Luke
I can talk about leavens for a long time. They are like domestic cats. I raise them ...

It doesn't matter what kind of flour to make the so-called "starter": wheat, whole, rye ... And it doesn't matter what sourdough is used for which bread to bake: from rye - wheat, or vice versa. Therefore, do not bother making different starters, one is more than enough. True, there is a nuance: the easiest way to grow the right culture is from rye flour: it retains the most beneficial microorganisms and bacteria. In refined wheat, they are almost absent, so it is very difficult to grow sourdough from it: it constantly strays towards the pathogenic flora. You have to throw it away.

In short, in short, the recipe is as follows:

Eternal leaven

1 day
100 g flour and 100 g water (maybe a little less)
Stir well. You should get a pasty mass, like thick market sour cream.
We cover with a damp towel and put it in a very warm place without skewers (I put it in a cabinet, it has a battery instead of a back wall. The builders are bastards! - missed it. Nothing can be stored - but the dough stands perfectly!)
The starter should wander for about a day. Until the appearance of small, albeit rare, but bubbles. It makes sense to stir it sometimes.

2nd day
Now the leaven needs to be fed. To do this, again add 100 g of flour and add water so that its consistency returns to the original state of market sour cream. We cover with a towel and put it in a warm place for another day.

Day 3
As a rule, now there are no questions: there are not just bubbles on the surface of the leaven: it grows strongly in size and all consists of such a foam cap. We feed her one last time. And again with warmth. Here is a very important point: the leaven is already strong enough and we need to catch the moment when it will be at its "peak of shape": that is, it should be satisfied. At this moment, she is as strong as possible. We divide it into poplam.

The first half is our eternal leaven. We put it in a jar with a polyethylene lid with holes in it (to breathe) and put it in the refrigerator until next time.

And let's put the other half into action ...

How to store starter culture
Vasilich

Sourdough bread without yeast is what you should strive for.
After buying a bread maker, I tried many different recipes for baking bread, both from the collection of recipes in the instructions for the bread maker, and taken from the site "".
As a result, I came to the conclusion:
- bread should be baked from rye flour or wheat flour of 1-2 grades, that is, with a large amount of bran for the normal functioning of the digestive tract
- bread made from premium flour, although it rises better, is only suitable for baking
-It is best to bake sourdough bread without adding a single gram of yeast.
To complete this program, I prepared an "eternal" leaven from Luca, taken from this site, and began to gradually reduce the amount of yeast in the basic bread recipe by 500g. for x / p Panasonic SD-255.
As a result, I came up with a recipe, which I published on the site under the name "Bread from flour of the 1st grade with sourdough".
there really is not a gram of yeast in it, it rises well, I like to add milk whey instead of water.
The bread is baked for 6 hours, this is important, for the Panasonic SD-255 it is the "French" program. In this program, the time for kneading and raising the dough is increased, which also affects the quality of the bread for the better.
So, an industrial bakery is quite suitable for baking sourdough bread exclusively.
About leaven:
stored in the refrigerator. Before baking, I take it out, feed it - 3 tablespoons of rye flour and 100 g of warm water, rises to the top of a liter jar - I start laying products according to the recipe, and the remaining leaven - in the freezer for 1-2 hours.
sometimes I take it out only in the morning, transfer it to the refrigerator until the next time.
It is not burdensome, and it is worth the result - the bread is exactly what I was striving for.
loric
Question to Luke and everyone who has THE SURVEY IS PRODUCED
I decided to make an eternal leaven, but on the 3rd day after feeding (I did everything according to the basic one from Luke), the leaven did NOT rise, as described by the pros, just small bubbles and that's it.
At this stage, keep on days 4 and 5 without changes.
Everything works on wheat, but not on rye. Is this fact possible because of the flour? And how much should it grow? As I understand it - just 2 times and a hat, and so - how long after feeding THIS fact should happen?
If not difficult - give advice plizzzz.
Admin

Stumbled upon a cooking book uterine starter culture.

Nutritious, tasty and aromatic bread is made from sourdough.
Sourdough is sour, that is, fermented dough.

