Cabbage pies

Thanks for the advice, of course. It's just that everyone, as I understand it, turns out without these dances with tambourines .... If of course this plays a role, I tried another recipe for butter dough, only without rast. butter, only with butter, and 2 eggs per 600 g of flour, the same story. And believe me, it’s not my perception, I don’t think that it has more claims than the others on this forum, and everyone says TASTY !!! So the reason is 100% different
And in the instructions, as I understand it, there is a typo.

[Elena82]

Elena82,

This is not dancing with tambourines, actually. These are manipulations that seriously improve the dough. It will work without them, but the result will be worse. Yolk - improves the dough, allows it to keep its shape well (lecithin works), protein - "dries", makes it tighter (that's why I excluded it). The oil prevents gluten from forming and swelling. Therefore, the dough is much coarser and crumbled. Steam baking - allows the product to rise and not dry it out at the initial stage (the humidity in the oven is high) and only then start baking.

I, using all these techniques, just quite clearly understand what I am doing and what I want to achieve. They are not from the ceiling and I follow them myself. Because I want it to be super)). Although it can be quick and just fine. Based on your initial data / questions, I am trying to correct. I almost always bake with autolysis, especially bread. At the same time, I add butter later (in my opinion, in this topic I wrote about this, and in bread it is usually only 1 tbsp. L., But even it plays a role). I bake with steam ALWAYS. Both bread and pies / rolls. Previously, just as I described to you, now I have an oven with steam. Even water and the amount of salt can seriously change the dough. Hard water produces more gluten in the dough (it is tighter), distilled water - much less (it is much softer).
HP Panasonic allows you not to fool too much: in the "Pelmeni" mode, the dough is simply mixed, then butter, yeast are added to the bucket and the dough program is set. All. Panasonic equalizes the temperature for a long time, that is, it just stands and does nothing: it heats the ingredients to a single temperature. At this time, autolysis takes place. And then she makes the dough herself. If you have HP, try this. It will be clean, but the result will improve dramatically. If your HP does not have a temperature equalization period and when the program is turned on, it immediately begins to knead, then just wait these 40 minutes, add oil / yeast and turn on the program, let it work.

I don't insist, I just want to. so that you get what you like.

I have Redmond 1919, where dry ingredients are added to liquid ones. I knead the yeast dough on the program, there goes first kneading, then a pause for eight minutes, if I am not mistaken, then the second kneading (add butter), then I put it in the oven for proofing, or in a multi-baker I let it.

[Elena82]

Elena82,

So, knead without oil and yeast, let it rest for 40 minutes, add oil and yeast and put a full batch again and continue as usual. You will even see on the surface of the dough later that it is different.

And how to knead without yeast, if they are pressed? In what then to breed them? Or dry oven?

And how to knead without yeast, if they are pressed? In what then to breed them? Or dry oven?

Do not breed in anything. They will intervene)). That's what I do. To be sure, you can simply crush it with your hands on the surface.

Thank you, I'll try this.

Thanks for the advice, of course. It's just that everyone, as I understand it, turns out without these dances with tambourines .... If of course this plays a role, I tried another recipe for butter dough, only without rast.butter, only with butter, and 2 eggs per 600 g of flour, the same story. And believe me, it’s not my perception, I don’t think that it has more claims than the others on this forum, and everyone says TASTY !!! So the reason is 100% different
And in the instructions, as I understand it, there is a typo.

Elena, I add both types of oil, but at the end.

Convection is definitely very dry. Better top-bottom and steam. Or convection, but also with steam.

I baked on convection mode and without steam - perfect result! Yesterday I baked in Tristar, in terms of airiness the result is worse, but the bottom crust is crispy. Perhaps it's true, the reason is in the oven. I have a nicer one.

Elena, I add both types of oil, but at the end.

