Rye custard bread is real (almost forgotten taste). Baking methods and additives

Hello Vanya28 and everyone present here. In the baking business, I am a new person, but until yesterday all the breads from the bread machine (Panas 2502) turned out to be successful, but now I wanted a real rye custard. The bread came out outwardly like nothing, the roof did not fall, though it cracked a little, the crumb was also more or less successful, although I cut it this morning - it sticks a little on the knife. But the taste ... I like the sourness in rye, but it's just natural sourness. I did not deviate from the recipe - everything is in strict accordance with what is described on the first page. Could it be that the ingredients are not correctly measured by me? For example, agram - 35 ml., These are 2 large and 1 small Panasonic measuring spoon, malt 50 ml., - 3 large and 1 small. Or is there something wrong? I don't know what to sin on, but I want to say that we have very hot weather now, the temperature outside is about 40, maybe the bread has soured from the heat. Honestly, I don't know what to think. Perhaps such acidity is the norm for this recipe, but I didn't notice that someone would complain about the sour taste.
In any case, thanks to the author, I will try other Vanya's recipes28.

[I like the sourness in rye, but it's just natural sourness.]

...
I like the sourness in rye, but it's just natural sourness. I did not deviate from the recipe - everything is in strict accordance with what is described on the first page. Could it be that the ingredients are not correctly measured by me? For example, agram - 35 ml., These are 2 large and 1 small Panasonic measuring spoon, malt 50 ml., - 3 large and 1 small. Or is there something wrong?
...

There are two options:
1. They confused Agram light with Agram dark, though in this case the bread should not have risen normally.
2. Individual taste preferences - reduce the amount of acidifier by 2-3 times.

Write and show the result in a cut.

[rye and whole grain rye-wheat 100%]

Hello!
I have a question about whole grain bread. I really want to bake rye and whole grain rye-wheat 100% .
On the forum I found a couple of recipes for sourdough -
(here's an example: Rye-wheat bread 100% whole grain from Viki).
While the number of baked breads can be counted on the fingers, so I'm afraid to bake with sourdough (I need to gain experience with yeast).
In general, please help me to adapt some recipe (by leaps and bounds) for the Panasonic SD-ZB 2502 bread maker, so that you can bake both rye and whole grain rye-wheat 100% with yeast.
Thank you!

[Russell Hobbs Model No 18036]

made a table for a bread maker Russell Hobbs Model No 18036, what can you advise on which modes to bake?

[Russell Hobbs Model No 18036]

made a table for a bread maker Russell Hobbs Model No 18036, what can you advise on which modes to bake?

Great work and important.
It is now quite easy to select programs for baking recipes.
Here are three options for you:
1. Run the program Special, Further everything is automatic, help only to perform the kneading oven.
A baking time of 70 minutes should be sufficient.
2. Program Dough, at the end of the batch, take out the paddle and wait for the end of the rise, then switch to the program Baking 2.
However, 63 minutes is not enough time.
3. The program is also suitable for this bread Wholegrain, the ascent time is half an hour longer, which is important.
Baking time 70 minutes.
Also, check the possibility of adding time Baking 10-20 minutes after the end of any program. If possible, it will be just great.

Write, if you have any questions, we will help!
Show your results.
Success!

the opportunity to add time - no, I tried it, and the trouble is that when you turn on the baking program with the spatula removed, the dough falls off due to rotation,

[add time - no, I tried,]

capabilities add time - no, I tried,and the trouble is, how do you turn on the baking program? with the spatula removed, the dough falls off due to rotation ,

This should not be so if the dough is mixed correctly, but it's okay, you have a program Special.
Everything will work out on her.

Time can be added by taking out the bucket and covering it with a towel, and forcibly cooling the temperature sensor with ice.
The scapula must be removed in advance, since the mode Bakery products at your stove with Kneading.
Everything will take 3-4 minutes. Next, add the baking time + 10 minutes to warm up the oven.

[rye and whole grain rye-wheat 100%]

Hello!
I have a question about whole grain bread. I really want to bake rye and whole grain rye-wheat 100% .
On the forum I found a couple of recipes for sourdough -
(here's an example: Rye-wheat bread 100% whole grain from Viki).
While the number of baked breads can be counted on the fingers, so I'm afraid to bake with sourdough (I need to gain experience with yeast).
In general, please help me to adapt some recipe (by leaps and bounds) for the Panasonic SD-ZB 2502 bread maker, so that you can bake both rye and whole grain rye-wheat 100% with yeast.
Thank you!

