Question to the pros about yeast dough

Oh, Irka, look! Let's put you on a drug account!

And we will treat! And our treatment is effective -!

Have not tried. To be honest, I don't see the point, the poppy still prays with knives through one grate, through the second it is simply pushed out, but in fact nothing is done with it. That is - what is the meaning of the two lattices ??? Wash more!

They are displaced, look, the output really looks like the one from the makitra)
🔗

For comparison

I hope you can insert links?

Try cutting out the water from the filling.
Steam the poppy seeds with boiling water for 1 hour, then squeeze and twist in a meat grinder a couple of times. Add 1 glass of sugar and 2 tbsp. l. starch. Maca needs 300 g for this amount.

The dough I always do is this
https://Mcooker-enn.tomathouse.com/in...45301.0

This portion makes two large rolls

[Dance]

Dance, I tried the recipe, baked cheesecakes for the child, liked it very much, today I will bake a roll on it, it's scary (. 2 hours l of DRY yeast not a lot, did not find fresh yeast?

Girls, tell me about the roll, maybe I'm pinching it incorrectly, maybe I need to seam up, maybe I need a form for a roll, and not just on a baking sheet?

I baked, in shape, not much, but crawled, I will try again, maybe I rolled it thin again ...

In detail:

[Dance]

Dance, I really liked the dough, mixed everything and is ready, to be honest, I do not see much difference with the dough, which is prepared in a sponge way)

And so the recipe:
flour - 300g
Yeast - 2h. l
Sugar 80g
Oil-40g
Egg - 1 pc
Salt - a pinch
Water (I took milk) - 100g

I do in a mixer: milk (warm) + yeast + sugar + salt + butter (soft) + egg + flour + vanillin, kneaded, left for 1-1.5 hours, then divided into 2 parts and left for 15 minutes, then rolled out and made 1 roll and pies)))

Here is the dough:

Marish, thanks for the pictures, it's easier to understand. So, the dough is somewhat watery, try adding ~ 40-50 g more flour. It should gather in a soft piece, a bun. Further, I categorically do not recognize dry yeast in butter dough! They do not give elasticity to the dough. Pay attention to the difference in the plasticity of the dry dough. others and press. etc. Further, for a better (ideal) development of gluten development, the dough must be kneaded (!!), that is, kneaded and allowed to rise again. (Kneading → fermentation 1 h → kneading min. 3-4 → second fermentation 50-60 min → dividing into pieces of a given mass → preliminary proofing of 10-15 minutes (the bonds in the dough relax, it becomes softer .. it is easier to mold) → molding → final proofing ~ 30 to 50 (maximum) minutes → baking.

So, it tears the products because there is no FALSE, that is, you did not allow flour gluten to develop, it is she who is responsible for stretching the dough during proofing and baking! Note, you have no more holes inside the roll! Try to do as I wrote and send a photo report. I'm waiting!

By the way, the thickness of the rolling (dough layer) is normal.

[Dance]

Dance, Thank you! I will definitely try the next weekend)))) the roll is gone, very tasty, ground poppy, but not the same as in makitra, I think I need more water and sugar, but in general, I'm VERY happy with the dough, not heavy, airy, no heaviness after absorption
Delicious, I love poppy and my son is 5 years old, apparently in me, I have to hide

[Dance]

Dance, I'm getting started ... I found the pressed yeast, but they need to be somehow dissolved or just put in a piece?

I put it like that. Kneading in a bread maker. Yeast, sugar, egg, margarine, salt, vanilla, warm water, flour, raisins. I put it in that order. Flour also matters, there is for sand - with a low gluten content, for yeast you need flour with good gluten.In a simple way, so that it stretches well, does not break like cotton wool.

[Dance]

Dance, thanks, I went to do it, I'll show you in detail later)))

Come on, I'm waiting. And photo!

[Dance]

Dance, Well, I got a kick out of it, I decided to make 1 roll out of the whole dough, and even put it in a small form, in the end the roof slid down, but without a form I’m afraid to bake, I’m afraid that it will creep from all sides, maybe the filling is too liquid? Can the roof go because of the tight shape?

Dough:

In my opinion, you roll out the dough very thinly.

[flour, there is for sand - with a low content of gluten, for yeast you need flour with good gluten]

I put it like that. Kneading in a bread maker. Yeast, sugar, egg, margarine, salt, vanilla, warm water, flour, raisins. I put it in that order. Still matters flour, there is for sand - with a low content of gluten, for yeast you need flour with good gluten... In a simple way, so that it stretches well, does not break like cotton wool.

