French modern sourdough (liquid)

let me answer you point by point

1. The link malt will certainly do. I used just this

2. French sourdough - actually specifically for wheat bread, it is grown specifically for baking wheat bread. We are already here adapting it for rye

3. About baking in HP, better read these Temki
https://Mcooker-enn.tomathouse.com/index.php@option=com_smf&topic=13348.0

https://Mcooker-enn.tomathouse.com/index.php@option=com_smf&topic=13276.0

https://Mcooker-enn.tomathouse.com/index.php@option=com_smf&topic=12549.0

I have HP Mulinex and I put the leaven on the liquid, on top of the flour.

Thanks for your attention and tips

Is malt concentrate ok if not a regular one? If so, how much should you take?

Helpitee
for the third time I am already brewing 100 grams of rye flour + 10 grams of malt + 120 grams of water at 40 degrees, I put it in a warm place at 33-35 degrees. Mold appears in a day.
I washed all the dishes, rubbed them already, my hands with soap and water before going to the leaven, well, do not wear a surgical gown.
I walk around the can, I'm already singing mantras to this starter
After a day, it is clear that some fermentation processes have already begun there, such minibubbles, and a liquid consistency, and white-gray fluffy spots on top
"... It's a shame, hey, yes ... I'm going to her ... and she !!!
Could the malt be spoiled in the first place? or flour? I bought everything straight from the store at VDNKh.

you know, it seems to me it's about flour. There is not much malt and even if there is a problem with it, the useful flora and fauna would win.
But there is a significant amount of flour - and it may well be affected by molds. Probably worth buying another flour
Another option - you use water from the filter - and that's the point

[rinishek]

rinishek absolutely right - it's a matter of flour. I tried to somehow grow such an unsuccessful sourdough, the result was repeated with enviable persistence - mold after the first day
There is only one way out - to look for another flour.

Since I found Zest (the godmother of the French woman), I will ask about my problem.
Zest, dear, can you tell me what:
- put a Frenchwoman on Saturday, yesterday it seemed like the last day - from the evening at 20-00 according to the recipe I kneaded 110: 110: 110, the container was in the kitchen, temperature 24-25 * С
and then ... in the morning - no one got up, or rather rose by 10%, this is in a container from a hand blender - 1 cm.
What should I do? (God, questions every time, and when will a French woman bounce off my teeth?)

Oh girls, thanks!
I add only boiled water, cooled to 40 degrees. I changed the flour yesterday, it's great that my guesses coincided with your recommendations. 5 hours left to wait, until the end of 1 day, we are waiting.

And if this is about flour, is it really possible to throw it away, or can it be somehow disposed of?

yes, do not throw it away - during heat treatment, all yeast will die, it cannot be used for sourdough, but for dough and baking it is quite possible.
That is, to prevent the development of molds. Cultivated yeast (pressed) must defeat this flora-fauna, but there is no yeast in the ferment culture, it is the yeast that we get from rye flour. so you got yeast - but not the same, not good yeast, moldy, fucking yeast
and add cultural ones - they are many times stronger - so they will win

After 24 hours, there were two small white spots on the surface, if not for the two previous discarded starters, I would not have paid attention to them.
I removed the top layer and threw it away. I took 110 grams from the bottom layer for the next stage.
Today (12 hours later) there are no signs of mold, but what kind of fermentation
I made another batch of 110: 110: 110, put it away in the heat, and left the rest in a separate jar for another 12 hours, I'll see if there are no signs of mold, then the good yeast won. Am I right in thinking?

Girls, I bow to you for your attention and answers
I've been baking bread for a long time, but everything is yeast, but I didn't deal with sourdough ... and then I went into this Temka .... from your beautiful breads, my hands and feet began to dance ...
please tell me, is it possible to use serum in a "Frenchwoman", just a lot of it remains (I make cottage cheese for a child) but it's a pity to pour it out

[Lelechka84]

Lelechka84, you can feed it with whey, but then it will already be a lactic acid starter culture - we have it here, it is slightly different ...
https://Mcooker-enn.tomathouse.com/in...tion=com_smf&topic=3394.0

[feed again, or wait for the peak of the rise?]