Well, since you want to adapt the bread from Viki, let's do it.
Although your fears of inexperience are unnecessary, your eyes are afraid and your hands do.
I already wrote that there are only three stages with baking any bread:
1. Getting (kneading) the dough.
2. Proving dough.
3. Baking bread.
The last two, as a rule, do not cause difficulties.

Recipe from Viki
Whole grain rye sourdough (100%) 300 g
Whole grain rye flour 130 g
Whole grain wheat flour 200 g
Water 230 g
Rye malt extract liquid 1 st. l.
Salt 10 g
Vegetable oil 1 st. l.

Rye malt extract is liquid - I do not use it, as there is dry malt, but this is not of fundamental importance.
With dry malt or malt extract, yeast and dry sourdough (acidifier), this type of bread is easy to make.

I'll take a break here.
Write down which ingredients you already have or which you can quickly buy for them and we will continue to adapt this recipe.

Availability (and availability):
1. Flour - rye, wheat (both whole grain and regular)
2. Rye malt (red fermented - I usually bake with it)
3. Dark Agram (we haven't seen light yet)
4. Well, the rest - of course - yeast, oil, water, salt

At first "gut"original recipe for ingredients:
Whole grain rye sourdough (100%) 300 g = 150 ml. water + 150 gr. rye flour
Whole grain rye flour 130 g
Whole grain wheat flour 200 g
Water 230 g
Rye malt extract liquid 1 st. l. = 15 ml.
Salt 10 g
Vegetable oil 1 st. l.

Whole Wheat Flour 60/40 Recipe
Whole grain rye flour - 130 gr + 150 gr = 280 gr
Whole grain wheat flour - 200 g
Rye malt extract liquid - 15 ml.
Salt - 10 gr
Vegetable oil - 15 ml
Water 230 ml + 150 ml. = 380 ml

further, remove the Liquid Rye Malt Extract - 15 ml and so as not to disturb the balance liquid-dry ingredients add 15 ml to water. Total water = 395 ml.
now, to replace the malt extract, add about 30 g of dry malt to the recipe. and Agram dark no more than 10 gr. Total Additional Dry Ingredients - 40 gr.
Keeping track of the balance liquid-dry ingredients and reduce the amount of any flour by 40 gr.
Add 8-12 grams of dry yeast to the recipe.
Everything is ready.

Kneading 15-20 minutes, if you don't have time to knead, then just Kneading repeat, the gingerbread man should almost be formed and slightly blurry.
Correction of the amount of water in the recipe + - 30 ml. - have to pick up.
Further, the rise of the dough is about 1.5-2 times, no more. This is from 50 minutes to 2-3 hours, as it goes.
To heat up while the dough is rising, you can turn on the baking mode for 1.5-2 minutes every 20 minutes.
As the dough rises, switch to baking - 1 hour 30 minutes.
All.
We show the result large and in section.
The second time, the success will be 100% guaranteed.
The first time, as luck would have it, the bread will be delicious, but the roof may collapse, it strongly depends on experience and different accidents.

Total recipe 60/40 whole wheat flour
Whole grain rye flour - 260 gr
Whole grain wheat flour - 180 gr
Salt - 10 gr
Vegetable oil - 15 ml
Red malt - 30 gr
Agram dark - 10 gr
Dry yeast - 8-12 gr
Water - 295 ml (g) + 100 ml (g) boiling water for brewing malt.
Correction of water in the recipe for local flour + - 30 ml.

Success!

thank you very much for the advice, I will try

[read the answer above through one message]

Availability (and availability):
1. Flour - rye, wheat (both whole grain and regular)
2. Rye malt (red fermented - I usually bake with it)
3. Dark Agram (we haven't seen light yet)
4. Well, the rest - of course - yeast, oil, water, salt

read the answer above through one message

Hello! I bought a Panasonic SD2501 bread machine. Baked wheat-milk according to the recipe. It turned out very well, delicious bread. I would like to bake rye bread. But after reading on the forum, I realized that without certain ingredients it will not work. I bought only peeled rye flour and naively believed that nothing else was needed. Of course I have salt, sugar, water and yeast, otherwise I would not have made wheat bread. Tell me where to buy the ingredients? Let's say malt. After all, I have never encountered him. Thank you!