Tanya, all our flour is sold with the same composition on packs, like a carbon copy written off from GOST. How do you know if flour is for shortcrust pastry or for yeast dough?
I recently took loose flour from the supermarket, the baking of a roll from it was terrible, it broke just like cotton wool. Although for how many years I have been taking flour from the same manufacturer in bags by weight, but now an ambush has turned out ... and even to order, as if for evil. I got it out, but I want to figure it out for the future.

While writing, Elena Bo commented on the photo. I agree completely. And as for me, the filling is wet. Excess moisture inside and thin dough - the result is predictable. Some reason needs to be changed.

[ma-ri-na]

ma-ri-na, your filling was smeared over the dough almost to the end of the layer, about 1-1.5 cm remained to the edge, right? Next, you wrapped the roll and for some reason laid the seam on the side, and not below, in any case, this is how I see it in the photo of the cut. And in the photo of the rolled roll on the table and in the form it seems to be laid correctly ...
Next time try to spread the filling not reaching the edge of the dough 3-4 centimeters, and lay the resulting roll with the seam down. But for some reason it seems to me that you have a wet filling, that's the point ...
Let's wait for pro Tanya.

[tore the side from above]

I agree with Sveta, float the roof could be due to improper installation. It seems to me still a roof skewed due to the fact that the test tore the side from above, on the upper edge you can see that this is exactly a gap. It could break the dough during baking because it did not distance enough. When baking, the crust grabbed too quickly, but inside the enlargement process has not yet ended, so it burst. The temperature should be reduced slightly and baked accordingly longer.
You can slightly increase the proving time before sending it to the oven and by putting it in the oven to spray from the pultilizer, so that the additional moisture gives the dough the opportunity to increase even more without breaking.
I somehow see it that way

Oh girls, I don't know, I bake at 160, the seam is from the bottom, it seemed to me that the only sin is that the shape is 24, and the roll is 30 and I squeezed it, as it were, maybe that's why?

[Marish]

Marish, but about the temperature exactly, is there a thermometer in the oven? You never know what the manufacturers write there, the ovens are all different and behave as they want Hooligans are

I finally bought a thermometer in the oven, but it broke for 2 weeks already, the master is waiting to fix it Tomorrow I will bake a "curl" in the bread maker

And you prick the workpiece, as before on the purchased one?

Why clean up?)

And you prick the workpiece, as before on the purchased one?

What I just haven't tried))))

Then you need to look for another recipe, look at the recipes according to GOST or from Chadeyka, Khrushchev's probably too fat

Do you bake with steam or under the lid?

A good roll turned out. It remains only to correct the little things. So let's go ....

1) do not confuse one with the other - the top did not leave, but broke along the upper crust. Such a gap is a UNDERSTANDING! Let it stand for another 10 minutes. You were embarrassed that he reached the top, but the shape is too small for such a roll. From this test I get 2 rolls of ~ 200-250 g each.Plus, the side provokes a rupture, because the dough stretches intensively, but the form does not give it, it keeps it (especially under-spreading). I seem to have already written how to organoleptically determine the degree of proofing. I will repeat myself. When lightly pressed with a finger on the surface: NEDO proofing - quickly returns its shape; Overexposure (overstayed) - the dent is NOT RESTORED; the most TO-slowly leveling the surface, then it's time!
2). You do not need to prick anything, with full proofing it is not necessary.
3). If the product is oiled with an egg, NO SPLASHING WITH WATER AND STEAM! the whole crust will peel off. This applies to non-lubricated products.
4). Do not smear the roll to the end, leave cm4, (I mean not on the sides)
5). The filling is watery. Excess moisture will go into the dough, and a dulk will remain in the layer. But in this case, the gap is not because of this. This is so, flavoring moments.
6). The roll should be laid just on the seam, and not on its side. After 5-10 minutes, look and correct it, turn it, because during the proofing, the dough can be twisted, so you can correct it
This time you rolled out the cake thickly, it can be thinner. With such a thickness, the entire filling of the guide is lost. But this, again, is a matter of taste.
Look like that's it. But if you missed something (some thoughts are confused) ask. I will be happy to help you. I'll drink some coffee, we can wake up, otherwise I work until late ...

A! By the way, flour! I flew in on Easter with an order. And the order is not frail - 300 large pastes (250-300g) and 300 small ones. First batch - oh, horror !! Gray (and this is only on the yolks!), Sandy, no rise (not yeast!). Fucked up the whole order! Naturally, the customer refused this! And the trial baked from the same flour! Cool! Now, having learned from bitter experience, I now check each game. Knead for 100 g of flour and water, as for dumplings, not steep, knead well with your hands (mash). I lay down for at least 10 and try to stretch. Stretches well, fits, does not stretch, breaks, I give another 10 minutes to lie down. The same procedure. The same result - everything is NOT suitable for yeast baking. You can, of course, wash the gluten, but it's a dreary and not necessary for the house. At the bakery, it is washed from each batch and, depending on what has been received, the recipe, the technological process are adjusted ...
The same manufacturer does not have stable flour. Since the type of grain, the place of growth, climatic conditions, the time of harvest, and much more, already affect the composition of the grain, and, therefore, flour. Therefore, the same manufacturer may have different batches of flour with different quality indicators. Therefore, there is a trial batch, and even better, trial baking of simple bread-flour, water, salt, yeast. According to a specific recipe. Always the same! If necessary, knock, I will write.