So did I during the second batch

Either in one or the other Temka noticed mentions of the famous Chuchelka pies. I wondered what kind of pies they were. I came, looked, read, cooked ... And here's one more grateful to you, Natalia, the family has grown.Thanks for the recipe for delicious pies, we haven’t eaten tastier yet, really

Either in one or the other Temka noticed mentions of the famous Chuchelka pies. I wondered what kind of pies they were. I came, looked, read, cooked ... And here's one more grateful to you, Natalia, the family has grown.Thanks for the recipe for delicious pies, we haven’t eaten tastier yet, really

[Kseny @]

Kseny @, you've got gorgeous pies!

And really gorgeous!

))) baked on top,
delicious inside (((

Oh, thank you all for the praises. The pies are really gorgeous in every sense - both form, and taste, and in work! Somehow it became even more comfortable to live)) By the coming weekend I plan to make it with a sweet filling, I really want it with cherries. I'm a little worried about not leaking (my eternal problem) ... I read about the addition of starch or semolina, it remains to practice

Uraaaaaaaa !!!!!!!! : yahoo: It worked !!!!!! Girls, thank you all for your advice: rose: So far I don't know exactly what influenced it, I'll find out later by experience. I'll tell you in order, maybe someone will also help. First, I changed the flour (I took makfa), made it with dry yeast (saf), took only the yolk. First, I kneaded all the ingredients on the "dumplings", except for fats, let the dough sit for literally 10 minutes, then added fats and again knead on the "dumplings". I left it for proofing in HP for an hour. I divided the dough into balls and started sculpting. Ready pies allowed to distance 30 minutes and in the oven. I baked top-bottom + 150 ° fan (as the manufacturer recommends in this mode) for 20 minutes. But most importantly, all three years, while I have this oven, I put the baking sheet in the middle and thought that this was the second level (often the instructions indicate to put the baking sheet on the second level), but it turns out this is the third. : crazy: Rearranged telescopes on the level below and voila, the most delicate, downy pies. This is the structure that I expected all previous failed attempts, probably even more. Thanks again everyone for participating

Uraaaaaaaa !!!!!!!! and voila, the most delicate, downy pies. This is the structure that I expected all previous failed attempts, probably even more. Thanks again everyone for participating

We are very happy for you !!! I also only buy macfa.

I think the point is still that I put on the wrong level and they dried up: oops: Only I still had a little emptiness between the filling and the dough, although the dough was right up to the filling, why not tell me?

I think the point is still that I put it on the wrong level and they dried up

Yes, and we wrote this to you, you are great !!! I change higher, lower, while I bake ... can I not be wise either?

Lena! I am sincerely glad for you!
Itself fought for the result for so long, it did not work out right away.

there was a void between the filling and the dough, although the dough was right up to the filling

I also put indecently a lot of fillings in pies, and there is also emptiness, but I reassure myself that the dough is on yeast, but the filling is not
(it may not be right, but it's still delicious)

[Scarecrow]

Scarecrow, it's not for nothing that you have such a wonderful nickname! Why didn't I write my extremely important and miraculous advice about the fact that not only butter, but also yeast should not be put into the dough first, did not write it in the dough recipe?
I really like this dough, I made it exactly according to the recipe from the 1st page, that is, I piled everything except butter in HP, and later butter. Great, I've already kissed you here!
But now, oh yeah, you've completely driven me crazy! I did everything step by step, as you wrote on the previous page: in the dumplings mode, I kneaded everything except yeast and butter. The main thing is that I let this terrible mixture stand and think (about my future, probably). Then yeast again on dumplings and later butter.
The dough was obviously thin and my left hand was fighting with my right, which was holding the can of flour at the ready. The left one won and the dough was left to rest in a closed ha.
It took 50 minutes, opened the HP and gasped!
Delicate, tall dough.
I dusted my hands with flour and quickly butchered them. It turned out to be a huge tender challah and a huge roll with an apple. My husband said that I had never had such a tender challah.
And I myself was surprised at the amount of baked goods.
From 500 g of flour, 2 challahs always came out, but smaller.
And that is not all! I put only 15 grams of yeast.
I will add here that the pressed yeast is in my freezer, packaged in 15 g foil bags. I do not sign the expiration date.

