya -Bozhedarka, you can visit Lichka (I want his show you the scheme for "control" ...)
So offensively I wrote you a bunch of questions and material in that Temko about leavens. Then I accidentally pressed the wrong button and ... deleted everything ... pancake, pancake, pancake ...

[Trishka]

Trishka, Ksyusha, I just remembered that I fed the first days as soon as it increased. I saw that I had grown until it fell out, I tore off the middle and feed it, the leftovers were wildly sour, it was a pity to throw it away, I tried to make pancakes, pure vinegar. The first week I threw away the leftovers. It all smelled like mash, as soon as the smell changed to fruity, I began to bake the right bread. Of course, I baked the first bread on the fifth day, but it was still not the same bread, although it was very tasty. On the grapes, the leaven was softer than on a banana, the banana did not rise at all for the first three days, so a couple of bubbles on the bottom. Anyway, on the third day, I picked out 40 grams from the middle and fed.I started on a banana out of interest, did not believe that it could be derived from anything other than grapes. A week later, the banana was faster than the grape, then they leveled off and now there is no difference. The banana was unripe, astringent, I remember this, because I broke off the banana's nose for sourdough, and ate the rest and thought it would not work, the banana is green. But already kneaded and began to observe.

Nastya -Bozhedarka, you can go to Lichka (I want to show you my scheme for "control" ...)

Sure you may!

True, I can only answer tomorrow, otherwise I stayed up half past midnight!

So you still have to wait for now? Don't feed now?
I can show a photo of her current one.

[Ksyusha]

on the third day she picked out 40 grams from the middle and fed.

no, I remembered, before I always took 50-60 grams of sourdough, now it's 30-40



Ksyusha, give a photo! Didn't the ball crawl? and what is the temperature in the house?

stayed up half past midnight!

Exactly, you're on another continent.
Sorry.
See you tomorrow.

[Ksyusha]

Ksyusha,
deduced according to this scheme.



Margarita, Till tomorrow! I'll open my face tomorrow, otherwise I'm afraid I won't find the letter

Nastya, go to sleep!
Immediately !!!

according to this scheme.

And I on it., I only divided it in half, not by 200 grams of flour, but by 100.
This is it yesterday after the batch.

And this is a day later, that is, now.



Nastya, forgive us, it's day now, good night, see you tomorrow.

the ball has not spread? and what is the temperature in the house?

Sprawled, there are a few bubbles, the temperature in the kitchen is about +25.