Torun gingerbread "Katazhinka"

Irochka, dear, I already love you: girl_love: I remembered the whole batch that it was better to be softer, and looked at your photo. She hit with a rolling pin and scraped off the table, hit and scraped again. Flour went 900 grams, the package is like that, I decided not to add up to kg. So I don't think that's cool. I have another problem suddenly appeared - there is nothing plum anywhere !!! Would you like ginger jam? Thank you for your concern, Irochka!

Katya like me glad what is there - happy!
You did everything right, I am registering you as an excellent student!
In my "heritage" recipes for gingerbread, nowhere is there an exact amount of flour: the old craftswomen knew that consistency was important, so you quite rightly limited the flour.
And the fact that it was the soft dough that was beaten with a rolling pin, otherwise many decided to beat it, it means that the dough is steep, but in fact, you cannot knead soft, but heavy and viscous dough with your hands, especially if you add something along the way - knead until uniformity is labor- and time-consuming only with a rolling pin, if there is no wear-resistant professional equipment.

Katyusha, about the plum - very, very sorry she brings an important note.
What kind of ginger jam? Based on what? The question is, in general, an idle one, since bright, spicy, sweet will not work here. I wrote in the recipe:

Plum jam-jam-jam works best here! Does not interrupt the aroma, but adds a slight sourness to the taste. If there is no plum, try replacing:
1- lightly boil frozen plums until soft or bake in the oven, chop in mashed potatoes and boil again (so that the coating does not deteriorate during the storage of the gingerbread)
2 - chop and boil the washed prunes. If a plum or prune without the acidity that we need, add a little lemon juice.

I hope you find and prepare something plum with the time remaining before baking.

I also kneaded the gingerbread three weeks ago. I'm waiting now when the baking time comes.

[tuskarora]

tuskarora,
Alena, hurray! and tomorrow I can't go to the third batch without experiments, but I just can't bring the recipes to mind alone, however, it's almost ready

[Irish]

I will also do one more batch the other day, otherwise my husband says - it will not be enough!

one, however, is almost ready

Irish, come on already finish the recipe and share! New Year is rushing towards us ... 🔗

Gala, the sun is so glad to cross in the time stream, now I don't sit late, I changed the regime after the sanatorium - I turn off at 23:00, or even at 22 today, because of sourdough bread, I was late (revived my grape bread) ... is already baking
I'll adjust the recipe soon for me, to be honest, gingerbread is a year-round phenomenon, so I'm not in a hurry to somehow understand that I’m wrong, I understand ...
Yesterday I bought chickpeas for your cutlets

Gala, the sun is so glad to cross in the time stream

Irisha, mutually

for me, to be honest, gingerbread is a year-round phenomenon

That cannot be said about me. For me, the aromas of spices, gingerbread and their pastries are a holiday.

the question about honey deserves a separate lecture

and it would be nice to listen to the lecture too.

That cannot be said about me. For me, the aromas of spices, gingerbread and their pastries are a holiday.

Gal, so is a holiday for me, but according to Old Slavonic traditions, stretched out as if for the whole year, that is, I wanted to say that I am not particularly tied to any dates, the holiday in my soul, so there is a gingerbread in the oven
I can't even imagine who could limit me only to New Year's

After all, the world is not without good people.It turns out that this year there is a poor harvest of plums, and I have strained with plum products. But today I arrived at the market and practically lingered around the trading grandmothers - who would sell plum jam. And there was a granny! I will have it on Thursday!

Katyusha, I'm happy for you! I, too, in a lean 2012, it seems ... I went to the grannies, begged for last year's jam and got along with prunes.
And here this year, on the contrary, plums were oooo ... however, more than half were imported from Krasnodar Territory, from Moldova - I'm talking about Hungarian, which is best for gingerbread. There is sourness in it and color ... and I never used a round plum at all
So this year I had to beat myself on the hands - I could not walk by and not buy a couple of kg ...
But what is there - yesterday in several places I saw a Hungarian woman, true, more expensive than in the season, but! there is. Again I had to slow down myself - "Well, Katya needs it, not me!"
I don’t cook jams at all, only plum for gingerbread, but I don’t need much of it, I have a lot of recipes for my favorite gingerbread and without jam, I not only cooked it, I also figured out how to facilitate the process and not stand while cooking and stirring: halves in the oven, and then in jars and containers. True, while I keep it in the freezer, m. I had to sterilize it in jars, but I'm not an expert in spinning, I generally like everything fresh or freshly prepared