So there you go! These nuances must be taken out on 1 page, Natulya!

[Tanya-Fanya]

Tanya-Fanya,

Nobody stands still and I also improve my skills.)))

If you do as it is written on the first page, you need to put the yeast. There is no aging for 40 minutes, there is simply kneading and butter is added at the end of the batch. Kneading is also an extended piece of time and takes 20 minutes. BUT! As it turned out, our domestic flour requires much more time for the swelling and development of gluten. The same Finnish Nordic, from which I baked before and now sometimes - those kneading 20 minutes are enough. But domestic brands do not. Therefore, first coarse mixing (wetting) and swelling. And only then - batch. To have an excellent result, you must first let the flour swell and only then mix it well, so the subsequent fermentation does not count: the flour will swell, but there will be no kneading and a beautiful / durable "frame" will not be formed. In the meantime, the flour swells - we do not need fermentation, in principle, so we do not put yeast. Autolysis has passed - we put the active ingredient - yeast and everything that would interfere with good swelling - oil. That's why you got what you got))). Well done, you read everything carefully, delved into it and got the result. I'm sure you noticed a difference in the surface of the dough. In the absence of autolysis, it is bumpy when cut. With autolysis - like a silk scarf. Yes? It was? This is properly developed gluten. Now you know what she looks like.

I will ask the moderators to put the information in the first post.

Oh, Natasha, my shawl was delicate from the thinnest and most delicate fluff!
I am wildly delighted with this result!
Now, Panasonic would rebuild the modes in HP for our discoveries - :))) I can even imagine what we need - this is a dispenser capable of holding butter and vegetable oil. But it's not difficult, is it? - :) After all, they came up with a dispenser for yeast and raisins. Well, the dough kneading program itself should be lengthened so that this very beast named autolysis would work wonders.
Well, very, very, very, I am satisfied! Direct discovery, not a method!
I kiss you, Scarecrow!

Wow! It's a revolution! So first we just mix everything except yeast and oil, wait, ... then yeast, and then butter? Or together - butter with yeast? Will yeast be friends with butter? Yeast will not get bad from the fact that they are interfered with right in the oil, because the butter will not immediately disperse through the dough ... something is confused ... Help, Natasha!

Natasha! Sorry for asking, or maybe write in the recipe as a second option - "when using flour with low gluten" and this new method, so that we know what happens in different ways

[Want to know everything]

Want to know everything,

Sprinkle butter with yeast together. Can be poured into different corners. But if in doubt - yeast first and butter in the middle.

I did in HP Panasonic:
1. Pelbmeni mode. I mixed everything except yeast and butter. Relaxation.
2. Again I set the Dumplings Mode. added frozen yeast, crumbled with a knife. When I saw that they had intervened and there were no traces, I gradually added oil little by little, otherwise everything would splash. The gingerbread man begins to fly around the pot, and the oil spits out. Therefore, I had to stand a little at the open hp.
But the result is worth it!

[Scarecrow]

Scarecrow, Tanya-FanyaThank you girls! Got it! I imagined something like that ... but I like to stir with my hands, so there won't be any problems at all, there will be the most delicious pies!