Hurrah! Hurrah! It seems that everything worked out.
The leaven is bubbling, has risen 2.5 times, you can clearly see how it moves. While walking around her, thinking what to do next, she began to fall right before our eyes. She put most of it on pancakes, fed 60 grams 1: 1: 1. It was at 12.00 now 15.15, she has already risen 2 times, feed again, or wait for the peak of the rise? While the oven is not going to want to feed her a couple more times, so that she gets stronger.

18.03. Already baked the 1st bread, report in the topic "Iziuminkin favorite" https://Mcooker-enn.tomathouse.com/index.php@option=com_smf&topic=11837.0

I decided to try three methods of storing the starter culture:
One jar went into the cold according to a new method from Ludmila's LJ, the other is on the refrigerator door at 10-13 degrees, the third has to be fed every 5-8 hours, it behaves violently, just to the point of indecency.

Girls, I'm here now. Something didn’t work out with the eternal one ... I rejuvenated it for several days, as Viki advised me, but no progress. I decided to try French. Has grown. And now I have such a problem. It doubles in 2 in about 5 hours, exclusively on battery. There is about 38 degrees. It doubles on the table almost in a day, and the bubbles are so ... modest. I feed on 20 g of sourdough, 40 g of water and flour. The one on the battery acc. as doubles, after 5 hours (except at night), those on the table (about 22 degrees) 2 times a day. What am I doing wrong?

Hello!
Tell me how you can replace malt (I can't get it anywhere.

those on the table (about 22 degrees) 2 times a day. What am I doing wrong?

but everything is so - I also feed once a day, proportions 1: 3 or 1: 4
a 38 * C is a very high temperature, optimal for starter culture 29-30, maximum 33 *

Hello!
Tell me how you can replace malt (I can't get it anywhere.

Hello!
If you replace malt with something, then you will get the sourdough, but not "French".
Let's, for a start, in the "profile" specify the city where you live and cannot get malt and start looking for it.

I'm from Ekaterinburg.
I started baking again, after a long break. And so I decided to try the leaven. Thick French on the way. Tomorrow morning I'll try to bake something on it. I also thought to put liquid for comparison. But malt ... I often see it in recipes, but I haven't seen it anywhere on sale. Only in bulk.

[Lesssia]

Lesssia , welcome to the forum! Ask fellow countrymen where do they buy malt ??

[viki]

viki , good evening! Judging by the photo, rye dry fermented malt is used in the preparation of the sourdough. Am I getting it right? Tell me please.

[Twist]

Judging by the photo, rye dry fermented malt is used in the preparation of the sourdough. Am I getting it right?

Twist, good evening!
Quite right - fermented dry rye malt. In this photo, Bryansk malt. I also tried red malt production - Austria, the result is excellent! You can take a teaspoon of liquid malt extract, stir it in water, I tried German, and the sourdough also turns out "with a bang".

[viki]

viki, thanks for the consultation! : girl_curtsey: I also have dry malt made in Austria. I am very happy with it.
Recently I bought a malt extract from the Irex company (Germany).When I received the package I saw that it was not rye, but barley-wheat. Can you tell me which bread to use for baking?

malt extract is not rye, but barley-wheat extract. Can you tell me which bread to use for baking?

This is great! It can be added to any bread - wheat, rye, wheat-rye. Try 1 tbsp. spoon and determine if you need more or less.
I have a liquid rye malt extract like this: 🔗... I am very happy with it, I recommend it.

[viki]

viki, good evening! Thanks for the clarification and reference.

If I have any questions in the process of growing the starter culture, can I contact you for help?

If I have any questions in the process of growing the starter culture, can I contact you for help?

I will try to answer all questions. I will help, as they say, as much as I can.

Thanks a lot for your support.