Ah, Irisha! Nobody eats jam at all, and my mother hasn't cooked for a long time. But next year I will worry about preparing in advance - I will make citrus fruits, and I will cook plum jam myself And today I got two half a liter of something plum (they are different in color and, grandma said, to taste, but both with sourness. have not tried ). The oven decided on December 19 to have everything ready for Christmas. A little glasses. The fact is that for 3 years I have been looking for a recipe, and it still turns out to be wrong. Now I understand, it's all about softness in technology and "sealing". I really hope and believe in your recipe. Unfortunately, our Polish traditions were lost a long time ago, and Katarzynka is just a happy find, and so on time

[Nagira]

Nagira Irina, finally, I managed to put the dough on the "Katazhinka". Last year it didn’t work, but this September I made a plum jam especially for the gingerbread, when the dough was kneaded what smell from spices, I put it away for storage

now wait for baking

[Slastena]

Slastena, Lena is glad that you are with us! Fragrances are yes ...
You have a noble pot and the dough in appearance is what you need!
And about plum jam - doubly pleased
Do you think the stove is for NG or for our Christmas? Not much time before Catholic

[Irina]

Irina , but I'm so glad that I will probably bake with you for our Christmas

Hello Nagira! Recently I became interested in gingerbread dough and now I am exploring the vastness of the Internet, studying and studying. I found two recipes of Katarzhinka and both under your nickname, this one and on this site everything in them is almost the same and you write the same, BUT in them 1) the amount of milk in one is 30ml, and in this one already 300; 2) the difference in eggs is not so great - just one, and the vodka in that recipe is 2 ct / l, and in this one as much as 150 ml! This is a typo, or are they still different recipes, although they are very similar. But can you still comment? I want to try this magical long-cooking dough, but in this snag, there is still a big difference in milk, I'm afraid everything may go awry ...!
Waiting for an answer! Thank you.

Something in the first message the site did not go through, I wrote it again, just in case.
Stern and Her Friends is a site that doesn't work in English.

[Viya]

Viya, welcome to the gingerbread quest! I'm glad that my recipes are interested, namely - recipes, not a recipe
And I understood about another site, I only have Katarzhinka in 2 places.

everything in them is almost the same and write the same

Still, do not forget - this is still the same Katazhinka, BUT - variations of the recipe
Therefore, I disagree with your words
In addition to the fact that both recipes are completely different introductory stories, I both here and there in these prefaces immediately mentioned about THREE recipes for Katazhinka in my family archive

HERE:
and we sat down and remembered which recipe for Katarzhinka is next in line this year - one of three carefully preserved by my great-great-grandmother

THERE:
I ask you to love and favor - "Katarzhinka" is the simplest of the three recipes of old Torun pierniks - that is, gingerbread - from our family.

Judging by how I confused you with these 2 recipes - I made sure that I did the right thing, that I did not post the other 2 options here
And in terms of composition, this is certainly noticeable, about another Katarzyka, I even wrote that that recipe is the simplest:
in the local Katažinka - ghee and only rye flour, both of these ingredients require special treatment

The amount of moisture in the dough is "collected" by different products: here - more milk, and there - honey and eggs, and half of the flour is wheat, it is not as hygroscopic as rye, and besides, in the local recipe we roast rye in the oven, that is, it becomes even drier, and in the second, simpler recipe, we do not do this

Well, one of the main points in the gingerbread business: a thoughtful selection of spices!
You will be surprised how similar (at first glance!) Different gingerbread recipes are among themselves! therefore, it is important to compose and record successful compositions of "gingerbread perfume" so that your gingerbreads do not look like one another.
Look again at both Katažinka's recipes, there the spice composition is different, carefully selected and tested. No postscripts "put to taste"

In general, I hope I dispelled your doubts, there are no typos in the recipes, I will be glad to see your experiments!

