Wheat-rye 50x50 bread with live yeast (bread maker)

next time I will try the gluten free program ...

But nevertheless, the best thing is "pizza" + "rye" - no need to be nervous whether there will be boning or not.

that is, boning is still available on the "quick bread" program.

Well, I counted it right;) After all, a fast one for wheat seems to be provided, but he definitely needs deboning. But I, too, will wait for the report, it became so interesting to me, what if I shouldn’t have turned off the quick one in vain and just baked on baking. Rinochka, move over, I'll sit down with you in a corner too. No, I have already tried it once on the gluten-free one, I don't remember what, but how, but I know for sure - I didn't like the bread

[Andreevna]

Still a little warm, but could not resist

the roof is clearly cracked

height at peak 9.5 cm

in the context, I don't know what it should be, it seems to me a little damp, maybe because it hasn't cooled down completely. I tried a piece, the sweetness is present in moderation, but the salt is not enough for me. But for a start, I think it's okay, for which I thank you all. Next I'll try on the first option with the "rye" mode
Andreevna How long do you have for proofing and baking - I also want to try

[orion]

gluten-free in orion scorching ukka.

[nut]

nut
Well, well, the roof is cracked, the main thing is the taste! And I really liked it. Well, I never time the time, because this is no use at all different temperatures in the kitchen. I just watch the dough from time to time after half an hour. Immediately you must not miss it, so that it does not go into bubbles and does not fall out of place. Well, try it once and you will understand everything at once. This bun went up by about 3/4 of a bucket and I turned on baking for 1 hour. But in the process of kneading the dough, I had to add another 2 tbsp. l. from under a bread machine of water, because the flour is completely dry now. Well, I had homemade apple cider vinegar.

[Andreevna]

Andreevna -thank you I understood everything-the principle is apparently the same when proofing - it's better to miss out than to overdo it

["Pizza" - 12 min.]

Hello dear ladies!
My HP Ps-256 I have so far less than a week. However, after three relatively successful experiments in the normal mode, I was already drawn to the exotic. Very interesting. Moreover, rye baking is not provided for the 256th. But although Russia is slipping into the state of a country of consumers, it still remains a country of craftsmen. My own experience in cooking is much higher than the average among men, but in terms of baking it ... in a word, you can't see it without a magnifying glass.
Therefore, he acted, relying on this forum thread, plus his own common sense.
1. Changes to the recipe.
Instead of missing malt, I used 30 ml of kvass wort produced in Rostov-Yaroslavsky. With the appropriate correction of the amount of water.
Instead of coriander, I added 0.5 ct. l. cumin.

2. Cyclogram of the process.
Part one according to the recipe. Mode "Pizza" - 12 min. Reset.
Mode "Main" (indication of Rest alignment). On 35th minute refueling the second part of the recipe components. On 59th minute reset.
Mode "Quick"... On 38th minute (20 batch + 18) discharge.
Mode "Main" (indication of Rest alignment). On 55th minute right before our eyes (opened to look) the top fell off. Overexposed, however. Reset.
Mode "Baking" 1 hour.
Finish..

Surprisingly, except for the failed crust, everything is fine. The taste was stupefied. Sons (just the eldest came to visit) daredand, only I managed to get it cold. My wife and I only got to try.

Thank you all for the very constructive discussion leading up to my attempt.
EC

[Rina]

Rina Today I baked this bread again.I slightly changed the recipe, took 280 ml of water and flour in. from. 200 g plus two tbsp. l. Salt increased to 2 tsp. On this, perhaps, I will stop. Everything turned out in the best possible way and the roof was not collapsed. Thanks again for the recipe!

[Countryman]

Countryman, welcome to our warm company

As far as I understand, you have already passed two full kneading doughs with rye flour?
The fact is that rye flour requires one rise. That is why I created this technique. If you already "dance" with the stove almost all the time that is required for such bread, try all the same, but
1. "pizza" 5-10 minutes - wheat flour + water + yeast, discharge.
2. an hour later "pizza" with the rest of the ingredients - until the end of the batch, discharge.
3. in an hour and a half, "baking" for an hour.

As I wrote, other options are to put "gluten-free" or "quick" on the main one an hour after mixing the dough. But these options also require verification - I did not use "gluten-free" at all. The other day I got the "fast" bread (I still need to clarify whether it contains deboning or not).

and now I'm going to cut bread, which has 100 wheat and 300 rye flour. Let's see what happened ...