With regular bread baking, it is more profitable to make the sourdough yourself. This is not difficult at all, especially since you need to cook it only for the first baking, and for all subsequent ones, just leave a little dough for the last time and use it as a leaven. It turns out, as it were, "perpetuum mobile".

1st stage:

100 grams of rye flour and 100 ml. Stir warm water in a bowl, cover and keep in a warm place at a temperature of about 30 * for 24 hours.
The lactic acid bacteria contained in the dough multiply.

2nd stage:


add another 100 g of rye flour and 100 ml of warm water, stir everything. Leave to distance for 24 hours at room temperature. 25 *.
In this case, acetic acid is formed, an aroma will appear.

3rd stage:

now add 200 g of rye flour and 200 ml of warm water and the mixture is allowed to stand for another 24 hours.
Dough fermentation takes place, acid and aromatic substances develop in an optimal amount.

After three days, the fermentation process will end and the leaven can be used to prepare the dough:

The amount indicated in the recipe is weighed and added to the flour and other ingredients.
From the remaining amount, remove about 2 handfuls and place in a glass jar with a screw cap. Store in a cool place for about a week.
In addition, the leaven can be frozen, then all activity in it will cease.
Only in warmth, with the addition of liquid, with the use of air and rye flour, does it again acquire activity and the ability to ferment.
If the sourdough is intertwined in this way all the time, then it will live for 100 years and will be passed on from generation to generation thanks to regularly recurring baking days.

Gypsy
AdminWhich book is this recipe from?
loric
Admin
And immediately the question is - is this the same thing that Luca gave in the subject of eternal leaven?
Another would be to find a place in the apartment with a tempo. 30 degrees. It's cold in St. Petersburg and I'm afraid I won't be able to do it again.
I'd rather raise your kefir, it doesn't let me down at least,
slightly but growing.
Admin
Quote: gypsy

AdminWhich book is this recipe from?

This book is called Home Baking Bread, by Margaret Merzenich and Erica Tyr, 127 page small book, recipe on page 67.
Today I decided to glue the pages in it (they crumble all the time) and came across a sourdough recipe.

Good luck!
Admin
Quote: lorik

Admin
And immediately the question is - is this the same thing that Luca gave in the subject of eternal leaven?
Another would be to find a place in the apartment with a tempo. 30 degrees. It's cold in St. Petersburg and I'm afraid I won't be able to do it again.
I'd rather raise your kefir, it doesn't let me down at least,
slightly but growing.

It seems to me that we are all going around in a circle with leaven, but the result is that everything is the same, with some deviations.
Tsyganka and Luka have pure rye flour, I have rye flour on kefir. Someone adds more sugar and yeast, etc.
After reading various books and information on the Internet, I come to the conclusion that all leavens are good, that in practice we are inventing a bicycle that has long been there, people have been riding it for a long time. Another thing. that we only now learned about sourdoughs, when we were impatient to engage in bread, and we really want to go the path of inventing the bicycle ourselves.
And I was also convinced that you sit, poke around, look for something, mix something with something, cross, conjure, then "like a king over the leaven, you wither" for many days, but in the end it turns out that this is a long time not news to many on Earth. The news is only for me personally.
Sorry, the last paragraph I wrote to myself, do not consider all coincidences with other persons.
It's fine! When you do it yourself, you learn more useful things.

As it is in Pushkin: "And experience, son of difficult mistakes ..."

I agree with Luca that rye sourdough is the best and simplest, it works like a perpetual motion machine. And where she got this information, I'm sorry, I don’t know. Maybe she also invented the bicycle.
loric
Admin
Thanks for the support!!!!
I am ALWAYS amazed at your erudition in the field of bakery, I am simply amazed to know so many things .... Super !!! Taking off my hat!!!!
Admin
Quote: lorik

Admin
Thanks for the support!!!!
I am ALWAYS amazed at your erudition in the field of bakery, I am simply amazed to know so many things .... Super !!! Taking off my hat!!!!