P.S. They say that the last words are best remembered, so I finally want to repeat for you: control the thickness of the dough! let it be better to have excess flour, 200-300 grams - it doesn't matter! In the old recipes, its quantity was never indicated, it was only said about achieving a certain consistency of the dough

That's thanks for the answer, advice! It’s nice :) So everything went on the shelves in my head! And then I'm trying to average something, I see slightly identical ingredients and combine them together - into an average recipe, so to speak ... But they, in fact, are so different in subtleties and this must be accepted and tried to knead them separately .. ...
And I mixed all sorts of spices, probably components 7-8, a whole jar and now I put it all out of it everywhere ... until it ends ...
And apparently it is necessary to make a little for each recipe ... and store each spice remaining in a separate jar ?! ...

I have already baked custard gingerbread twice and caught fire with this creativity, and three versions of the dough are still in the refrigerator. So I decide to go for Katazhinka :) Either pour my own jar of spices again, or use a new one as in the recipes ??? !!! ...

[Viya]

Viya, that's good that everything is laid out on the shelves, but get ready for a long process.
The gingerbread business is so fascinating and scientific and research, I said both creative and strictly verified ... I have been experimenting for many, many years, restoring recipes, and looking for information on history and technology ... and there is no end to this process see
And of course, of course, of course - for each type of gingerbread you need to make your own bouquet of spices!
And with immersion in the gingerbread action, you will understand why gingerbread people do not recommend using ground-bought spices (with some exceptions). Only yourself! It is very pleasantly invigorating - rubbing, grind-mixing ...
I prepare spices a few days before kneading the dough - I check if I have everything and grind-grind those that require grinding (it is hard to grind cloves into powder with home remedies, I never succeeded, only grind and sift in a mortar - rub again, sift again ... dolgooo, did it only as a last resort, if it was not possible to get ground anywhere).You can also buy good quality ground cinnamon, but you need to buy several different ones for testing and choose the freshest, pleasant and intense aroma. Cinnamon sticks are also not easy to turn into powder, although they are easier than cloves.
Do not buy ground cardamom in any case! This spice has all the flavor-flavor in grains, and the boxes are production waste; in the ground spice it is the boxes for the most part, and the aroma is corresponding, hay
In addition, ground cardamom very quickly loses its aroma, so when preparing, add it to the mixture of other spices and close it in an airtight container - preferably a small, tiny one, so that the air gap between the contents and the lid is as small as possible.
In the markets, Asians always sell green cardamom in boxes (you take out the grains from there and grind them in a mortar, such a small amount is not suitable for mills), and there are also Indian or just oriental stores - unfortunately, you have not indicated - not your name, no place of residence - about! I already see that you are almost my compatriot (I come from there) - in the south there should be different spices ... And black cardamom (oh I love) and matsis, and all other exotic things I order in online stores.
Having prepared the resin, I make mixtures, signing the jars - for which gingerbread. Yes, you will now beg for baby food jars from your girlfriends, and look for tiny portions of jams in shops or air trains
Well, definitely write down what and how much do you add to the mixture, so as not to cry later, "oh, how delicious and fragrant it turned out last time, but I put something wrong in this one ..."

And those two remaining recipes also excite me: girl_dance: By the way, gingerbread this year inspired the fireplace, homemade balls and new New Year's blankets. : yahoo: Thank you Irochka

Katyusha, good evening!
What a fruitful inspiration you have
I am preparing some gingerbread recipes, hopefully soon.
And I will advise one more beloved by us and our friends: Gingerbread cake


And on the second page, almost at the end of this gingerbread-cake topic, Lavandal showed how gorgeous she turned out to be a gingerbread, not a cake.
The advantage of this recipe is that this gingerbread does not need to be laid back like other gingerbread, 10 hours are enough. But for juiciness, if you don't want a cake, then still make it like Lavandal - at least a layer for soaking (cream + jam)
And it's not difficult to do, the main thing is the availability of ingredients and a mixer-combine. Good luck!

[Irish]

I am preparing some gingerbread recipes

Irishwhen will they appear? I was exhausted all expectantly ...

Exactly, exactly !!! I have been waiting for a long time too. I have already baked almost all the cakes on the site. But I want gingerbread from a specialist in this matter. Nagirochka, please, we are really looking forward to it!

