Sourdough rye bread in a bread maker

How to correct it? For example, I bake whole grain bread in Panasonic 257 according to the usual 4-hour program - it turns out great. But instead of 2 teaspoons of yeast per 600 grams of flour, you need to put some amount of "eternal" rye sourdough there) But what ??? Maybe there is a certain proportion?

Creativity is, of course, good ... but about yeast, this is not the address of the topic and mine ... I don’t know such a word, .. I forgot and I don’t want to remember ... but about the leavens there is a lot of information like here, so and in parallel branches ... Regarding the amount of leaven - everything is indicated in the recipes and in the explanations to them ...

Yeah, I'm going to watch the ATP)

This time it worked out better. No, well, it tasted great that time, but this time the look is also pleasing to the eye. ))

I baked bread on a "semi-finished product" according to this recipe, but did not add malt, coriander, caraway seeds and flaxseed, because the task was to get rye as in childhood, which was a 9 kopeck brick.
Here's what happened.
🔗
🔗
The taste is exactly the one I wanted - moderately with sourness, but the structure is not at all the same ...
In my opinion, it did not fit well, but if you keep it on the proofer for longer, it will probably be too sour?
The crumb is very dense, the pores are too small (can I add a couple of spoons to panfarin for splendor?) The roof is cracked (it was necessary to make notches?).
I did this: I took a spoonful of a semi-finished product from the refrigerator, fed 175 flour + 175 water and put it in a warm place for 4 hours. The leaven came up. but not really. It is difficult to determine the volume. because I did it in a porcelain salad bowl.
Further, I loaded it into HP and in the Pizza mode, kneading for 20 minutes (I didn't keep track of it. Too much).
She took out the bucket and put it on the battery for proofing for 4.5 hours. The surface temperature of the bucket is 30 degrees. (measured with a contact thermometer).
Then for baking for 1.5 hours.
Tell me. what was done wrong !!
By the way, another question. The recipe says. that the proofing is in "Gluten-free" mode. But I have instructions (I have a Panasonic 2502). it is indicated that first there is kneading for 15-20 minutes (well, here it is clear that you need to pull out the scapula), then rise for 1 hour 50 minutes - 2 hours 45 minutes, and then baking. So you have to constantly watch in order to catch the time and not switch to the baking mode ?, then reset the program and set the mode again in a new way to get a proofing for 4 hours?
I really look forward to the opinion of experienced bakers !!!!

PS. I can't find buttons to insert a photo directly into a message

I think the question is to the leaven, how "strong" it is and to the flour itself - this is about the "bubbles" and the height of the bread rise. And about the "gluten-free" mode, I turn it off 50 minutes before the end, the "baking" is just turned on, and it is in the HP, like in a thermos. I turn it on for baking when the dough rises, not reaching a couple of centimeters to the edge of the "bucket", then the pores / bubbles are already large enough ...

I think the question is to the leaven, how "strong" it is and to the flour itself - this is about the "bubbles" and the height of the bread rise.

Thanks for the answer.
It also seems to me that the leaven is not very strong.
I did it just a few days before.
And how to "strengthen" it? Or will it happen automatically over time?
And in the process of making the leaven, there was no such strong "bubbling", which is shown in the instructions for its preparation.
Maybe you should redo it?

Thanks for the answer.
It also seems to me that the leaven is not very strong.
I did it just a few days before.
And how to "strengthen" it? Or will it happen automatically over time?
And in the process of making the leaven, there was no such strong "bubbling", which is shown in the instructions for its preparation.
Maybe you should redo it?

To enhance the properties of the sourdough, you need to feed it regularly, avoiding acidification. She will grow up and get stronger.
The roof in the bread could crack from lack of water (too dense dough) or insufficient proofing (add time)

I baked bread on a "semi-finished product" according to this recipe, but did not add malt, coriander, caraway and flaxseed, since the task was to get rye as in childhood, which was a 9 kopeck brick.
Here's what happened.
🔗
🔗
The taste is exactly the one I wanted - moderately sour, but the structure is not at all the same ...
In my opinion, it didn't fit enough, but if you keep it on the proofer for longer, it will probably be too sour?
The crumb is very dense, the pores are too small (can I add a couple of spoons to panfarin for splendor?) The roof is cracked

I looked at the photo. Rather, it's about the proofing. If you are afraid of over-acidification, you can taste the dough while proving, gently pinching it off. Then you can find a middle ground: the acidity will strengthen you, and the bread will be able to rise more.

