Sourdough on grapes

wait until 12 hours have passed?

Wait and after 12 hours feed the sourdough, water, flour with equal amounts. After the third such feeding, growth should begin.

[these ones]

I came to say thank you to Vicusa for all the help in growing the leaven! Thank you!

Yesterday I baked Iziumkin's favorite bread, the result - wah! Today I baked buns (these ones) - wah-wah! Tomorrow I will bake these buns again! I feel that I will bake them for the next week.
And all this in our experiment with a spoonful of sourdough and 100 g of flour-water initially. And I threw away the California miracle.

In general, life is good!

Oh yes, there were also pancakes and pancakes, but that's not the point.

[Lozja]

Thank you!

Oh, how glad I am!
Lozja, may she live for you long, be healthy and beautiful!

... I would still be in this thread Gerberk wait. I'm worried about something.

Viki I'm tuto! I look at you all, my beauty, after adding the bran and honey, SWELLED ... HOOK, since I had it in two bowls, I switched one to rye flour, well, there is nothing to say in 4 hours, it grew 3-3.5 times, I I'm already baking bread on it, and my beautiful wheat girl again became capricious, she is already 8.5 hours old and she may have increased by 0.5 mm.

in 4 hours it grew 3-3.5 times, I already bake bread on it

Finally!

and my wheaten beauty is again capricious, she is already 8.5 hours old and she may have increased by 0.5 mm.

Capricious got caught. But with wheat it is always more difficult. You started feeding 1 spoonful of food early and it weakened. It would be warm now, where the degrees are 28 - 30.
If she doesn't want to, overfeed the rye in 2 days, then another two days so that she becomes stronger and will also go into battle.

so she stood warm, on the contrary, I just moved her closer to the window, because it is still too early to feed her, but so that she would not over-acidify the rye until morning, and transferred it to wheat, I also moved it to a cooler place, and then she has already begun to rise in 4 hours, if it doubles for another hour, and it is time for mom to go back to sleep, so she needs to be patient until morning

VIKI is with gratitude from the whole family

ONLY FROM THE OVEN


and this is the side - to be scolded (it was impossible to wait)



and girls ...



it is wheat from 15: 30h.



and this is rye after feeding with wheat flour.

And what kind of bread?

[Gerberka]

Gerberka, well, you give ... "to scold" - yes you need to kiss, not scold!

Oh how nice! otherwise I drop in. drop in, and no one. Today she threw out the pure wheat, she never got up, left only the one that was transferred from rye to wheat, today she is not active, for 4.5 hours. only 1cm. increased, although when I fed her I added bran. I still sin on flour, I'll go buy it for the next feeding of other flour, otherwise Kiev Mlyn is somehow not like that. Now I have to shake over her, otherwise she was left alone with me.

How much cognitive is written on your site! Enough for me to read for a month! I will try to finish this topic first, otherwise the "leaven" (in fact, almost wine) has been worth 10 days already. It was made simply out of curiosity and unwillingness to finish grapes ... It was interesting to know "what happens if ..." This was done by kvass - she constantly received beer, but the cookies and bread based on it were original in taste.

I came to say that it was not in vain that I had so persistently finished off this leaven. I was very tempted by Misha's words about a wonderful baking without any sourness. Well, now, today for the first time I made baking without a drop of yeast on this sourdough (bagels according to Misha's recipe).I just tried looking at night - and precipitated. I would never have guessed in my life that these bagels are leavened. Defki, I'm in a deep trance and a quiet swoon. Well, okay there, delicious pancakes, pancakes, bread, but muffins !!! such a !!! the only difference from yeast products, it seems to me, is the absence of that yeast-baked aroma, and that's it! No sourness, fluffy dough, taste - you will never say that it is leavened. In general, what I was chasing so, struck on the spot all my imagination.

I came to say that it was not in vain that I had so persistently finished off this leaven. Well, okay there, delicious pancakes, pancakes, bread, but muffins !!! such a !!!