Mercy, merci, I just read a lot of useful literature, especially when my soul is on fire (in the sense of baking) and my mind is not enough.
Gypsy
Quote: Admin

This book is called Home Baking Bread, by Margaret Merzenich and Erica Tyr, 127 page small book, recipe on page 67.
Thank you. And what else is there useful in it? Is it worth buying? Or is there more information like this on the internet?
Admin
Quote: gypsy

Thank you. And what else is there useful in it? Is it worth buying? Or is there more information like this on the internet?

Yes, the same as that of others, for example, Rodionova. For example, I compared the text of Rodionova and Masha Kafka, one can say one to one, the difference is that Kafka has a colorful photo album and is licensed. Although it is certainly interesting to read. But no one tells in detail how to make koloboks and cope with rye bread. As if such a phenomenon. like a bun and not available. In this regard, many thanks to Pokhlebkin and Lazerson - I learned from them (see the section Bread is the head of everything)
Yutan
For me, the leaven also costs three days and has stopped rising. What to do?
I've already added sugar. Made with rye flour. The first time, it really doubled. After feeding, I keep it in a warm place - while in the bathroom near the battery - the warmest place in the apartment. And she, the infection, is not from the place. Has ceased to rise.
Yutan
I tried to make sourdough on peeled rye flour (Sokolnicheskaya). Made exactly according to Luca's recipe. The first day she stood - played, bubbled, rose in volume, there was a "hat" on top. I fed them with water and rye flour, stopped bubbling. I put it in the bathroom to the radiator. The next day I began to listen - is it bubbling, is the sound of bubbling slash. It seemed that I hear characteristic sounds. I fed again. I put it on the third day in a warm place. But the bubbling stopped. I added a little sugar. I interfered with everything with a wooden spatula. It costs four days without changing the volume. What am I doing wrong?
Admin

You will not hear any bubbles.
I recommend opening Jamie Oliver's rye bread recipe, it was made by Gypsy, everything is painted there in pictures and with comments, a very interesting experience of growing sourdough.
Yutan
: red: I have another question about the "eternal" leaven. The first sourdough worked for about a month and ordered to live long. Then there was such a lively, bubbling leaven in the fridge, suddenly, I open the fridge, anticipating that now I’ll start to put another yeast-free bread, and the leaven does not bubble, the smell is strange, sour. I put it in the heat to raise the leaven, but it didn't even make a squeak, the smell of sour wine. I threw it away. I put a new one. On the first day she began to play, got up (stood by the battery). On the second day, I fed her and left her there. But she stopped playing and again, it seems, skipped a beat. She took peeled rye flour. Boiled warm water. plastic container. Stirring spatula - silicone scraper from Taperver.
I don’t understand what the mistake is !!! But the second leaven in a row goes bad. It means that I am doing something wrong. Living bacteria die. Tell me please.
yulcha
With the leaven in the refrigerator, what to do next.
CityMirage
Thank you for the wonderful "recipe" of eternal leaven. My rye flour makes me very happy and I already treat it like a native

But recently I decided to try to make it on wheat as well.
The day is standing - puffing on the sly, so delicate, weak, second ... I wrapped it in a kitchen towel and put it by the radiator - so that it would not dry out and be warm ...

Yesterday I come ... the smell in the room is strange ...
I look at the leaven ... and finally understand what the "peak" is: wow: from the aquasca, which they talked about, advising to use it at this time.

I am attaching a photo. The towel will soak in the basin.


DSC00007.JPG
"Eternal" leaven
yulcha
A-uuuuuuuuu !!! Tell me what to do with the leaven that is in the refrigerator? Respond, good people !!!
CityMirage
What to do with it?
Start feeding 2 days in advance for baking and on baking day too