To enhance the properties of the sourdough, you need to feed it regularly, avoiding acidification. She will grow up and get stronger.

Yesterday I fed my sourdough 100X100, let it stand for almost a day and put it in the refrigerator.
Right? or screwed up again?

Yesterday I fed my sourdough 100X100, let it stand for almost a day and put it in the refrigerator.
Right? or screwed up again?

During the day, the leaven could “eat” everything and again “get hungry”. And when she's starving, acid builds up in her. Therefore, get your starter culture out of the refrigerator, take a small part of it, feed it 1: 3, let it stand for an hour in a warm place, and then go to the refrigerator. Never put starving starter in the refrigerator.
Read more about storage here

During the day, the leaven could “eat” everything and again “get hungry”. And when she's starving, acid builds up in her. Therefore, get your starter culture out of the refrigerator, take a small part of it, feed it 1: 3, let it stand for an hour in a warm place, and then go to the refrigerator. Never put starving starter in the refrigerator.
Read more about storage here

Thanks for the answer.
I fed the sourdough, separated a part for kneading bread, put the rest in the refrigerator. But in the refrigerator, it continues to grow.
Stands on a shelf where +3 degrees. And now what to do with it.
And I kneaded rye, now it stands on the battery and rises much better than the first time.
Then I will bake and report on the results.

Stands on a shelf where +3 degrees. And now what to do with it.

Too low temperature, it seems to me, ICD will not survive, only yeast will remain. If you need a starter culture in which yeast and LAB are balanced, then you will have to refuse storage in the refrigerator, or adjust t so that on any of the shelves it is 11-13 degrees.

Too low temperature, it seems to me, ICD will not survive, only yeast will remain. If you need a starter culture in which yeast and LAB are balanced, then you will have to refuse storage in the refrigerator, or adjust t so that on any of the shelves it is 11-13 degrees.

Sorry off-topic, but since there was such a conversation. What should I do? The temperature in my refrigerator is not regulated. And in the apartment, I'm afraid it will peroxide.

Too low temperature, it seems to me, ICD will not survive, only yeast will remain. If you need a starter culture in which yeast and LAB are balanced, then you will have to refuse storage in the refrigerator, or adjust t so that on any of the shelves it is 11-13 degrees.

For the first time I made a sourdough and settled on a "semi-finished product" as the simplest one. That's where it says what to store at +3
But yeast in sourdough alone does not suit me. I and the MCB will come in handy on the farm. I will put another one. Please advise which one.so that it was easier and not to screw up the young starter.

Now about the newly made one ... I climbed very quickly, even stopped, and therefore the roof collapsed.
BUT it turned out not black, but gray and the taste is not the same. In frustration, I sin for torment. The first time I did this. NEVER AGAIN
Here's the flour and what happened:

Sorry off-topic, but since there was such a conversation. What should I do? The temperature in my refrigerator is not regulated. And in the apartment, I'm afraid it will peroxide.

what model of refrigerator? Still, "+3" is the lowest possible for the refrigerator compartment, if there is no internal fan in the compartment, then you can put it on the uppermost shelf. I think +7 - +9 should be there at least and this will solve the problem. Although it would be interesting to listen to a specialist in this organic matter (sourdough).

what model is the refrigerator?

"Ocean". I put a room thermometer on the refrigerator door, it shows +5.

From starter cultures you can make:
lactic acid by Admin
or eternal

Fermented dark rye malt is required for the "black" bread

From starter cultures you can make:
lactic acid by Admin
or eternal

Fermented dark rye malt is required for the "black" bread

Thank you!
But the last bread, which I showed, was quite black even without malt.
For me, malt is good in breads like Borodinsky. And now my task is to make it plain black.

I'm going to study leaven. I'll put it in the evening.