[where to buy ingredients?]

...
I bought only peeled rye flour and naively believed that nothing else was needed. Of course I have salt, sugar, water and yeast, otherwise I would not have made wheat bread. FROMwhere to buy ingredients? Let's say malt. After all, I have never encountered him. Thank you!

For simple rye bread, you already have everything.
Rye custard bread requires red rye malt; it can be temporarily replaced with dry kvass, for example Saf-. Kvass, malt is present in its composition.
You can also buy all this here on the website in the section - Manufacturers and Trading Houses by postal parcel.
Or by looking at the Countrymen section, where local shops will tell you.

[Brand 3801]

I just took bread from the oven, I have Brand 3801... Dizzy from the fantastic scent

Baking on the manual setting program. There is no incision yet, resting for now ...

Vanya28Thanks a lot for your recipe, tips and advice!

[Brand 3801]

I just took bread from the oven, I have Brand 3801... Dizzy from the fantastic scent

Baking on the manual setting program. There is no incision yet, resting for now ...

Vanya28, thanks a lot for your recipe, tips and advice!

Brand 3801 I did it very well under your guidance!
Great!
Hope it worked out on the first try!

The Brand succeeded on the first try. Here is the cut


The bread is amazing.
Before that, she baked it in Binaton 2169 with varying degrees of success,
but very tasty


Thanks for the real rye bread!

["Gluten Free"]

Rye custard bread is real (almost forgotten taste). Baking methods and additives.
.....
Having finished helping stir the dough, close the lid, take the watch and set the alarm for 60 minutes, this will allow you not to forget to reset the program "Gluten Free" in a bread maker 50 minutes before its end, without lifting the lidotherwise the dough will settle. Resetting the program "Gluten Free", choose the program "Bakery products".

II. Program "Bakery products", set the baking time 1 hour 30 minutes.

Something didn't work in this recipe for my HP Pan-2502. After resetting the '' Gluten-free '' program, the oven on the 'BAKE' 'program did not turn on. : o Indicated overheating - U50. Now it will cool down for 1 hour, only then you can turn it on again. In general, it probably won't turn out bread, but garbage

Something didn't work in this recipe for my HP Pan-2502. After resetting the '' Gluten-free '' program, the oven on the 'BAKING' 'program did not turn on. : o Indicated overheating - U50. Now it will cool down for 1 hour, only then you can turn it on again. In general, it probably won't turn out bread, but garbage

Very strange! We have the same bread maker. We bake in this way regularly - there has never been such a puncture

Good morning everyone on this site! Vanya28, thank you for your patience and your explanations during our conversation, which took place a couple of months ago on Skype (oh, Vanya28, I again threw you questions there).
Only yesterday I received malt, and therefore, since yesterday I fed my rye "eternal" sourdough (1 tbsp. L. Sourdough from the refrigerator + 50g flour and 50g water, after 6 hours again + 50g water and 50g flour), and today I HOPE to bake my first "That same Borodinsky".
Before that, I would like (because of the leaven) help me to correct the recipe:
1. Peeled rye flour -500g (my flour is called "whole grain rye flour", I hope this does not change the matter much?)
2. Dry rye malt -40g
3. Boiling water for malt -100ml
4. Agram 50ml no, there is a leaven - how much to put it? Around 40g?
5. Dark date honey -40ml (how much tbsp. L.? 2 tbsp. L. May be enough?)
6. Water for stirring. honey -100ml
7. Salt -1 tsp.
8. Ground coriander -2 tbsp. l.
9. Dry yeast -2 tsp.
10. Boiled water room. pace. -250ml
Here. I doubt the proportional correctness of the sourdough / flour / water ratios ... If possible, please answer me, I'm looking forward to it! ..

Please, I still have a question! WHY is the bread called "Brewed"? What is being brewed there in general? (Except to steam the malt with boiling water) ...

up to 1/2 cup of wheat flour the taste of rye hardly changes, but the porosity of the crumb noticeably increases.
...
Eternal rye sourdough - 3 tbsp. l
...
Sourdoughs are not enough to get the traditional sweet and sour taste of rye custard bread, but if you like it, then good.
...
1/2 tbsp. l mustard oil ..
...
Oil is a matter of personal taste. In terms of technology, it is not critical here.

if you add more leaven than 3 tablespoons how will it affect?