At the beginning of the topic, the rules of leaving are described
Dolce
I decided to make my first sourdough. Last night I mixed 100 g of peeled rye flour and 100 ml of water. I put it to the battery. I attached a thermometer nearby - it showed 30 degrees. In the morning I look - it has already begun to bubble - there are not many bubbles, but throughout the entire volume. Slightly increased in volume. Got a little fluffier. Glass jar, visible through the walls - "fluffiness" throughout. But the day has not yet passed.
The question is whether it is necessary to keep the sourdough warm for a day, or it is already possible to feed and mix. Or maybe remove it from the battery so that the process does not go so quickly?
Tell me what to do best, please!
Dolce
The leaven is growing! It has already doubled. All! Went to feed her!
Dolce
6 hours have passed after the first feeding - again full of small bubbles, increased by 2 times. What to do - feed or just interfere, and feed tomorrow (ie, 24 hours after the previous feeding)?
Dolce
It's a pity that no one hears me ((((((((
I was happy early. After being fed for the first time, she began to grow again. I moved it from the battery to the table. It's 27 degrees, a little cooler. Stirred. The leaven has calmed down and is silent. Since then, I have fed her 2 more times once a day, mixed in between feedings 1 time. My leaven is silent. Rare large bubbles of 3-4 mm appear. But it doesn't grow. The color is creamy grayish, as in the beginning. Doesn't stink.
The idea is to start the act of fermentation now ... But .... ??
Thank you if someone responds))
Admin
Quote: Dolce

I decided to make my first sourdough. Last night I mixed 100 g of peeled rye flour and 100 ml of water. I put it to the battery. I attached a thermometer nearby - it showed 30 degrees. In the morning I look - it has already begun to bubble - there are not many bubbles, but throughout the entire volume. Slightly increased in volume. Got a little fluffier. Glass jar, visible through the walls - "fluffiness" throughout. But the day has not yet passed.
The question is whether it is necessary to keep the sourdough warm for a day, or it is already possible to feed and mix. Or maybe remove it from the battery so that the process does not go so quickly?
Tell me what to do best, please!

Open the rules for the formation and feeding of "uterine starter culture", follow it.
I read somewhere that the leaven has the greatest strength in 16-18 hours after the third feeding, and then the strength decreases sharply.
Therefore, you need to use this when making bread, or put it in the refrigerator for storage.
Admin

The most important thing is not to get nervous!

The leaven can manifest itself in different ways, and bubble, and be silent. It is advisable to stir it more often with a fork (teeth).
There may be few bubbles on the surface, and inside when you stir, the dough is elastic - compare in consistency with yeast dough for pies, but only liquid.
If you are doing it for the first time, then be patient and observe her behavior more.
Take as a basis the behavior of the kefir sourdough (I wrote a lot about it) or the uterine sourdough (see the website)
In principle, the behavior of both starters is the same, choose which one is closer to you.
The strongest, strongest starter culture is obtained after 5-7 additional dressings (cycles).

Good luck!
Dolce
Thank you Admin for responding))
I waited for the rapid growth to begin. But my leaven is just bubbling, it grows a little - 1-2 cm above the mark (I draw a line on the jar with a felt-tip pen after mixing). Already 5 times fed - no noticeable growth is observed -1-2 cm and that's it. The color has not changed either - grayish-beige as before. The smell has become noticeably sour. Do you recommend the refrigerator? But is it possible to use such a leaven, as you think ?.
Dolce
Hurray !!! My leaven is ripe! I baked my first rye bread with my own sourdough.
The leaven was made according to the recipe of the eternal leaven from Luca. Only at first she did not want to mature in any way. On the third day, she was still slowly puffing, but not growing. But I continued to feed her and disturb her once a day. And somewhere after the 7th feeding, the process went more actively. Although not as violent as others. To clarify, the volume of the sourdough increased by about half (after the next feeding it was 8 cm in a three-liter jar, then it grew to 12 cm), then the sourdough dropped a little by 2 cm, that is, it began to take 10 cm from the bottom in the jar. Once she rose, and then she fell off without any interference, then I thought that the leaven was ready.
Based on the recipe for 100% rye bread with hop sourdough
https://Mcooker-enn.tomathouse.com/in...smf&Itemid=26&topic=870.0
changing some details (ratio and composition of flour, amount of water)

So my recipe is:

Starter culture - 3.5 measuring cups
Peeled rye flour - 250 g
Wheat flour grade - 300 g
Vegetable oil - 2 tablespoons. spoons
Salt - 1.5 tsp.
Brown sugar - 1 tbsp l
Water - 200 ml
Yeast -3/4 teaspoon
A handful of coreander seeds are lightly crushed in a mortar. Added along with flour.