[Dance]

Dance, Tanya, after reading the first recommendations point by point, thought: what is the correct professional approach to flight debriefing and about flour, everything is very true.

According to a specific recipe

if possible recipe

Thank you, Nadyush, I have been a pastry chef by education for 23 years, and they sent me to the academy at the bakery, so I am also a baker technologist. By the nature of my activity, I have learned to correct debriefing, otherwise my head will answer! But I still don't know everything! And what I know, I'll give you a hint! ... I'll look for a recipe. I don’t remember at all. Will you wait?

In general, I will write how laboratory assistants do in a laboratory.
Flour-560 g
Water-290 g
Yeast-15 g (pressed)
Salt-7 g
In the training manuals, I can’t find it, I’ll find it, I’ll write (if I don’t forget).

[Dance]

Dance, Tanya, in principle, you should get digestible bread, what are the indicators that the flour is weak or, on the contrary, good, please forgive the unnecessary questions, but lately such a variety of flour and often at very good prices that could be taken in reserve, but I'm afraid , and suddenly she is not ice, but with test baking, you can understand here recently and the girl complained about the MacFoo of the new crop, feed her the team, but the flour let down

In general, I will write how laboratory assistants do in a laboratory.Flour-560 g Water-290 g Yeast-15 g (pressed) Salt-7 g

Duc proportions are only a quarter of the case. And what about the technology of reference?
And it looks too dry at first glance, although so much yeast will still raise, probably ...

[Dance]

Dance, thanks for the detailed answers. But unfortunately, at home there is no possibility to bake a kilogram loaf of bread from each packet of flour. Will the method described in the post "Reply # 87 Today at 07:59" be enough, or are there any other ways (by taste, by eye, by smell, ...) to test flour at home?
I used to buy 1st grade flour for bread, bread from it seemed to me better than from premium. Now, unfortunately, such flour cannot be found on sale, or they call it military-grade names.

But unfortunately, at home there is no possibility to bake a kilogram loaf of bread from each packet of flour.

That is why I try to take a lot at once.)) Even if the flour is unimportant, there is always an opportunity to adapt to it by changing the technology. Just recently they bought me a small bag of 10 kg, which seems to be from a good local manufacturer, and on the very first bun it turned out that the garbage was complete. The control pies confirmed this - nothing to do with ordinary pies, the dough is like putty, zero elasticity, sticks to hands, does not hold its shape, everything crawled and fell apart. In the end, the dogs said thank you. But after a few days I still adapted to it - a little different water, a little less oil, a slightly different method of kneading and holding, and voila - excellent bread is obtained instead of the old cake. True, I bought a new one for pies.))

That's why I try to take a lot at once.))

Unfortunately, I can't buy more than 5 kg at once - there is nowhere to store, and the bugs start up. And my husband and I practically do not eat bread, as well as dumplings-pies-pastries under sanctions. I buy flour mainly for orders. So I'm wondering how not to buy unimportant flour.

Yes, girls, you have to adapt to every torment. I wrote that depending on the results, the recipe and the technological process are adjusted.
I wrote this test baking as an example. Optional oven. I am content with kneading and stretching.
For test baking: kneading → fermentation 50-60`, kneading → fermentation for another 40-50`, shaping → proofing ~ 40` and baking. During the kneading process, you can already see the quality of the dough: elasticity, porosity, adhesion, degree of rise (depends not only on yeast!) ...

In general, I will write how laboratory assistants do in a laboratory.
Flour-560 g
Water-290 g
Yeast-15 g (pressed)
Salt-7 g
In the training manuals, I can’t find it, I’ll find it, I’ll write (if I don’t forget).

I don’t understand, is this the bread recipe you gave or what?

Svetik, unfortunately, the quality of the flour cannot be determined by the type of package! What Bijou described, speaks of the freshness of the flour, that is, it is from this year's grain, not ripe. This is the scourge of all bakers. We must be patient And let her rest. There is an option to add dry gluten when kneading.

[Taia]

Taia, I think it's just baking "about nothing" purely for a flour sample, a laboratory sample. This is the norm for bakeries, where flour is bought in hundreds of kg / tons. And on a sample of such a volume, the quality of the flour is best seen.
Tanya will correct if I'm wrong.