True??? This is great! Congratulations!
I was also tempted. Just don't beat me for what I got up to with grapes. Well then I didn't know how to do it right ... It was like this: I took grapes, cut them into halves, and poured them into 1 layer in a 3-liter balloon with warm water. A Saf-moment flopped on top of the tip of the knife (well, so that the necessary yeast multiplied faster). The color of the water was bluish. In the morning, it bubbled from above (the color of the water is blue), by the evening it calmed down ... I poured 2 tablespoons of sugar - it bubbled (the color turned lilac). Once every 2-3 days I looked into the balloon, stirred the floating berries, the water turned pink ... The smell is pleasant, winey, not sour. If the water seemed sour on the sample, I added 2-3 tablespoons of sugar, it bubbled again))) I don’t know what happened in the end - wine or vinegar, but it smells nice, cherry color, and the taste of alcohol is more than enough Then I got to your forum, which is insanely happy. Today (many days after the start of fermentation) I poured the liquid into a bottle and mixed part of it in a jar of flour and 1/4 tsp. sugar (it was sour). An hour later, it doubled, stirred it, and an hour later it increased 3 times. So it is alive! I will try to feed, as advised in this thread. What is now in the jar smells deliciously of bread mixed with a subtle aroma of wine. Very interesting what will happen next ...

[unwashed]

I liked this leaven so much that I specially dried it unwashed grapes to repeat it six months later, in the spring. Moreover, it dried at a low temperature to preserve the yeast.
Yes, the pastry is excellent, straight cakes - layered, wet

Now tell me how to transfer my leaven to the refrigerator? For I have already played enough and tired every day, among other things, to come up with what to cook with sourdough, and it's a pity to feed the toilet. I need a starter culture about every three days. What to do? On a cool windowsill, it grows no worse than in a warm one. Feed and refrigerate? Or feed, wait for growth and refrigerate? And then? As usual? Warm up for an hour, feed a couple of times and you're done? Would you like this option with this sourdough?

And what, absolutely no one has this leaven living in the refrigerator? Is everyone fed daily? I can, of course, do it at my own peril and risk, but it's a pity if I suddenly ruin it.

Duc will ruin of course
She doesn't live in the refrigerator
I tried it (but not for a long time, so I can't say HOW storage in the cold will affect a wheat leaven like a Frenchwoman, or rather how it will affect the taste of bread)
I tried it as described here 🔗

in principle, it worked out fine, but it seems that by switching the sourdough to the preservation mode in the refrigerator, I simply killed the French woman and she became just wheat in accordance with GOST or something like that. There further, in the comments Luda writes about it
By the way, her smell has definitely changed!
grape smells like fruit, and after the cold (French, since I experimented with it), it acquired a more bready aroma

And what, absolutely no one has this leaven living in the refrigerator?

My sourdough has two houses - one on the staircase in the bedside table, where the temperature does not drop below 12 degrees all winter.
The second one is at the balcony door: there I pressed flowers on the shelves near the fixed part of the door and now there is a poroplast box pressed against the glass with its open side and there is a glass with sourdough and a thermometer in it (the sun does not look there now), and although the temperature fluctuations during the day and there is a night one, but it is still colder there than just on the windowsill.

Is everyone fed daily?

I feed about 1-2 times a day, as needed. First, I leave about 50 grams of sourdough, then add water and flour several times, observing the rule: add as much flour as there is at the moment in the sourdough.This way you get just the right amount of sourdough by the time you need to bake bread or a cake, and you don't need to throw anything away.
If you need to delay the moment of the next feeding, then you can add more flour, and in order not to get confused with calculating the flour-water balance, you can write down how much you put in each time. I do it this way: I put the glass on the scale, knowing the weight of the glass, I see how much leaven I have, reset the readings, add water as needed, reset it again and add flour. It turns out quickly and without unnecessary hassle with measuring cups. There is a piece of paper next to it and I immediately write down how much I put in each time.

The result is bread! Without yeast on one sourdough, it rose 3 times. With a delicious moist crumb that you squeeze in your fist, and it returns to its original shape
I also have sourdough, asks to eat, but I can't bake every day ... On the balcony, near zero, in the refrigerator +4 The test piece of sourdough stayed in the refrigerator all night, and now it shows no activity for 2 days. I'll try to put the jar in a pot of cold water, put ice in the water, leave it in the room ...