I decided to add yeast all the same for fear that the zavkaska is young, has not yet gained strength, besides, bread with rye flour rises more difficult than pure wheat bread. But the yeast took less than usual, an incomplete teaspoon.
I put wheat flour for the same reasons, to facilitate the lifting process.
What is the percentage of rye flour? If we take into account that the sourdough consists of flour and water 50:50, then rye flour in sourdough turned out to be about 250-280 g. So. If you divide the leaven into flour and water, then you get 500-530 g of rye flour, 300 g of wheat flour, and 375 ml of water.

I threw it all into a bucket, turned on such a program (kneading for 15 minutes + lifting for 1 hour + deboning for 20 seconds)
The contents of the bucket were well kneaded into a beautiful smooth bun, nothing needed to be added, no water or flour. After rising for an hour, the dough took up 3/4 of the bucket. After deboning, I climbed inside, pulled out the mixer - I no longer need it. The gingerbread man was almost not sticky on top, inside the dough was more sticky. She straightened the dough, smoothed the top with a wet hand, sprinkled with crushed coreander.

Next, I programmed my Delonghi for a long rise and bake:

warming up half an hour,
batch -0,
first ascent -99 min,
boning -0,
second ascent -99 min
second boning - 0
third ascent - 99 min
oven - 1 hour
In total, we got 5 hours and 27 minutes of ascent at 35 degrees.

I launched this program and began to observe.
In just an hour, the contents began to crawl out of the bucket, cracks appeared on the surface. I decided it was time to bake. Such a long ascent was not required. I intervened in the program, reduced the rise time, went baking. In the process of baking bread a little donkey by 1-2 cm. Here's what I got!
Eternal leaven

And this is in the context
Eternal leaven

I really liked the taste. It was THE MOST BREAD with THE MOST SURFACE !!! The very taste that our compatriots abroad love to remember. I was visiting Izrailovka, I tried a bunch of rye breads there, allegedly baked according to original Russian recipes - for some reason none of them had this unique sourness. (((
I thought it was an almost impossible task. But for some reason such bread is baked in Russia !!!
And I got this bread!
Now I understand that sourdough gives this sourness.
Now I will gradually reduce the amount of yeast, so that in the end I will bake bread with only one sourdough, when it gains enough strength to rise.
Admin

Well done!

Just note that without yeast in a bread maker, it is very difficult to bake rye bread even with sourdough. Not enough time for proofing. Proofing on one starter culture can take up to 10-14 hours.

Good luck!
Dolce
I continued experimenting with everlasting leaven.
The second bread was also rye, the recipe was the same as the first one, only I put in even less yeast - only half a teaspoon.
It also came up quickly - 1 hour after kneading, then boning and another hour. The total ascent time is 2 hours. It turned out exactly like the first one.

My next experiment is bread without yeast at all, on one sourdough.
But this time I decided to make it from white wheat flour in order to test my sourdough in light conditions.

The recipe is as follows:

Wheat flour 500 g
Water 300 ml
Olive oil 2 tbsp spoons
Salt 1.5 tsp
Sugar 1 tbsp. l
Eternal leaven 3.5 heaped tablespoons (how much you can scoop)

Baked in Delonghi bdm125s according to the 4th program. In this program, the rise occurs at a temperature of 35 degrees.
Since I did not know how long it would take to get up, I had to adjust the program along the way.

In the end, this is what happened.

Warm up - 0. I always put warm ingredients. I slightly warm the water

Kneading - according to the program 3 + 20 = 23 min

1st rise - 38 min (according to the program)

Deboning - 20 sec (according to the program)

2nd ascent - 25 + 30 = 55 minutes (added 30 minutes)

2nd boning - 8 sec (according to the program)

3rd rise -50 + 49 + 30 (Added 79 minutes. Since the stove allows you to set the time within 99 minutes, I first added 49 minutes to 99, then I had to interrupt the program, set another 30 minutes for the rise and then 1 hour for baking)

T. about. in total, the bread went up for 4 hours and 12 minutes.

Next time I'll try to increase the time of the 1st and 2nd ascent even more, maybe then the third ascent will keep within 99 minutes)

They say that over time, the leaven becomes stronger, I hope the time will be shortened even more.