Very strange! We have the same bread maker. We bake in this way regularly - there has never been such a puncture

Then it is very reassuring that this is not a problem with this HP, but I missed some nuance. Maybe because in the gluten-free program I didn't have time to turn off the baking process, but it lasted only 2 minutes, then I immediately reset the gluten-free program, and the Baking program did not start ...
I will try again, because the bread turned out to be insanely tasty, only the dome has fallen off and the view is unpresentable. Thank you oh colleagues

[and I missed some nuance.]

Then it is very reassuring that this is not a problem of this HP,and I missed some nuance.Maybe because in the gluten-free program I didn't have time to turn off the baking process, but it lasted only 2 minutes, then I immediately reset the gluten-free program, and the Baking program did not start ...
I will try again, because the bread turned out to be insanely tasty, only the dome has fallen off and the view is unpresentable. Thank you oh colleagues

Of course they missed something!
For example, having confused with the choice of the desired combination of programs for 2502 - about the 70th line of the recipe.
It happens!
Write if you still have questions.

[Around 40g?]

Good morning everyone on this site! Vanya28, thank you for your patience and your explanations during our conversation, which took place a couple of months ago on Skype (oh, Vanya28, I again threw you questions there).
Only yesterday I received malt, and therefore, since yesterday I fed my rye "eternal" sourdough (1 tbsp. L. Sourdough from the refrigerator + 50g flour and 50g water, after 6 hours again + 50g water and 50g flour), and today I HOPE to bake my first "That same Borodinsky".
Before that, I would like (because of the leaven) help me to correct the recipe:
1. Peeled rye flour -500g (my flour is called "whole grain rye flour", I hope this does not change the matter much?)
2. Dry rye malt -40g
3. Boiling water for malt -100ml
4. Agram 50ml no, there is a leaven - how much to put it?Around 40g?
5. Dark date honey -40ml (how much tbsp. L.? 2 tbsp. L. May be enough?)
6. Water for stirring. honey -100ml
7. Salt -1 tsp.
8. Ground coriander -2 tbsp. l.
9. Dry yeast -2 tsp.
10. Boiled water room. pace. -250ml
Here. I doubt the proportional correctness of the sourdough / flour / water ratios ...If possible, please answer me, I look forward to! ..

Sourdoughs will need about 200 grams and accordingly reduce the amount of flour and water, and if you put 40 grams, you will have to add 1-2 tbsp. tablespoons of vinegar 6-9% to give a sweet and sour taste.

Starter cultures will need about 200 grams and accordingly reduce the amount of flour and water

Vanya28 means:
1) in the recipe I take 200g of sourdough (and not cold, but already refreshed?)
2) accordingly, from the recipe, I reduce flour and water by 100 g. How then to be with the 50g weight of Agram, provided by the recipe? Where will these 50g go?
And everyone's malt is so strong ... smells like crusts of bread, burnt to ash? Am I doing the right thing, that I pour boiling water over it, stir it, and after a couple of minutes into the dough? It seems to me that the malt changes the structure of the dough into a more viscous sticky one.
Still, I repeat my question - why is the bread called "Brewed"? What do you mean if nothing is brewed there, except for steaming the malt with boiling water? Thanks!

[What is brewed there in general? (Except to steam the malt with boiling water) ...]

Please, I still have a question! WHY is the bread called "Brewed"?What is brewed there in general? (Except to steam the malt with boiling water) ...

This is the brewing process and is very short with malt.
If flour is used instead of malt, the process takes much longer.

if you add more leaven than 3 tablespoons how will it affect?

The sourdough (ripe) greatly changes the crumb for the better, as well as the taste of the resulting bread, giving it a sweet and sour taste.

[respectively, from the recipe, I reduce flour and water by 100 g each]

Vanya28 means:
1) in the recipe I take 200g of sourdough (and not cold, but already refreshed?)
2)respectively, from the recipe, I reduce flour and water by 100 g each... How then to be with the 50g weight of Agram, provided by the recipe?Where will these 50g go?
And malt everyone has so strong .. smells like crusts of bread, burnt to ashes? Am I doing the right thing, that I pour boiling water over it, stir it, and after a couple of minutes into the dough?It seems to me that the malt changes the structure of the dough into a more viscous sticky one.
Still, I repeat my question - why is the bread called "Brewed"? What do you mean if nothing is brewed there, except for steaming the malt with boiling water? Thanks!