[Rina!]

Thank you, Rina!
I'll try.
In general, I am satisfied. Especially the new one.
Now the task is to minimize the number of manipulations.

And the rise of rye was actually one. As soon as on the "fast" she made a second attempt to twitch, I knocked her out.

Conclusion-conclusions. There is room to grow. We will try.

With SW.,
EC

["Pizza" - 12 min.]

2. Cyclogram of the process.
Part one according to the recipe. Mode "Pizza" - 12 min. Reset.
Mode "Main" (indication of Rest alignment). On 35th minute refueling the second part of the recipe components. On 59th minute reset.
Mode "Quick". On 38th minute (20 batch+18) reset.
Mode "Main" (indication Rest alignment) ... On 55th minute right before our eyes (opened to look) the top fell off. Overexposed, however. Reset.
Mode "Baking" 1 hour.

mode "pizza" - kneading dough.
Mode "main" kneading the rest of the ingredients, reset at the 59th minute.
Now the main rise of the dough is in progress!
after the rise of the dough (about an hour later) it was necessary to choose "baked goods".


You specify even further "fast" and "basic". - was it supposed to warm up the dough? Or were there any kneading / boning?

If this was done for the sake of "heating", then it was best not to turn on these programs, risking skipping the beginning of the batch, but to come up a couple of times and turn on the "baking" for exactly one minute (by the way, "temperature equalization" does not always mean heating the food).

[Rina!]

Rina!
My kneading went only twice.
Wheat flour in the "Pizza" mode and added to the prepared rye dough in the "Fast" mode.
The rise of the dough (both the dough itself and after the second kneading of rye on the dough) proceeded on the first fragment of the "basic" mode, which corresponds to "leveling". Temperature, I believe, equalization.
I set this mode to reduce the influence of my own temperature in the room. It would be possible, probably, and just to raise the disabled program. I did not bring the "main" one to the mix - I dropped it before. (59, 38, etc. - a minute is not a countdown timer, but the time elapsed from the start of the next program start)
Well, and another 18 minutes of a fragment of the ascent from the "fast" mode to the heap to the same process of ascent to the tail of the village.

EC
PS. Maybe I went over in something ... but an incurably experimental physicist has been sitting in me since my student days at Moscow State University

[Countryman]

Eh, physicists-lyricists
Countrymanis it very cold in your kitchen?

[Countryman]

Countrymanis it very cold in your kitchen?

We will do as much as we wish. I have a private house with gas heating. At the moment in question it was somewhere between 22-23. Celsius.

At an ideologically close local forum 🔗 consider the optimum temperature for yeast to work 27-29. True for a slightly different purpose.

Then you do not need to be smart with "heating", let the dough rise in a bucket calmly. Maybe it won't be an hour, but an hour and a half.
By the way, in fact, "temperature equalization" does not heat food.It's just that the oven takes into account the temperature and makes the proofing of the dough longer (if it's cold, accordingly, the kneading will start earlier) or shorter (if it's warm). An exception, if well, it is sooooo cold (one of the members of the forum overcooled the sensor with some frozen food, so the stove began to warm up even before mixing).

There is heating at the stage of proving the dough.

Well, that's okay.
So it will be in the future. Maybe the loaf's roof will be more intact.

By the way, in fact, "temperature equalization" does not heat food. It's just that the oven takes into account the temperature and makes the proofing of the dough longer (if it's cold, accordingly, the kneading will start earlier) or shorter (if it's warm). An exception, if well, it is sooooo cold (one of the members of the forum overcooled the sensor with some frozen food, so the stove began to warm up even before mixing).

There is heating at the stage of proving the dough.

Rina, this topic (about alignment) haunted me. I also conducted experiments. Then I'll write in the right topic.

there will be no photos. But the bread was excellent. I changed the recipe: 100 g of wheat flour (80 ml of water for a dough) and 300 g of rye ...