Thank you Irochka, for 4 years I haven’t written anything anywhere in the internet, but this gingerbread attraction did not hold me back!
I have jars, after the child has eaten mashed potatoes, I intentionally leave them - they will always come in handy on the farm :)
So I bought a stone mortar yesterday, searched half of Krasnodar.
And of course not ground spices I immediately decided to use, not everything turned out to be of high quality in my town, but in METRO I really liked Khorek's firms - everything can be seen through transparent jars, I took whole large boxes of cardamom and star anise stars.
Yes, and I will sign the number of measured teaspoons, with a spoon from a bread machine - everything will be for sure.
Wow, it would be faster to start, so I'll take the small one to the Central District and go ahead - peel and crush the spices!
And I also want (and have already done it twice), to use sour cream instead of baking soda, do you think - is this real in the Katarzhinka recipe, and in all the others, which have to lie down for a long time?

[Ho]

So I bought a stone mortar yesterday, searched half of Krasnodar.
And of course not ground spices I immediately decided to use, not everything turned out to be of high quality in my town, but in METRO I really liked Khorek's firms - everything can be seen through transparent jars, I took whole large boxes of cardamom and star anise stars.

It is immediately evident - our man! and got a mortar ...
But I didn't know anything about HoReCa, it turns out that this is not a company, but a special market segment, a sales channel ... it is connected with the hotel and restaurant business in the decoding of the name this is noted: HoReCa - from the first letters Hotel, Restaurant, Cafe / Catering
You always learn something new ... otherwise I was looking for this company, and went to "goods for the HoReCa segment" where all sorts of private traders from all over Russia offer their goods to them for sale
So if their product does not have a manufacturer's brand, then it is difficult to judge about quality without trying it and rely on the consistency of quality.
I like the Hungarian company Kotanyi, it was from them that I tasted real vanilla a few years ago (sugar powder with natural vanilla), until I started ordering in bunches for ebay. And in general, they like everything, even their paprika is excellent in aroma and color (well, the history of the company began with it more than 100 years ago.
And they have the best turmeric for my taste. And their seasoning for apple pie (cinnamon, cloves, lemon, zest, ginger) I use in the dough for gingerbread houses

And I also want (and have already done it twice), to use sour cream instead of baking soda, do you think - is this real in the Katarzhinka recipe, and in all the others, which have to lie down for a long time?

Sour cream for "gingerbread, in general" is good, but for those fermenting for a long time, I would be careful, it is a product that spoils quickly, what bacteria because of it will settle in the dough and will flourish is unknown
I once had an experiment: I read about sourdoughs, I learned how to grow them myself, I knew about the benefits of lactic acid fermentation and that some bread makers imitate sourdough processes by adding lactic acid ... lactic acid ... I will not say anything about how I was looking for where to buy, I will say that - I tried it, the result pleased me in general. About 10 days - it tasted like a well-aged dough. Of course, the experiment cannot be called pure - there was no real Katarzhinka for comparison, by that time everything had been given away and eaten, but I liked the taste and aroma!
But sour cream, in addition to lactic acid, has a lot of other things, how the dough will behave and what kind of microbiological composition it will be - it is not known, it is better to bake other gingerbread with it, of a shorter exposure.

Hello gingerbread fairies!
Let me ask three questions to all knowledgeable and experienced people, please advise:
1) What do you put or what do you lubricate the baking sheet with when you melt the candy caramel in the windows of the gingerbread houses? I grease baking paper grows. oil and still the windows stick and the paper has to be soaked with water.
2) Is it necessary to glaze all parts of the gingerbread. including at the house from the "seamy" side and a clearing-stand, including so that the gingerbread does not dry out in 2 months of standing and admiring. Or we decorate the front sides with painting, and the wrong sides remain, as after baking ...?
3) And in the end, how to revive this delicious gingerbread house for use after aging for 2-3 months so that everyone's teeth remain intact?
I baked blanks for the first small house according to Gerda's recipe, decorated them, and now I will collect them.
Waiting for answers, tips, recommendations :)
Irinka, I would like to know your view of these moments, I have probably come across this more than once. Thank you.

[Viya]

Viya, Hi!

1) I have silicone mats and a thinner special for such incomprehensible moments. silicone / teflon coated sheet
For an experiment, you can try to melt the caramels separately (so as not to waste the dough) - on a sheet greased with wax - after all, gingerbreads used to be baked on a strong honey dough, maybe it will work here too ..