[Scarecrow]

Scarecrow, Nata, emotions overwhelm me, however, as usual in your topics, but nevertheless, this feeling is not weaker from this feeling: girl_hug: finally I put on your famous pies .. here are direct sales ...
(I really don't remember, it seems I've tried it for a long time, but something didn't work out there, there was not enough experience)
and today I decided to try new 1st-grade flour in order to know whether to stock it or not, and the choice was in favor of your awesome pies
made from 1 kg, raw St. Petersburg yeast - directly reactive, there was no milk - brought dry, the rest according to the recipe
Thank you, you are GREAT again, my dear little man: oops1: you will hiccup all evening tonight - I thank you for the pies



sculpted according to your scheme, not so smoothly and beautifully, but I will learn to work pleasantly with the dough, though like a scarf)
at the proofing they were smart for me today

Added Sunday December 04, 2016 7:28 PM

I cooked cabbage by the way, on the Plov program in the cartoon - it's super-duper, moderately juicy and slightly crunchy

[katko]

katko,

And the towel - fly away!))) Well done. Pies are chic!)) You did really well.

And the towel - fly away!)))

padarok))
Thank you
uneven .. but it's all from a lack of skill ... I probably only bake pies the third time))

[katko]

katko,

But it turned out! ))

[Scarecrow]

Scarecrow, this ptamushta you wrote everything sensibly and took pictures and taught)

And can you somehow adapt to knead the dough in the evening and sculpt in the morning? Has anyone tried it? And then I had to stick 80 pies for dinner here, so I fiddled with them all night. But she didn't hit her face in the dirt, everyone praised

[Elena82]

Elena82, for cold fermenting it in the refrigerator, I think it will only benefit in taste)

Will it stop until the morning? How many hours can it stand there?

[Elena82]

Elena82, won't stop)
quite a lot, some types of dough live in the refrigerator for several days, there really is not that much oil ... but I think the night will easily stand and nothing will be terrible

Thanks, next time I'll try it.

I forgot to show the dough as it turned out, while the cabbage was cooled to ShuMashkina))

pies, like fluff, and today are tender, light and do not stale
Thanks, Nata

I made it using the latest technology yesterday. From half of the norm, 18 pies came out from my palm! Barely on a large baking sheet fit heaps of feathers, crumple

[Rarerka]

Rarerka,

And you "dry" them better at the end (so that the crust becomes denser and stronger): lower the temperature so that they are not tinted too much and hold it in the oven for a while.

[per]

The crust seemed to have dried very well. I was afraid perdried.
It turned out it seemed

And I did autolysis by coarse mixing, poured a little milk into it, a spoonful of yeast, a pinch of flour, while the foam rose, the flour got wet with the rest of the liquid products, and then mixed it lightly with yeast, then butter, by the way, sesame oil was added, this is the aroma
And then I kneaded it with handles, I have nothing more to wear 1 kg ...

I forgot to show the dough as it turned out, while the cabbage was cooled to ShuMashkina))

pies, like fluff, and today are tender, light and do not stale
Thanks, Nata

Class!

Thank you so much for the recipe! I haven't had such pies yet.

Girls, I experimented with this test and overnight in the refrigerator.
In short, I mixed it with autolysis in the dumplings mode in HP Panasonic. Gave him the first time to come to HP. I kneaded it again using the dumplings mode and transferred it to the refrigerator right in the bucket from the HP, tightening it well with foil.
Early in the morning I transferred it to a warm bowl, and left it under a towel to warm and grow. After a couple of hours, the dough was overflowing. I had to catch and cut them urgently.
In short, Chuchelkin autolysis and dough are super-duper successful and convenient dough.
Scarecrow,

Thank you very much for the recipe, the pies are just super. Filling fresh cabbage a little sauerkraut with wild mushrooms, I think it will be very tasty with boiled meat and fried onions. Special thanks from my husband.

I baked pies and once again I want to thank Chuchelka! The aroma in the apartment is simply incredible, but the pies, as always, are beyond praise.

[NM]

NM, Duffy, Girls, great health! And your loved ones too. Pies are HOME!))

Epigraph:

Pies are HOME!))

this is 3/4 portion, 1 kg of flour is a bit too much for my hp)))

she is already on the last ... a good kneader is needed

flour makfa 11/18/2016
live yeast
the pies are wonderful!
it was delicious for us!
Thank you, Suns !!!