Eternal leaven

The bread turned out to be grayish, with a pleasant sourness.

Very tasty!
Dolce
Here you get 500 g of wheat and about 100 g of rye flour. Maybe there is no need to do 2 boning, one is enough, do you think?
Admin
Quote: Dolce

Here you get 500 g of wheat and about 100 g of rye flour. Maybe there is no need to do 2 boning, one is enough, do you think?

If 500 wheat 100 rye, then this is wheat-rye bread, proofing is needed like wheat bread - 2 times.
Dolce
Quote: Admin

If 500 wheat 100 rye, then this is wheat-rye bread, proofing is needed like wheat bread - 2 times.

If I understood correctly, here you need 2 deboning, like wheat bread.

Toda one more question - with what proportion of rye and wheat flour rye bread "begins" and one deboning is needed?
Rustic stove
Quote: Dolce

Toda one more question - with what proportion of rye and wheat flour rye bread "begins" and one deboning is needed?

If you look at the recipes from the HP recipe book
- then the "rye" program is used with the following proportions:

wheat - 225g / rye - 325
wheat - 300g / rye - 260
wheat - 225g / rye - 200
wheat - 150g / rye - 390
That is, the content of rye flour relative to the total amount of flour is from 40% and more.

But it is interesting that at the same time it is proposed to make the dough on the rye mode in the proportion where rye flour makes up only 18% of the total amount of flour (recipe for Danish bagels):
wheat - 400g / rye - 90
Admin
Quote: Rustic stove

If you look at the recipes from the HP recipe book
- then the "rye" program is used with the following proportions:

wheat - 225g / rye - 325
wheat - 300g / rye - 260
wheat - 225g / rye - 200
wheat - 150g / rye - 390
That is, the content of rye flour relative to the total amount of flour is from 40% and more.

But it is interesting that at the same time it is proposed to make the dough on the rye mode in the proportion where rye flour makes up only 18% of the total amount of flour (recipe for Danish bagels):
wheat - 400g / rye - 90

You just knead the bagels in the oven and bake them in the oven.

Rye dough for bread should have a higher content of rye and other types of flour in relation to wheat flour. In the literature I read that the ratio of wheat and other types of flour can be up to 30-40 wheat, the rest is different flour.
Borodinsky and the like - the ratio is 15 to 85%. But these breads need to be cooked differently and more complicatedly. I already wrote about this on the forum.
Zubastik
I decided to put the sourdough - mixed 100g. peeled rye flour and 100 ml. water - it turned out to be a VERY tight dough, no sour cream and does not smell. She began to add liquid - brought it to the state of chocolate paste.What's wrong? Or should it be? I put the leaven on a plate on the radiator, covered it with a towel, so the towel was already dry, and the mass also began to dry out. On another site I read that the consistency should be pancake. Maybe I have something wrong with flour or scales?
Admin
Quote: Zubastik

I decided to put the sourdough - mixed 100g. peeled rye flour and 100 ml. water - it turned out to be a VERY tight dough, no sour cream and does not smell. She began to add liquid - brought it to the state of chocolate paste. What's wrong? Or should it be? I put the leaven on a plate on the radiator, covered it with a towel, so the towel was already dry, and the mass also began to dry out. On another site I read that the consistency should be pancake. Maybe I have something wrong with flour or scales?

I recommend reading about the activation and behavior of the leaven in the section "Bread is the head of everything". I think a lot will become clear.

TECHNOLOGY AND BIOCHEMISTRY OF RYE BREAD (1959) B. G. SARYCHEV

L. Ya. Auerman (2005) TECHNOLOGY OF BAKERY PRODUCTION.

On my own I will add that I add a little more water, if thick. For 2-3 days, the leaven is loosened like a dough.