You understand everything correctly.
And Agram to keep balance liquid-dry replace with flour.

The sourdough (ripe) greatly changes the crumb for the better, as well as the taste of the resulting bread, giving it a sweet and sour taste.

So, you can ignore 35ml of the recipe sourdough, but take 200g of the grown sourdough and reduce the water and flour?

So you can ignore 35ml of the recipe sourdough, but take 200g of the grown sourdough and reduce the water and flour?

Yes, you can do that.

Yes, you can do that.

[the bread is ready, I took half the norm, plus 100g of sourdough and minus flour and water for this amount, baked on a special 12 program - not programmable, in the process of raising it was just enough to rise 2 times, 4 hours passed since I took out bread from the bread machine, for kind of cracked and slightly lowered roof, slightly stuck to the knife, finely porous and wet in the middle of the brick, there is probably a bit too much liquid and perhaps the baking time should be added, especially if you take a whole rate, please advise

Vanya 28, but tell me please_if I, instead of agram, add 2 tbsp of custard to the rye custard. l vinegar, is it necessary to adjust the liquid (water) downward? The dough turned out, compared to the video course, a little thinner

I've been looking at this bread for a long time. I have a Hitachi 303 stove. I don't have a full process for 3 hours. There are main 4h10m, 3h50m and 2h50m. Will the dough end up on the main mode? And the 3h50m mode is probably not suitable. Will the mode be enough for 2h50?

[the bread is ready, I took half the norm, plus 100g of sourdough and minus flour and water for this amount, baked on a special 12 program - not programmable, in the process of raising it was just enough to rise 2 times, 4 hours passed since I took out bread from the bread machine, for kind of cracked and slightly lowered roof, slightly stuck to the knife,finely porous and wet in the middle of the brick, there are probably a lot of liquids and perhaps the baking time should be added, especially if you take a whole rate, please advise

If the weight is reduced by half, then 70 minutes of baking is enough.
Reduce the amount of water by 30 ml next time and you will be fine.
Show the photo in large section for a more accurate guide.

Vanya 28, but tell me please, if I, instead of agram, add 2 tbsp of custard to the rye custard. l vinegar, is it necessary to adjust the liquid (water) downward? The dough turned out, compared to the video course, a little thinner

Correction in this case is required.
Reduce the amount of water by 50 ml (2 tablespoons of vinegar),
and replace Agram with flour, so as not to calculate the new amount of water for this case.

[Admin]

I've been looking at this bread for a long time. I have a Hitachi 303 stove. I don't have a full process for 3 hours. There are main 4h10m, 3h50m and 2h50m. Will the dough end up on the main mode? And the 3h50m mode is probably not suitable. Will the mode be enough for 2h50?

If you show the plate of program modes for kneading, raising and baking times, then it will be very easy to pick up or give advice.
If it is difficult to find the plate, refer to Admin, she has the same model.
As soon as you figure it out, come and help.

BREAD / MIX BREAD - Time mode 4.10 hours for baking bread and bread with additives
BREAD RAPID - time mode 2.50 hours for baking quick bread and rye bread.
WHOLE WHEAT BREAD - time mode 3.50 minutes for baking wheat bread (main mode)
DOUGH - time mode 1.40 hours for kneading dough without baking bread.
SAKE - 75/85 minutes for baking confectionery (muffins, biscuits).
JAM - time mode 70 minutes, for making jams.
PIZZA - 52 minutes in time, for making pizza dough. (you can also make dough for noodles and dumplings).

Here is one of the possible options:
DOUGH - knead and take out the spatula.
As soon as the dough is almost ready, turn on SAKE for 85 minutes. The baking time should be enough, I suppose.

If the weight is reduced by half, then 70 minutes of baking is enough.
Reduce the amount of water by 30 ml next time and you will be fine.
Show the photo in large section for a more accurate guide.

Excellent result!
The bread is definitely baked.
Your dough just stood a little bit, you need to reduce the rise time by 15 minutes (in your case it is difficult) and the roof will not fall through or reduce the amount of water, which will also contribute to the rise of the dough to a lower height.
If you have any questions, write.

Excellent result!
The bread is definitely baked.
Your dough just stood a little bit, you need to reduce the rise time by 15 minutes (in your case it is difficult) and the roof will not fall through or reduce the amount of water, which will also contribute to the rise of the dough to a lower height.
If you have any questions, write.