I do it like this: I put the glass on the scale, knowing the weight of the glass, I see how much leaven I have, reset the readings, add water as needed, reset it again and add flour. It turns out quickly and without unnecessary hassle with measuring cups. There is a piece of paper next to it and I immediately write down how much I put in each time.

I do the same thing, only on my glass jar (and now I have adapted a 180 g glass from under the Nutella) I write the ratio in g with a marker for disks (for example 10:20:20) and time
It's easier for me to customize any recipe.
I tried on pieces of paper - sometimes a piece of paper is lost if someone decides to rearrange the jar

She came to cry for me a new sourdough for the first time in almost four years does not grow: (Yesterday I was rejuvenating in the evening for the third time and does not grow at all. It is bubbling, sour. I, of course, all such an experienced lady, put it on white sclerosis grapes, then added a little black, but alas and ah. Now I will feed again and if anything, I will have to start again.

Lena, last year I had a story. I put it on dark grapes (small and sweet - maybe wine, I don't know) - but the leaven doesn't grow. This is how you write - bubbling, but not growing.
However, I am a lady who lives on the moon - I had to wait a month to put it on the growing moon again. The next time I put it on pink and lilac (I also don't know what to call him) - somehow everything worked out
I still cannot understand why it happened in one case and did not grow together in another. And he and the other grapes - from the dacha, all in a white bloom. Unclear. But I don't think the color really matters

I put everything on the growing moon today.

Flax, next moon - put together!
don't worry, it will work out

Well, I put in some leaven ...
exactly today and nailed.
Every time I look at her with a sinking eye - I am very worried about it. It's like the birth of a beloved animal
I can't do it the way the French do - they say there every baker starts the sourdough again every six months. But I'm always aspirated

[Ira]

Irahow is the leaven doing? I was going to put on yesterday and slept

Lena, today is my first sourdough working day. Yesterday, tobto, in the morning, I started to rejuvenate her (although the term is incorrect, to rejuvenate is to feed small amounts of sourdough in large proportions of flour: water. What I did is called deoxidation. Right, Len? But since the author Luda uses this terminology and I decided to call their actions in accordance with the recipe)

In general, for the last 3rd time, already with sticking eyes, I fed her at 23-30, in the morning curiosity or excitement raised me at 6 in the morning - I galloped into the kitchen to see how my beauty was there.
Well, how to say - it went up 2 times. Not enough somehow. Without giving up, I kneaded the bread - wait, it’s just baking. And I fed the rest as it should be-100: 100: 100. I look like a fool every hour - it grows, but not very actively. Quite m. B.due to the fact that it is humid and cool. Or maybe she needs to accelerate.
Last year I fed her sluggishly for a week like this, then cheered her up according to the Lyudin method (grapes in flour - and feed). And you know, after that, how she went, how she went - she rose steadily in 3 r, never let me down to her own. hmm ... finishing work

Behold, now the newborn guard

By the way, I can't get it for 6 days - I usually start to rejuvenate it by the end of the 5th - after it falls after a violent fermentation. Otherwise, it smells strongly of sourness already. And you? do you stand clearly for 6 days?

Yasnenko No, I keep it for five days and that's it, once or twice I give me a glass of flour to eat. But I have always grown very well, and I don’t know what will happen now. I work a lot this year, I made up my mind so as to rejuvenate on the day when I'm less busy, well, I came home yesterday at 6, at 8 I passed out until morning

Lena, everything will work out! put it on, otherwise the homemade people miss the delicious bread?

mine already know that since autumn we have BREAD at home! nevertheless Khlebopechkin's bread is a compromise

... I keep it for five days and that's it, once or twice I give a glass of flour to eat.