Zubastik
Admin, thanks for the recommendations - I'll read it later as time will be. Just now what to do? At the initial stage, what should be approximately the consistency? In general, the mass should be fluid or so thick that it doesn't even crawl when tilted?
By the way, for some reason, my mother says that they used to consider such leavens to be harmful to health, many harmful bacteria develop during the fermentation process, and if you do the leaven, then everything should be super sterile!
Admin
Quote: Zubastik

Admin, thanks for the recommendations - I'll read it later as time will be. Just now what to do? At the initial stage, what should be approximately the consistency? In general, the mass should be fluid or so thick that it doesn't even crawl when tilted?
By the way, for some reason, my mother says that they used to consider such leavens to be harmful to health, many harmful bacteria develop during the fermentation process, and if you do the leaven, then everything should be super sterile!

People have been engaged in sourdough ever since they got out of the caves to catch mammoths, no one has died yet, and the sourdoughs have been inherited and therefore called "uterine", some live for 75 years, and such bread is considered purely Russian. Foreigners have been mastering ferments for a long time. And people don't bake with them now, because it takes much longer than in a bread maker, and besides, there is a lot of yeast on sale.
If you and your mother have such a "squeamish" attitude towards leaven, then it is better not to work with them, it may not work out. Without wanting it, you set yourself up inside for a negative result.

And now, after the allotted time for feeding, add more water than flour according to the amount of water, stir and put in the heat about 35 * until the next feeding, in the interval you can mix once. And watch her behavior.
And sit down to read the material on which I gave you links, or another one on the leaven on the forum.
It should always be sterile in the kitchen, and not only when working with starter cultures. If you want to work with leavens - tune yourself to this, this is a living organism.
That's right, right now you need to read this material, you will not regret it!
Zubastik
Admin, thank you very much for your attention!
To be honest, it even became a little offensive. It seemed that she did not express any disgust, I tried only to find out what consistency the leaven should be at the first stage, immediately after mixing water with flour. The question arose simply because I read on another site and in my booklet that the consistency should be a little thicker than a pancake, and on the first page it says about a pasty mass, which is different for me. And mixing 100g. rye flour and 100 ml. water, I generally got a thick lump of dough.
I would argue about the sterility of the kitchen - I am sure that no one has a sterile kitchen, since I think the concepts of "clean" and "sterile" are still different.
Of course, I read books with pleasure, but when there is time for this and my modem will cease to be malfunctioning to download something from other sites.
And about my starter culture I will say the following - per 100 grams. flour on the first day I poured about 250 ml. water - it turned out to be a thick pouring sour cream, the consistency is like a pancake, you can drain it from a spoon, but it's difficult. I don’t know whether it’s right or not, I’ll continue to mess with her.
Admin

Do not be angry at me!

I read with interest other sites and, in general, any information about leavens, I even try to translate articles. And I see how many people, even amateurs, today turn to leaven and homemade bread. And they just have no fear !!! And there is a great desire to learn how to grow your own starter cultures.

As my child used to say in his distant childhood, "not everything at once."
Patience and a little effort.

Read and go for it!

I wish you success!
Zubastik
Admin, I'm not angry at all !!! On the contrary, many thanks for the advice, recipes and invaluable experience !!!
Finally my sourdough is ripe. For all the time she puffed mediocre, did not run away anywhere, every time after feeding it doubled. The only thing I forgot was to put it in a cooler place on the second day than the battery. It stuck out on my battery for two days, and only on the third did it migrate to the windowsill.
Yesterday evening I kneaded bread - I did everything by sight, without any recipe, only from rye flour. I threw in so many starter cultures that literally 150 ml went into the refrigerator. from the number of the first three stages. I put in a bucket of rye flour, salt, sugar, prunes, dry kvass with breadcrumbs, boiled water, coriander and water. For the first time, I did not dare to do without yeast and added a little less than half a tsp. That's what I did:
Eternal leaven
Eternal leaven
I kneaded the bread in the evening during the Pizza program, then put the bucket in the oven and covered it with a wet towel so as not to dry. In the morning I turned on baking for 60 minutes.
The bread is still hot, was cut right after baking, so it crumpled a little.
The bread has a distinct sour taste, similar to that of a store. Whether I like it or not, I still don't understand. It is necessary to cool down completely.
In general, I liked the result, it is unlikely that pure rye flour would give me such a result, even for 2 tsp. yeast without panifarin.