The appearance is good, the taste is damp and soft and, probably due to this, the taste is not very good, I have been baking white bread for a long time on the French program - I get it handsome, the roof is convex and very tasty, so I want to achieve the result on black, especially since the whole family loves black.

The appearance is good, the taste is damp and soft and, probably due to this, the taste is not very good, I have been baking white bread for a long time on the French program - I get it handsome, the roof is convex and very tasty, so I want to achieve the result on black, especially since the whole family loves black.

Maybe your family has a love for rye-wheat bread,
and not to the rye custard?
Try Darnitsky's recipe from Fugasca, section rye-wheat bread.
There is no malt in it and the crumb will not be so soft and moist,
and the roof of the bread will be more convex.

I probably belong to the category of people: "unsuccessful, because they are stupid" .. And of course my first experience of Borodinsky was unsuccessful (and no one except me is to blame!).Yesterday, on the weekend, I found inspiration, I happily rushed between the computer with recipes (I wanted to try a lot and different things), the ciabatta dough for the oven mixed earlier in the mixer and loading the products into the bread maker for Borodino bread. At that moment, unexpectedly (and most importantly, quite inappropriately) a distant aunt called, asking about all the household. And then it flew out of my head - Did I put water in Borodinsky's dough? But I can’t remember .. I remember, I measured it out, and in what dough jabetta or Borodinsk… I don’t remember, at least crack it! I decided that if the HP will be hard to twist, then there is no water there. I put a laptop with video mixing next to it and check it. My malt is much darker than Vanilla and the dough is also much darker than in the video mix, and steeper (and my malt makes the dough cooler). I took and poured the water a little bit. Of course, the dough rose during the rise, but during baking everything thumped down, a hole was formed in the center, which proved that I still initially poured water. I also made a difference in the recipe - for some reason I suddenly decided not to put the sourdough, and the bread tasted bland without sourness. It also tasted of burnt soot - my husband and I decided that the malt was very strong (I tried it in other recipes as well), it should be further reduced.
In short, this time will be considered invalid. Now, like an obedient student, I sat down, counted and wrote down the ingredients on a leaf in order (so as not to jump in the recipe in dismembering dry-wet, Vanya28 advised the bookmark on the contrary: yeast, then everything is dry, liquid on top):
1. dry yeast -2h. l.
2. Ground coriander -2 dimensional st. L. (mine did not pray, ran to buy in a neighboring store)
3.salt -1h. l.
4. Sourdough 100% -200g
5. Rzh malt. -30 mg
6. Boiling water for brewing malt -100 mg
7. Dark honey. -50 ml
8. Water, stir honey -100 mg
9. Rzh flour. - 500g minus 100g (from sourdough) = 400 and + 10g (from malt) and + 50 g (instead of agram) = 460g
10. Water 250ml minus 100g. (From the leaven) = 150g.
Only now I am fighting the oven. I have something with the leaven. I kept it in the refrigerator, then I read on the forum that it was bad and should be kept on the surface. I keep it in the kitchen. Only at what temperature do you keep it on the surface? We are now at 32-34 degrees. A couple of days ago I fed her. And today it smells like acetone and bubbles like a dough. I somehow don’t come out with sourdough bread, even if you crack it! Before baking now, I once again fed my sourdough 50g rye. flour + 50g water. I think we should let her wait a couple of hours, and then knead the dough? ..
Vanya28, I chronically (6 times already) DO NOT get Darnitsky bread according to GOST Viki.
https://Mcooker-enn.tomathouse.com/in...on=com_smf&topic=100332.0
She stood the dough for a long time, almost does not rise. Both in the HP and in the oven baked (on a stone!) - the result is the same: a heavy, undisturbed piece of dough, like a stone, sour taste - disgusting
After the unsuccessful Borodinsky, I decided to dispose of a large amount of sourdough and baked AGAIN UNSUCCESSFUL:
Sieve for HP for 400 g of sourdough (100%) from Raisin:
4007 starter culture
250g white flour
1 tsp salt
2 tbsp. l. Sahara
70g water
0.5 tsp yeast
In the evening, the dough did not rise much, so overnight in the refrigerator, but this did not help either. In the morning so badly raised and baked. Vanya 28, can you still send the leaven to the refrigerator? Maybe I'm not using it "at that time" in the dough?