Tell me please, during the cultivation of the leaven, you can close it with a lid, I also wanted to know on the second day of cultivation, you need to take 110 grams from it (how many spoons are it?) And what to do with the remaining leaven?

[Viki]

Viki
Good day.
Tell me, please, what could be my problem?
On the third day, the leaven does not grow. That's how I kneaded ... and it stands on the same level, but bubbles. The smell is normal. The temperature is decent at home now. I also put it in the bath to the radiators. Stands, bubbles only from above, inside is silent.
The first two days there was an excellent fermentation and rise. Maybe it's the flour? Which wheat?

On the third day, the leaven does not grow.

Don't worry. She can start active growth on the fifth day. The main thing is to feed and at the same time observe proportions. Try so that for each part of the leaven there is the same amount of flour and the same amount of water. There is 50g of sourdough - give it 50g of water and 50g of flour.
Good luck to you!!!

Thank you. I'll try to wait. The truth has already begun to make a new one.

[Viki]

Viki
Good day.
May I consult with you ... online, so to speak?
I kneaded a new leaven last time.
Today is morning, day three.
I come and see .. the picture is still the same. : girl_cray: Stands at the same level. The smell is good, the color is pleasant. There are bubbles.
I decided not to give up and continue.
I also took 110 grams of all the ingredients. I didn't dare at 50. : red: I still hope that all of a sudden the leaven will start to grow as expected and I will immediately begin to bake with it.
Now the questions are ripe:
1. With this behavior of the leaven, feed it the same? Twice a day?
2. How many days to continue the experiment?
3. Can you add anything to increase the reaction?

4. And yet, I didn't quite understand .. it suddenly happens that I fed her and she earned, doubled after 6 hours (for example). Can I start baking right away?
That is, I immediately take the required volume into the bread, and leave five grams for leaven and feed it?
And if the doubling process began after 8 or more hours, then it is already necessary to refresh the leaven before taking it for baking?
Sorry for the confusion

1. With this behavior of the leaven, feed it the same? Twice a day?

Feed the same and observe the temperature.

2. How many days to continue the experiment?

For more than five days, no one has resisted yet, usually growth began.

3. Can you add anything to increase the reaction?

It is possible, but there will be another leaven, no longer French. In a whisper: a pinch of bran or a spoonful of whole grain flour, you can just rye, but bran is better.

4. ... it suddenly happens that I fed her and she earned, doubled in 6 hours (for example). Can I start baking right away?
That is, I immediately take the required volume into the bread, and leave five grams for the leaven and feed it?
And if the doubling process began after 8 or more hours, then it is already necessary to refresh the leaven before taking it for baking?

Quite right! Only five grams at first I do not advise, until I get stronger I took so much to feed 1: 1: 1 or 1: 2: 2.I decipher: let's say 20g sourdough + 20g water and 20g flour or 20g sourdough + 40g water and 40g flour.

[Viki]

Viki , good day!
Earned aaaaaa !!!!
You were right .. the leaven has surrendered. Doubled. I'll try to bake on it today.
Another question, when can the sourdough be considered ripe, so that it can be baked without yeast?

... when can the leaven be considered ripe so that it can be baked without yeast?

Yes, she is already fully ripe, two or three more feedings and she will get stronger. You can add a little yeast for the first couple of baked goods, or you don't have to. Only until it gets stronger, feed her as we said earlier, that is, do not leave 5 g for feeding, okay?

Viki, good afternoon!
I wanted to unsubscribe.
My leaven lives remarkably well. I bake it perfectly.
Thanks again for your consultation.

My leaven lives remarkably well. I bake it perfectly.

This is good news !!! And then I already thought that you did not like the result. Good luck and delicious bread!

girls, tell me, today is the second day of my ferment, in the evening I regretted throwing away what was left of 110g, fermented in the morning, and also added water and flour to them, and then I read that there might be bad bacteria there. Throw away all unnecessary and not regret? Or you can also grow the leaven?
then, for top dressing tomorrow morning (this is the third day), take only 110g, the rest in a bucket, or can any amount?
then, after the morning of the third day, you need to feed idle for several days - I read all the pages, I did not understand in what proportions what to take, I learned that every 5-7 hours? And after what time from the morning of the third day and how many times?
tell me, otherwise she bubbled so noticeably, the soul sings straight - beauty
and if I grow up, I read that it is impossible to store in the refrigerator, and then - what is possible, but before that, feed and let it rise ???