[Andreevna]

Yesterday I repeated the baking of bread. My son came for lunch and ate some bread from the first experience (he doesn't eat any bread at all) and he liked it so much that he ordered another bake. The second experiment did how she kneaded and baked Andreevna and the bread turned out well, exactly like hers in the photo - GREAT Only instead of honey I fell asleep 2 tbsp. l brown sugar, the rest is as in the recipe I liked the bread myself very much Thank you Rina

For me, one of the biggest praises is when children enjoy eating what you cook. And the collective mind

[Rina]

Rina, again baked bread according to your scheme and again not "Glute-free".
This time the dough withstood 1 hour and 20 minutes. Looks like very much, got up, better than last time. The roof is cracked again, but I like it, it gives a certain charm.
I put unbrewed malt, coriander, cumin and flax seeds in the bread. The smell is breathtaking !!!
It cools down, I'll post a photo.

[21:00. I tried it.]

... this topic (about alignment) haunted me. I also conducted experiments ...

I can also experiment with temperature changes during leveling. By means of objective control.
I have a pea-sized electronic thermometer with remote sensors in my horseless farm. Measuring T with an accuracy of 0.1 degrees. I put a sensor on a thin cable into the heating element zone, cover the lid and look at the display. The heating element turns on when leveling or not. I'll try it tonight.

21:00. I tried it.
Conditions.
Two thermal sensors. The first, control HP outside the hull. Measures the temperature in the room. The second one is suspended inside the HP in the gap between the heating element and the bucket at the level of the heating element.
Experience 1.
The readings of the first and second coincide and are equal to +24.5 С. After switching on the "main" mode in the HP, nothing happened for 20 minutes.
Conclusion - the temperature is normal, the process is running normally and does not need correction from the CP. Reset. Experience terminated.

Experience 2.
The temperature in the bucket is lowered with a handful of snow. After cooling, the snow is removed, the bucket is placed in the HP. The sensor reading inside has dropped and continues to fall further. At + 12C switched on the "main" mode. The temperature immediately began to rise. Clicks are heard characteristic of the thermal expansion of the heating element. The heating element is clearly turned on. After 2 minutes, the readings of both sensors matched, i.e., the temperature in the gap reached room temperature. At the beginning of the fifth minute, at a temperature in the gap of + 33.4C, the heating turned off. The temperature began to drop and after ten minutes it became below room. Apparently, as a result of the first heating, the bucket has not yet evened out the temperature, remaining still quite cold. At the 22nd minute, at T = 22.7, the batch started. Experience terminated. The program has stopped.

Conclusion. The program attempted heating. Based on the analysis of temperature changes, a command was developed to turn on the batch earlier in comparison with the standard one. Presumably, in order to increase the time of its subsequent rise at a colder temperature.Will the heating cycle be repeated while the process continues? I think yes.

The conclusion is general.
When using the oven in a mode other than automatic with the "leveling" stage, it is better not to show off. Or, everything is fine with him and the HP can be not turned on at all, or, if the temperature is not standard, the batch can turn on at an arbitrary moment that is not controlled and not necessary for us. What is not gut.
So I shouldn't have practiced this alignment yesterday when baking. It's good that everything turned out so happily.

Rina was right.

Here is a photo of my today's bread.

[here]

The heating element turns on when leveling or not. I'll try it tonight.

I invite ALIGNMENT to discuss here

[Rina]

Finally.
In total, according to this recipe, I baked five pieces on my 256th.
The last three turned out to be one to one. And delicious and the roof is in place.
The process can be considered completed. You can "assign a letter" and put it into a series.

At the stage of mastering HP, I believe it is necessary to work out two or three recipes until ready for execution without the intervention of the head. Controlled by the spinal cord alone. Everyday.
There were no problems with wheat, but now rye has arrived.

Thank you, Rina!

[Rina]

Rina,
Thank you very much I will do it again and more than once I went one to one with your

[Rina]

Rina And today I once again baked this bread and tried to increase the amount of salt, malt and coriander ... To say that I liked it means to say nothing !!!!!!!!! Divine !!!!!!! Now that's the only way I will do !!!!!!!!
Everything according to the recipe from the first page. My amendments:

instead of water, I took very sour kvass
sea ​​salt 2 tsp dimensional
malt 3 tbsp l. dimensional
ground coriander 2.5 tsp dimensional

She defended it for a long time, until it rose to 3/4 forms. Baked in the oven, in the shape of a "brick", 180 degrees, 1 hour 10 minutes. Smell is something !!!!! And the crust is so delicious !!!! Mine immediately pounced, half a loaf is gone. And to taste - exactly like our Donetsk Borodinsky
RINA THANKS ONCE AGAIN

I'm so glad the bread turns out
Yesterday I again put it according to this recipe, there was no way to follow the kneading, so there was unmixed flour on one side of the bread (but I don't pay much attention to this).