Mine today ate 100 grams for the third time. flour. We have 100 grams - the norm for a day
Tomorrow we'll see if five days is enough for her or not. I wish it was enough. I thought about the weekend "rejuvenation". And then again, as with the past will be - first a sleepless night, and in the morning also urgent baked goods ... because I really want to test in battle.

by the way, this year I deliberately originally fermented 2 tbsp. water, because last time I remember that a lot of juice is released. But I also mixed flour three times, since the juice was cut off all the time

[Vika]

Well, you girls think badly of me, I have sourdough, only she is a lady already not young: girl_haha: Like me without homemade bread I just don't bake rolls, they eat them too quickly.
Vika, for some reason I am sinning for flour, I have Amin. Today I put the sourdough, added a little flour of the 1st grade. Let's see what happens.

[Vika]

Vika, for some reason I am sinning for flour, I have Amin.

Amina is not a bad meal. Stronger than Kulindorovskaya, but now I'm taking Aris. There was an opportunity to take from the mill, so I still had the first grade, but the whole of the highest grade was eaten. On Aris and grow ... as we say there - will we look?

Len, of course you are ... well done! But it's hot in summer - you need to feed more often, and you should have a rest for at least a couple of weeks - how do you manage?
we run to the dacha in the summer, and the feeding zadolboshka frequent - I can't do it, and sometimes there is no one at home to feed the leaven, why carry it everywhere with a failure?

I also have 1st grade flour, I buy Dnipromlyn in a bag. It was always good, this time it seemed a little damp to me, but I can't say for sure, I just have doubts.
And the water? What water do you have? water has a very strong effect, well, you probably read these articles in LJ too

And what do you think? Nothing worked out ... the client is bubbling, does not smell sour and does not grow. Yesterday I got sick, the last rach at nine in the evening. In the morning, a non-growing, bubbling mass with a slight foam on top.
In the morning I fed it in three different proportions, one with 1st grade flour, added honey and thick one to one. It seems that the Mk bacteria do not multiply.
Girls, just don't laugh, my microflora has probably changed at home. In the kitchen, whatever you leave, it quickly turns sour or moldy.
And also my observations from life: there are practically no mosquitoes - in May they flew clouds, the flies disappeared, although it is very warm, the sourdough does not work Well, oh well, the grapes are very sweet this year

Flax, apply a low start

Low start: fruity way to stimulate starter culture

Hello Anonymous!

If a mixture of rye flour with water does not have any signs of fermentation in a day, then it's okay. Fermentation is still there, only invisible to the naked eye. Feed the mixture with equal amounts of flour and water once a day until there are clear signs of fermentation and then follow the recipe described above.

That is, you now have a mixture of 100g flour and 120g water. The first day passed. No obvious dough swelling is visible. Throw away half. Add 50g flour and 50g water to the rest. Leave it for a day.

The second day passed. Throw away half. Add 50g flour and 50g water to the rest. Leave it for a day.

The third day passed. The mixture should double or triple in volume at this point.If not, then use the fruit method to stimulate fermentation.

Take unwashed fruits (apple, grapes, plums, etc.) or vegetables (zucchini, pumpkin, cucumber, tomato). Take 50g flour. Dip the fruit in this flour and leave for 2 hours. Then shake off the flour from the fruit and add 50 g of water to it. Feed 100g of the previous test as in the previous days. Microorganisms on the skin of the fruit (wild yeast and lactic acid bacteria) will definitely help to start fermentation in the dough and reduce its acidity. Leave for a day.

The fourth day has passed, the fifth has come. If your 200g mixture has not increased in volume by 2-3 times even with "fruit flour", then you should throw out the unsuccessful dough and start over.

You will definitely succeed. I will wait for good news from you

🔗

if bubbles, then the patient is alive! but does not grow - there is no yeast, yeast gives growth
Try it, you don't lose anything. And honey in my opinion is in vain - honey suppresses something there

I will report: all the way I went best of all on flour of the 1st grade, the thick one also grew well and was attached to the bread.

... the client bubbles, does not smell sour and does not grow.

Lena, I had the same picture. I quickly made it thick. Very thick. And after the second feeding, she went to grow, and how!

I have the 5th day of sourdough. smells of slightly fermented wine. She was divided into two parts, pink liquid and flour at the bottom. I stir periodically. temperature + 19-22.
The recipe is from the first post.
What's the deal? someone like?
Judging by the recipe, you have to wait until the 10th day and then throw out some of it, and feed some of it.