"Ocean". I put a room thermometer on the refrigerator door, it shows +5.

place the thermometer on the uppermost shelf, give it time to adapt, at least fifteen to twenty minutes, I think it will be +7 - +9, in theory, an acceptable temperature for sourdough. I have +7, put it out only for the sake of sourdough, no matter what, falls asleep and comes to life before baking ...
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p.s. Regarding "Sourdough" - I found quite an interesting article, I recommend to join:
mariana-aga.livejournal.com/129913.html

p.s. Regarding "Sourdough" - I found quite an interesting article, I recommend to join:
mariana-aga.livejournal.com/129913.html

Oh-oh-oh very good article, thanks!

I read the article.
I liked it, because everything is logically stated.
Copied myself for further study

boriks, Thank you!

[Angela Leonidovna]

Angela Leonidovna
Tartilla
Happy to help. Indeed, the article is competent ...

Has anyone tried to add honest? I really want to add, but I'm afraid that the leaven will not work)

[Zuboff]

Has anyone tried to add honest? I really want to add, but I'm afraid that the leaven will not work)

Zuboff, fresh can neutralize sourdough. Garlic is still an antiseptic! And we have bacteria. Try dry garlic. There is such, it is in granules. I added and the leaven worked. But I added a little. Rather not for taste but for smell. A teaspoon was enough for me so that when baking such an aroma was present for the whole house that they could not wait for it to be baked, but while it cooled down, we walked around it in a round dance ...

Thanks, I'll try! And I still have a question. I somehow kneaded the dough, leveled it from above with my hands moistened not in water but in oil - and he almost did not rise (I think, maybe he didn't have enough air?

Thanks, I'll try! And I still have a question. I somehow kneaded the dough, leveled it from above with my hands moistened not in water but in oil - and he almost did not rise (I think, maybe he didn't have enough air?

Yes, it looks like you sealed it

[Arka]

Arka
with thanks!
Here is my rye bread - delicious! True, I sprinkled the top with cumin and cardamom, but all night I dreamed of a piece of bread with bacon.

[Arka]

Arka
with thanks!
Here is my rye bread - delicious! True, I sprinkled the top with cumin and cardamom, but all night I dreamed of a piece of bread with bacon.

To your health!
I think you can reduce the amount of water
What is your starter culture and how does it feel?

What is your starter culture and how does it feel?

rye eternal
but I have regular rye flour. I understood about water. I will try

I think you can reduce the amount of water

here is such a loaf of bread after reducing the water. It seems to me that it still needs to be reduced, right?

I think the crumb looks very good. Is it sticky?

Yes a little.

Good day! Thank you for the recipe - this is exactly what I'm looking for. But since I am a beginner as a baker, I do not understand everything, help me please. I apologize if the questions are stupid What does it mean - Active 100% sourdough on peeled rye flour 350 g (175: 175)? I will only grow the leaven, I decided to try to grow the "eternal", there I will follow the recipe, which ends with the fact that on the third day the leaven is divided in half and one portion is put into bread. And how do you prepare it for your recipe? What does the proportion 175: 175 mean. Thank you very much in advance

What does the proportion 175: 175 mean.

this means 175g water + 175g flour = 100% sourdough.

[skatarios]

skatarioswhen the sourdough ingredients are equal by weight, the leaven is called 100%.
According to this recipe, 350 g of active sourdough means that a few (4-8) hours before kneading the dough, you feed / refresh your sourdough, bringing its weight to 350 g. When it bubbles and increases in volume 2-3 times, it is considered active and can be used in batch.

Thank you for such a clear explanation! Now I seem to understand everything, I will try!

Go for it and you will definitely succeed! Sourdough bread is a delight!

Thanks a lot for the recipe! Pure rye bread, and even in a bread maker ...
The first batch seemed a little thin to me, the next time I reduced the amount of water by 100 ml and everything was in order (purely for my taste!).
Somewhat annoying is the moment that, due to the removal of the mixer (after kneading the dough), a rather large piece of bread is baked to the axis of the bucket. Which remains at the bottom of the bucket after removing the bread (unfortunately, I did not think to take a picture ...). It's a shame - and the loaf deteriorates, and you have to knock it out of the bucket, making some effort. Rye dough is inherently sticky, and there is no getting away from it.
I thought about it and turned a small tip out of fluoroplastic-4 to protect the axis from contact with the dough. Now I just change the stirrer to this tip before "digging" a hole in the kneaded dough. After baking, he gets out of the hole in the bottom of the loaf "with a bang." One has only to slightly pry it with something sharp. And a loaf with a tip inside from the bucket now falls out almost by itself.
About the use of fluoroplastic. It can withstand heating up to 300 degrees (hardly more than two hundred in a bread machine when baking ...), contact with food is allowed ... But you need to use pure white fluoroplastic-4. And a lathe (or a friend's turner :)). It took me 5 minutes to make such a tip. By the way, the bucket itself is also equipped with a Teflon (or, which is the same thing, a fluoroplastic ...) "non-stick" coating, though of a slightly different composition.
And further. The tip should not fit very tightly on the shaft. In my case, a gap of 0.1 mm was quite enough.
Beautiful loaves to all!