2) Glazing the house - for beauty, not for sealing moisture so that the house does not disintegrate, the dough should be firm after baking. So there is no need to talk about the "soft house"
Of course, it is also impossible to overexpose the dough in the oven, otherwise no restorative methods will help, it will remain furious.
3) And I could easily restore the house in a simple way: put the house in a cold oven for a night or a day, next to it is a bowl-plate of water (in the morning, see the degree of softening). I left the smaller gingerbread cookies in an airtight container with cut apples - there is only 1 moment - the apple should not touch the gingerbread, otherwise it will be like wet dough there.

BUT - even though honey doughs are similar, I have a different recipe, not from Gerda
Actually, I’m on soft gingerbread and the houses are so, for the sake of interest I experimented several times, there is practically no photo, only from the first house, but last year I tried to make a stained glass roof, somewhere there is also a photo, but only roofs .. by the way , kids don't like candy parts very much, they are too hard ...
There is an old photo, I made my first house, according to Teskomovsky forms, as a gift, I knew that if I didn’t take care, it would take a month to gather dust and quickly, only now I thought of packing it into a container - and you can admire it hermetically

🔗 🔗

Thank you, Ira for the answers! That's about melting lollipops on a separate baking sheet, did you mean that then pour the melted caramel into the windows right away, right ???
I have a silicone mat, I knead the gingerbread dough on it - it doesn't stick, it's so cool! I have a lot of things :) I am an amateur pastry chef-eater of cakes and sweets since childhood :)
Apparently you can put it in the oven with a dough with candy windows ?? .. But it's big ...
Now there are 6 variants of dough in the refrigerator, there are repeated and new ones, I try which one tastes better and for which it is better - gingerbread or houses. So far, only one really liked it, the gingerbread cookies are soft, fluffy, light after baking and delicious!
Today I assembled the first house, it remains to decorate with icicles, now I will go, ufff ...
And yet, Irochka, what kind of dough recipe for houses you have - interesting, tasty ?! :) If you can leave the recipe, I will try to bake it.

[Viya]

So far, only one really liked it, the gingerbread cookies are soft, fluffy, light after baking and delicious!

Viya, I'm searching, share a link, please

Here on this page there are two recipes for soft gingerbread that I liked after baking 🔗

Well, the day has come! : yahoo: I'm terribly excited. She pulled the dough out of the refrigerator. It is, of course, dense, but I hope it warms up. And I won't say that it smells strongly, maybe because it is cold ... Glasses something, in general ...

[Catherine]

Catherine, the aroma will then fully unfold in the finished gingerbread. I also have dough on the way, it remains to choose an hour X.

Well, the day has come! : yahoo: I'm terribly excited. She pulled the dough out of the refrigerator. It is, of course, dense, but I hope it warms up. And I won't say that it smells strongly, maybe because it is cold ... Glasses something, in general ...

Katya, don't be jittery, everything will be delicious! and in any case interesting, because this is a new experience
Gala is right - the aroma will pamper during baking (when it cools down, it will be partially sealed again) - and then after another three days it will finally open up

Katya, I have forgotten something - why did you decide to bake so early? For the ripening of the baked three days is enough ... For Catholic Christmas?

So yes, Irish! We are catholics

Eh, tree-sticks, I don’t know ... I baked it, covered it up with plum dregs ... They don’t become tough for me ... Let's wait, of course ... All people with hands are like people ... I don’t know how to bake, and would not start .... Here are all sorts of meats, snacks, twists - it's mine. And maybe nothing else ... It tastes very much)))

[not]

Katya, I came with a valerian, enough to worry, the main thing is the taste! If you like it even without 3 days of ripening, then already great!
And the cakes should not become tough, it's not thin gingerbread cookies or a gingerbread house ...