Celestine
Quote: Zubastik

The bread has a distinct sour taste, similar to that of a store. Whether I like it or not, I still don't understand. It is necessary to cool down completely.
In general, I liked the result, it is unlikely that pure rye flour would give me such a result, even for 2 tsp. yeast without panifarin.

Super bread !! (y) Excellent result.
When I first baked without yeast at all, I was also of this height, only there was still wheat flour, and here there was one rye flour ... I need to revive my leavens, I also want this
Admin

"There is an obvious sour taste in the bread, similar to a store one. Whether I like it or not, I have not yet understood it. I need to cool it down completely.
In general, I liked the result, it is unlikely that pure rye flour would give me such a result, even for 2 tsp. yeast without panifarin. "


These are lactic acid bacteria. After several cycles of feeding the starter culture, it becomes stronger and more active and more like yeast.

Congratulations!!! And they said - bacteria! Look how lovely it turned out!
Zubastik
Admin, thanks !!!
And I liked the sourness! Very similar bread to the store! Still, to get hold of malt - so you can't drag by the ears, and so only kvass, but I think it gives a weaker taste !!! Now I will bake only with sourdough, I will even try it in white.
Thank you!!!
Admin
Quote: Zubastik

Admin, thanks !!!
And I liked the sourness! Very similar bread to the store! Still, to get hold of malt - so you can't drag by the ears, and so only kvass, but I think it gives a weaker taste !!! Now I will bake only with sourdough, I will even try it in white.
Thank you!!!

The recipe for white with sourdough is in the "Recipes" Wheat medium sour with sourdough by Admin.
But the sourdough is rye, and wheat flour is a specific bread, but tasty, try it.
Fermented malt is available in kvass wort in cans in the markets.

Good luck!
Hockey stick
Help, pzhl., A beginner in baking. I tried to put in the eternal leaven. I did everything as written by Luke. On the second day after feeding, the sourdough gave excellent results - the cap rose to the top of a 2-liter jar, and lo and behold, I managed to catch this moment and it did not spill into the closet. At my own peril and risk, I mixed the contents of the jar and poured it into a 3-liter one, today is the 3rd day and the 3rd feeding ball. After yesterday's infusion and today's feeding, the foam rises only 1 cm. What did I do wrong, and what should I do now? To ferment a new one or continue to feed this one until, as written, it doubles? The question is, should it double from the initial volume, or from the volume with the last feeding? Thank you. I really hope for an answer.
Admin
The principle of preparation of all starter cultures is practically the same, only different components.
The sourdough needs to be fed only three times every other day, then no later than 15-16 hours it must be used, if this does not happen, the sourdough can fall off and go to rest. Sourdough is a peroxidized, fermented dough. Try to understand this sourdough mechanism of action.
If it's hard to imagine, try to see the principle of operation of my kefir starter in stages and a photo.
see here PREPARATION OF KEFIR SQUARE by Admin IN PHOTOS
https://Mcooker-enn.tomathouse.com/in...94.0

Only you will need to feed what Luca recommends.
Another sourdough address
Preparation of uterine starter culture
https://Mcooker-enn.tomathouse.com/in...mf&Itemid=26&topic=1331.0

Good luck!
Boo Boo
The third day I grow leaven. Everything is generally as described, only the smell from her is disgusting. Is that how it should be? And it's just scary to put such a charm in bread.
Admin
Quote: BooBoo

The third day I grow leaven. Everything is generally as described, only the smell from her is disgusting. Is that how it should be? And it's just scary to put such a charm in bread.

Why disgusting. Water and wheat flour.
The leaven should smell on the third day of fermented dough, dough, yeast. Try to dissolve the yeast in water and let it stand - it will smell yeast too.
My kefir shop, for example, smells like dough, that is, dough mixed with yeast.
Is this a disgusting smell.
The smell is also a sign of the good quality of the sourdough.

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