...
In the evening, the dough did not rise much, so overnight in the refrigerator, but that did not help either. In the morning so badly raised and baked. Vanya 28, can you still send the leaven to the refrigerator? Maybe I'm not using it "at that time" in the dough?

Sourdough, this is not dry yeast, requires carefulness, especially since it is good there - hot.
And a big break in feeding - 2 days.
Now I will write how to work with it correctly in this case and everything will work out ...
An approximate scheme -
1.50 g flour + 50 g water + 1-2 g yeast + additives to taste
2. - 6.25 g flour + 25 g water every 12 hours
put it in the refrigerator for 4 days
6-8 hours before use, remove from the refrigerator and refreshen by adding
25 grams of flour + 25 grams of water.
Total: 400 g of starter culture.

Raising the dough at 32-35C for about 2-3-4 hours.

If the starter culture turns out to be rather weak, then adding 0.5-1 g of yeast solves the problem.

And everything needs to be written down, and the cut should be photographed - this is to help in working on mistakes.

Thank you, Vanya28, I'm waiting. I'm not breeding Borodinsky yet. The sourdough has already been fed for two hours, but it does not increase, it is bubbly inside. She looks alive and working, but something does not pull bread. Maybe she was "digested" by +35 in the apartment? The ciabats in the oven on sourdough turned out, slightly blurred, but this is the first time.
But I can be proud - I am! itself! baked buns in the oven according to GOST from my childhood for 9 kopecks! I do not know if they are now, but my husband, as he came home from work at 22.00 - and for hot buns - nostalgic! Delicious! So far we are not threatened to build ...

Think I should throw out my starter and start a new one? Mine did 100: 100, but in three days in the summer heat, and in the refrigerator. Once a week I fed them .. Then they said, it is not necessary to store in such a volume in the refrigerator, no more than 1 tbsp. l. And I had her ... that the dogs were not cut. All. While you are answering whether to raise a new one, I will go from the fed one and put Borodinsky. Can not wait to.. .

Vanya28, wait, come on .. The sourdough of the sourdough type still smells like acetone. This is the end?

if acetone, most likely it was gone

Vanya28, wait, come on .. The sourdough of the sourdough type still smells like acetone. This is the end?

If not a strong smell of acetic acid, then this is normal, but the smell of acetone, if not confused, is alarming.
And you are completely confused in the numbers.
A spoonful of sourdough, when used as a Starter for making dough, and then raising the dough, of course, will raise the dough, but with rye-custard or Borodino, this is not enough to get a sweet and sour taste.
Starter cultures here require 200-300 grams or you will have to add sugar, honey, molasses, vinegar, or citric or lactic acid.

You need to decide on the recipe and the way to achieve the goal.

It's me again .. The bread maker is kneading, the dough is very steep (all according to the above recalculation, according to the electric scales). You wrote that a kolobok is not formed from rye. flour. I just have gypsum cement. I added 50g of water - and at the same time a persistent bun, the bottom of the bucket is completely dry, the dough does not even stick to your hands. The first batch has passed, now the dough is resting. Afraid to add more water after yesterday's story. This is probably how the malt distorts the consistency. Or the rye flour is not that (I have whole flour).
The recipe is here (you helped me recalculate):

1. dry yeast -2h. l.
2. Ground coriander -2 dimensional st. L. (mine did not pray, ran to buy in a neighboring store)
3.salt -1h. l.
4. Sourdough 100% -200g
5. Rzh malt. -30 mg
6. Boiling water for brewing malt -100 mg
7. Dark honey. -50 ml
8. Water, stir honey -100 mg
9. Rzh flour. - 500g minus 100g (from sourdough) = 400 and + 10g (from malt) and + 50 g (instead of agram) = 460g
10. Water 250ml minus 100g. (From the leaven) = 150g.
More details: https://Mcooker-enn.tomathouse.com/in...tion=com_smf&topic=9345.0

My leaven is gone. I'll start a new one. And what is your opinion on the fact that the necessary bacteria die in the sourdough in the refrigerator? And if on the 4th day the leaven is in the refrigerator, then on the same day you can use part of it right now without feeding "7 hours before use"?