... tomorrow morning (this is the third day), take only 110g, the rest in a bucket, or can any amount?

The third day is the most important. You need to take exactly 110g of sourdough and feed it as written on the first page, and then carefully observe it and try to compare it with the photo. If bubbles appear - ready! If not, then do not keep it for more than 12 hours, feed it the same way and observe again. It may take several feedings every 12 hours until it starts bubbling in 6-8 hours, but it depends on the temperature.

Thank you, but throw away the rest, or can you feed the other 110g?

thanks, I will try

Good luck!
And write what happens. We will deal with further feeding and storage. Now it is important for us to bubble well and double before 12 hours have passed.

10 hours have passed since the morning feeding on the third day, and we are not bubbling very actively, but they look very fresh, probably we need to feed 100g again?

It would be better to wait 12 hours, but 10 is also not bad. We are all human and cannot feed the leaven at night or when we are at work.
When it begins to ferment actively, try not to let it grow more than its volume, it is hot now and it quickly accumulates acid. When the bread will already be raised, even if it will at least threefold, at least fourfold, but while it has doubled the leaven, it's time to feed.
The amount of starter culture can already be reduced, but the proportion must be observed. You can feed 20g of sourdough + 20g of water + 20g of flour, you can feed 50 or 100 - that's as convenient for you.
Let's hope that she will become strong, beautiful and repay you for your care with delicious bread!

Viki, tell me, my sourdough looks like yours on the morning of the third day, beautiful, but without large bubbles, only small ones, and today is the evening of the fourth day. Has already done 3 additional feedings in equal shares, should I continue to feed every 10-12 hours?

... continue to feed every 10-12 hours?

Can you taste it? Not sour?
If everything is in order, you can reduce the amount of sourdough and feed as convenient. The main rule is that the feed is not less than the sourdough itself, but more, so please.
And it's time to bake some bread already ... I am so modestly hinting about it ...

it’s just scary, suddenly it’s not yet ripe, but it smells very pleasant, it doesn’t smell sour, it hasn’t tasted. Well, on the weekend we'll try it

Oh, I forgot to ask - can I put it in the refrigerator or is it better to continue feeding it to stable bubbles?

Oh, I forgot to ask - can I put it in the refrigerator or is it better to continue feeding it to stable bubbles?

You have found someone to ask ... I fear how I do not like to put yeast in the refrigerator! If it is possible to keep her without a refrigerator, she will be very happy with life.

But I put the Frenchwoman in the refrigerator in the evening, though the next day I pulled her out and she stood for 4 hours in the kitchen, all bubbled, blossomed and I decided to put 2 bread on it: French in HP and farm bread (counted for wheat sourdough). turned out beautiful

turned out beautiful

It turned out! And two at once! Well, you are great! I mean, you both tried hard and baked such beauty!
Now the task is not to stop there, there are still so many interesting breads ahead. And delicious ...

Thank you very much, the leaven grew from the second time, and the bread two from greed - it was a pity to throw out the leaven, it was too pretty

Viki, tell me, I got a real sourdough with beautiful huge bubbles only when my young sourdough stood in the refrigerator 2 times, I held it in the refrigerator, took it out, warmed it for about 4 hours, fed it and so on 2 times, but the first time I fed it 1: 1: 1 , and the second (yesterday) 15g of sourdough, 100g of water and 100g of flour. and it's real this morning. I poured it into a jar and put it in the cold, and put rye sourdough on 15 g - fed 50 g of water and 50 g of flour. How often did I feed the starter culture, so as not to lose it, it turned out that in a day, because even in the refrigerator it bubbled to the surface and as soon as the process became more active I got it and fed it?