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URL = https: //Mcooker-enn.tomathouse.com/r-image/r.1/F/s61./i173/1211/2c/6d93e6581968.jpg.html][/ Url

URL = https: //Mcooker-enn.tomathouse.com/r-image/r.1/F/s004./i207/1211/35/3ec9a6907539.jpg.html][/ Url

[IgorR]

Still, we have an inventive people!
IgorR, it turns out beautiful bread!
I'm glad I liked the recipe!

And nothing comes off my bread, on the axis a very small layer of baked dough remains, and the bread looks exactly the same "bottom" as in your picture.

Here is my firstborn with this recipe! Only I added two tablespoons of pumpkin seeds inside, and sprinkled cumin on top.

The baker began her journey with yeast-free rye, because I love the complexity and see meaning in home baking only when yeast is avoided. Although I do not hesitate to whip up the yeast sometimes)))) The eternal leaven also succeeded right away, to see how I could smell how I want everything to work out, which I wish everyone !!!

Thanks for the recipe!

[Arka]

Arka, thank you for the recipe!
kneaded in KhP (on dumplings - 20 minutes), and defrosted and baked in a slow cooker.
there was no caraway, I poured sunflower seeds!
flour was 80% peeled, 20% whole grain,
I understand that the recipe is universal and with any ratio of flour it will turn out delicious !!!
baked in the evening, left in a towel overnight,
and in the morning we tasted:

Girls, Ksyusha, nlili, it's nice that you liked the bread! Thanks for photos! The bread turned out great! Such a crumb is uniformly perforated! Super!
Bake to your health! Make you happy and pamper your loved ones!
The recipe is really universal, only adjust the water individually to different flours.

I bought a Panasonic 2500 today, accidentally went to this site and was upset (((. It turns out that it does not have the function of Rye bread, and I even dreamed about yeast-free sourdough.) Can I return it, or is not everything lost?

I bought a Panasonic 2500 today, accidentally went to this site and was upset (((. It turns out that it does not have the function of Rye bread, and I even dreamed about yeast-free sourdough.) Can I return it, or is not everything lost?

You get upset early ... in your HP, for any, there is a kneading and baking program separately ... and any program can be adapted or only part of the program can be used (for example - Knead and distance for 20 minutes ....) and then just turned it off and continued your rye yeast-free for another 2-1.5 hours, without opening the lid ...
In general, it is not categorical!

Use your wit and study your HP in detail! I wish you success!

Better to consult with those who already have it! Here, for example:

https://Mcooker-enn.tomathouse.com/index.php@option=com_smf&topic=197192.0

[Arochka!]

Arochka! Carry Thank you for a wonderful bread! Pure rye, but with sourdough, but in a bread maker!
I gave less water - 250, followed the "flour" of HP, which was kneading oh what a difficult dough. The result is pleasing!
never sticky.
Thank you !!!



]

Lenka, what a good bread!
Such a perforated crumb! I would have eaten a piece!

[Arka]

Arka, thanks for the recipe.
As soon as my "type" eternal leaven matured, I decided to try to bake bread using it - it seemed the simplest and most understandable. Of course, I cannot assess the result adequately enough, since this is the first experience, but my husband liked it
🔗

Tatyana, handsome bread! Golden!
The roof could turn out to be flat for some reason: either it stalled a little (less likely, since the perforation of the crumb is quite uniform), or a little less water is needed (more likely).
How is the crumb consistency?

Thank you)
Well, such a crumb, slightly sticky of course, but not much. But the second bread just stopped ... we went unexpectedly to take tests for the child and were delayed. I wonder what happens, it smelled so sour from the stove.