I never left until the 10th day, all the time I do it according to the recipe from LJ Luda 🔗

there, on the 6th day, they begin to deacidify the leaven (or soften) - a glass of leaven: a glass of water: a glass of flour - and so three times
From my own experience, I can say that when stratification begins, then it's time to stop standing the leaven and start feeding it as it should be - otherwise, the poor thing, she will die of hunger. I suppose that this stratification is precisely due to the fact that the process has gone to dying - like the symbiotics we need begin to die along with the bad ones - they have nothing to eat at all for the poor! no flour, no water ...... inhabited by robots

I never left until the 10th day, all the time I do it according to the recipe from LJ Luda 🔗

there, on the 6th day, they begin to deacidify the leaven (or soften) - a glass of leaven: a glass of water: a glass of flour - and so three times
From my own experience, I can say that when stratification begins, then it's time to stop standing the leaven and start feeding it as it should be - otherwise, the poor thing, she will die of hunger. I suppose that this stratification is precisely due to the fact that the process has gone to dying - like the symbiotics we need begin to die along with the bad ones - they have nothing to eat at all for the poor! no flour, no water ...... inhabited by robots

Every year I made this sourdough according to Lyudmila's recipe (on the 6th day I started feeding). In this case, the starter culture gained strength only on the fifth day after feeding.

This year I decided to be patient and all 10 days the leaven was in the jar. Made strictly according to the recipe from the first post of this topic.
Imagine my amazement when the leaven, prepared according to this scenario, became strong from the very first day of feeding.
I liked it more, because it is not necessary to transfer flour in such an amount for extra feeding, and there is much less dancing with tambourines near the leaven.

Next year I will only make sourdough in this way.

I checked this way last year. One part on the sixth day began to feed, and left the remainder until the 10th.
I did not see the difference.
This year, on the sixth day, she began to feed - and she immediately showed herself in all her glory! Even at the stage of the second feeding it was gently-beautifully bubbling, it was a pity to throw it away

And last year, dances with tambourines were needed for both - both had to be stimulated
I don’t know what it’s connected with. Maybe this year the leaven has grasped all the most necessary and powerful things?

This year, I made the leaven at a temperature of 15 degrees in the room (it was pretty cool). Maybe it influenced her too. Or maybe this year? The grapes are good and so on ...

Oh, and I, on the contrary, started the leaven this year at a temperature of about 26 *, I was still worried if it was too hot for it.
Exactly such a year! there the wine can be a good year - and the wine is immediately collectible, so we have a leaven - grape 2013 - selected collection

and that there are absolutely no such people who would do according to the recipe on the 1st page?

From my own experience, I can say that when stratification begins, then it's time to stop standing the leaven and start feeding it as it should be - otherwise, the poor thing, she will die of hunger. I suppose that this stratification is precisely due to the fact that the process went to dying -

that is, do you think you need to start feeding immediately without delay?
in the first post it is indicated that she should not show signs of life and then throw out a part, and leave a part and start feeding

like the symbiotics we need begin to die together with the bad ones - they have nothing to eat at all for the poor! no flour, no water ...

there is flour, only at the bottom :)

and that there are absolutely no such people who would do according to the recipe on the 1st page?

I did

My leaven also exfoliated after the 5th day. But I waited patiently for 10 days and was richly rewarded with a strong and good smelling starter culture.

that is, do you think you need to start feeding immediately without delay?

I cannot give advice (after all, our recipes are different) - you decide for yourself, I just told how I did

You can conduct an experiment as I did - take a glass of sourdough now and start feeding, and leave the remainder until the 10th day and start feeding on the 10th day - just decide how best

You can conduct an experiment as I did - take a glass of sourdough now and start feeding, and leave the remainder until the 10th day and start feeding on the 10th day - just decide how best

Oh, it didn't occur to me. As an option. Thank you!

My leaven also exfoliated after the 5th day. But I waited patiently for 10 days and was richly rewarded with a strong and good smelling starter culture.

I hope I will be fine too!