"Hard after baking the cakes become soft and tender during this time"

Solid - not hard, here is just an emphasis on what usually happens with baked goods in which there is a lot of honey - after cooling it hardens, ceases to be as soft as it happens immediately after taking it out of the oven.
If the tree. your skewer came out dry from the cake during testing, which means that everything is OK, it's finished. The rest is irrelevant.
You avoided the most unpleasant mistake, judging by this softness - you did not shift the flour and your Katazhinka will not be crumbly-cracked
Although I'm wondering, are the cakes really soft left? Smeared with jam BEFORE cooling? Ghee or plain butter in dough?
Katya, let's have another valerian

Oh, Ira, and there was a valerian yesterday, and even a little snot * JOKINGLY * Today I walk, sniff, poke my finger from the side. I took melted butter, smeared the cakes warm, but not cooled down at all. What embarrassed me, they didn't rise as I imagined, I thought they would be higher. She was afraid to overexpose everything, she opened the oven, although it was not yeast dough ...
... And I, loshara, noticed that there were air bubbles in the pan where the dough was standing, so I didn’t press it. Well, okay, let's see. And without you, dear, I would have pulled out all the hairs on my head 10 times.

Katyusha, well, what a sensitive girl ... I just wondered if it was DR in June-July
I didn't find information in our calendar (here on the site)
About insufficient lift when baking - I'm probably at a loss, this can also be dealt with
First, expectations are one thing, but how close are they to my stated volumes ??? I wrote that when baking, they increase in height by 2-3 times. Have the cakes not even grown 2 times? In the same place we have a sufficient amount of soda, and even alcohol plays a big role here ...
You don't need to be equal in the photo, because there (and I wrote about this in the recipe) - my experiments, that is, not 3-layer folding of cakes, but in general - one (due to the embossed shape with flowers) and two layers ( small forms, but thick cakes came out).
The girls who baked and assembled 3 layers according to the recipe (see all pages) - no one had thick cakes.
So focus on a 2-3x magnification. After all, when you put all three cakes on top of each other, it will be quite impressive in height at one time not to bite off everything at once
Katyusha, but about air bubbles - not scary, well, absolutely, completely without them you cannot squeeze the dough into a pot, over the walls it is quite natural. The main thing is that there are no bubbles left in the dough itself.
So I'm waiting for your Katazhinka tomorrow, you can already taste a piece before the final finishing, you can, after all, cut off a little, if you don't stick strictly ...

Irish, my birthday is August 2, so you almost guessed it: girl_wink: I'm generally violent. I'm just an operating surgeon, and like an elephant I am calm at work. I will compensate. : girl_haha: The cakes have risen almost 2 times, I folded it in 2 layers, cut the third one and also folded it in 2 parent layers. Today I want to coat with chocolate icing, the family is asking for it, but we must take a piece. I've thought about alcohol, probably it's about vodka, it was already in the started bottle for a long time, maybe it's exhausted: girl_haha: Yes, and more. Then my honey mixture cooled down very quickly, in less than an hour.
A thermometer will have to be bought, probably a little warmed. And so the cakes are already straight soft, they smell

Happy Christmas to all the girls! I wish you delicious success and good health! I will try my successes tomorrow. Nagira-Irochka, special thanks to you and great happiness to you, wonderful man! Thanks to you, I will bake!

[Katyusha, my Merry Christmas greetings to you and your family! Health and Joy!]

Katyusha, my Merry Christmas greetings to you and your family! Health and Joy!
🔗 🔗

Thank you, Irish !!! Katazhinka is fantastic !!!!

Irisha, brought the current Katarzhinka to show. I was going to pour chocolate on top of it, but I never did. But there are still two things left, maybe I'll do it too.

Girls, Christmas is coming soon !!! I'm starting to get ready))) This year I have bought candied fruits and preserves, no need to look. If anyone needs them in Nizhny Novgorod, I can share candied fruits

Girls, I wonder, but if not vodka, but alcohol ... No one tried it? I mean that Nagira (smack, smack !!!) has alcohol in the recipe, and then we talk about vodka ... I just had very tasty last year, but it rose less than 2 times ... reason ...

[Ekaterina Poznyak]

Ekaterina Poznyak, oh, I would not risk it and diluted the alcohol with water.

[Ekaterina Poznyak]

Ekaterina Poznyak, I did it all the time as in the recipe, with alcohol.

Yes, too, I'm afraid to spoil ... Gala, what kind of alcohol do you take? 70% or 96%?

Ekaterina, I don't remember, tomorrow I'll check with my husband.

Oh thank you! I will wait

Ekaterina, asked her husband, alcohol 96%