Well, and a "spoonful of leaven" for storage in the refrigerator - I mean, not me, but many referees from the Internet, that it is enough to activate it. For example, the recipe should contain 200g of sourdough, which means that you feed + 100g of flour and 100g of water to a spoon, so 200g of sourdough will come out in the recipe and the spoon will be returned to storage in the refrigerator. This is what I understood. So they recommend putting an updated spoonful of sourdough in the refrigerator, and not keeping 400g constantly.
But I do not argue, I listen and learn.
Vanya28, in the new future sourdough, when you take it out of the refrigerator, do you consider feeding it all, or taking away a part and feeding that part?
I was just desperate. I asked questions about sourdough so many times, both in the subject of sourdough and in the subject of Darnitsky bread for GOST, but they did not answer me (either everyone left on vacation, or tired). I had to shove through numerous pages of the forum until 2 am, looking for similar problems and advice to them.
Here is a recipe for a sourdough that I somehow fell in love with:

1st stage:

100 grams of rye flour and 100 ml. Stir warm water in a bowl, cover and keep in a warm place for 24 hours at a temperature of about 30 *.
The lactic acid bacteria contained in the dough multiply.

2nd stage:
add another 100 g of rye flour and 100 ml of warm water, stir everything. Leave to distance for 24 hours at room temperature. 25 *.
In this case, acetic acid is formed, an aroma will appear.

3rd stage:

now add 200 g of rye flour and 200 ml of warm water and the mixture is allowed to stand for another 24 hours.
Dough fermentation takes place, acid and aromatic substances develop in an optimal amount.

After three days, the fermentation process will end and the leaven can be used to prepare the dough:

The amount indicated in the recipe is weighed and added to the flour and other ingredients.
From the remaining amount, remove about 2 handfuls and place in a glass jar with a screw cap. Store in a cool place for about a week.
In addition, the leaven can be frozen, then all activity in it will cease.
Only in warmth, with the addition of liquid, with the use of air and rye flour, does it again acquire activity and the ability to ferment.
If the leaven is inoculated all the time in this way, it will live for 100 years and will be passed on from generation to generation thanks to the regularly repeating baking days.
More details: https://Mcooker-enn.tomathouse.com/in...option=com_smf&topic=41.0

And will the leaven with the addition of 1-2 g of dry yeast be constant? I read that it is impossible to store the leaven with yeast for more than a month, is that so? I need a high-quality one, and so as not to grow it every month. because a considerable amount of bread baking is expected.

[small scope]

It's me again .. The bread maker is kneading, the dough is very steep (all according to the above recalculation, according to the electric scales). You wrote that a kolobok is not formed from rye. flour. I just have gypsum cement. I added 50g of water - and at the same time a persistent bun, the bottom of the bucket is completely dry, the dough does not even stick to your hands. The first batch has passed, now the dough is resting. Afraid to add more water after yesterday's story. This is probably how the malt distorts the consistency. Or the rye flour is not that (I have whole flour).
Here's the recipe (you helped me recalculate): My leaven is gone. I'll start a new one. And what is your opinion on the fact that the necessary bacteria die in the sourdough in the refrigerator? And if on the 4th day the leaven is in the refrigerator, then on the same day you can use part of it right now without feeding "7 hours before use"?

Do not rush to add water, if you do not have time to make a normal batch, then repeat it by adding then more water.
What he wrote about leaven refers to custard bread.
On the 4th day, the leaven is ready, it is either in the refrigerator, or by pre-feeding it for work again 6-8 hours before use.
If you are already using 400 grams from the refrigerator, then feed the whole 6-8 hours before use and divide it into the necessary parts immediately before kneading the dough, sending the unclaimed part back to the refrigerator or before growing.
Of course, there are different clowns here - well, what beneficial bacteria die from the leaven in the refrigerator?
FROM small scope apparently not stopping spying!
The main flora there is yeast!
Well, a few things will die, so for this, refreshing (feeding with flour) of the sourdough is used a few hours before the main use, this is to restore the amount of yeast and activate it from hibernation.

Vanya28, I rewrote the previous question (above) for sourdough. Do you think it's better for me to make it with yeast? I just liked the words "eternal leaven" .. But probably you shouldn't bang your head against the wall 2 times.
I don’t know about bacteria (I have a different profession), but they wrote that the necessary lactic acid products die in the refrigerator, and harmful acid ones multiply. Ugh on them at all, I have so many bags of flour went to torment with sourdough!
P.S. 1 hour 10. dough on the kneading program, turned it off and on again first and added another 50g of water. All the same, the dough is a bun, it does not remain on the fingers. my poor 2 screws in HP ..