I also increased the amount of coriander to 1 tbsp. l., honey up to 40 g, salt 1 3/4 tsp.

The usual rye flour is over, I bought a peeled one from another manufacturer. Yesterday I put on this bread again, but for some reason increased the amount of honey (I already have it melted down) to 54 g. And why did I do that? The bread itself turned out to be delicious, but with ground bacon, salt is sharply manifested in the taste of both bread and bacon, and even the sweetness is not a hint in the taste, but so ... tangible.

did yesterday - everything is gorgeous! I will throw a photo from work on Monday. the lid tore the honey 35g my many, they said it wouldn’t work with bacon, but with the borschik they dared the dough for 1h20m times in 3 times in size rose ... up to 3-40 and reset and start again. everything is gorgeous. baked on the fast bread mode. thanks for the recipe !!!!!!

................, but with ground bacon ...........

I really want to bake good bread. Yu

But what about bacon?

But what about bacon?

I didn't quite understand, but what is the question?

Here ... I brag about what beauty and deliciousness it turns out Taste - Borodinsky poured ... How glad I am that I can now bake it ITSELF My friend called a maniac at work The main thing is that it is so soft for the second, and even for the third day ... I don’t know any longer, we don’t have it. THANKS IROCHKA



This is exactly the loaf that was baked by leaps and bounds Orange Record. The difference in proofing time is noticeable, an hour and a half and the dough doubled ... I had to wait three hours with Lviv yeast ...

[BlackHairedGirl]

BlackHairedGirl, krasaaaaavets
And the girlfriend is just jealous if only with white envy

As for yeast - whenever possible, I use pressed Kryvyi Rih "Lux" (they have a pack with yellow and red).

such beauty and deliciousness turned out





but the honey needs to be reduced

[Davli,]

lifted in the main mode when the leveling is in progress 4 times turned on, waited until 3-40 and reset and start again

Davli, why were these dances with tambourines? On "leveling", no heating occurs (unless, well, it is oooooooo very cold in the house, so that the shades begin to heat in this mode, there must be something frozen in the bread maker, but then the batch will turn on much earlier). Look at page 6 Countryman also described his adventures with resetting "leveling", and on the previous page already described the results of testing the operation of HP with thermal sensors https://Mcooker-enn.tomathouse.com/index.php@option=com_smf&topic=109387.0

With the roof torn off, it seems to me that there was not enough liquid in the dough, but you need to ask our gurus about this in the topic Help, nothing comes out (ambulance)

yes already figured out with the "alignment" more so I will not "freak". but with the roof, almost all rye vomit it, but I will do the second batch the other day and check, everything was fine with the kolobok, because the liquid there was normal ... I would even add another spoonful of flour "from Darnitsky's experience", but not liquid ...

for me, too, the main thing is what's inside. And since I liked the bread, then

[Rina]

Rina Thank you very much for the recipe, and maybe I added a little more malt. mine said - reduce a little honey and in the "family recipe for bacon" now there lives Darnitsky and gostovsky bread (loaf) (looks like a milk and vanilla bar).

Thanks for the recipe!
Very tasty!
True, the wheat flour I came across was not very good, I had to fill it up, there was no kolobok at all - the bread was no longer 50/50. I will definitely still bake!

[Freesia]

Freesia, and at what stage did you add flour?

Dough kneaded, stood for 1 hour. Then I added the rest of the ingredients, kneaded HP for 5 minutes, and here I started adding ..

in a wheat-rye kolobok and will not be. For example, I have crocozyabra, which sticks its top to the wall of the bucket and turns so to round off the workpiece, you need to pour some oil on the top of the dough at the end of the batch and tear off the tail of the crocozyabra from the wall with a spatula.

I didn’t aspire to the kolobok, it was just a very liquid dough, I had to fill it up, but it still remained liquid. The bread is delicious!

And now I put it down again, took wheat flour and whole grain rye - there was already at least crocozyabra.
The child was distracted, forgot to add another spoonful of oil
Nothing, tomorrow I will bake again

[Freesias]

I now like Freesias - even there is no krakozyabra I poured flour, poured it, but still liquid I don’t understand what it is? After all, I already baked this bread ...
I put it on for proofing for 1 hour, then I will bake

I want to say that this bread is very grateful

Yesterday I deflated the dough for 1 hour 20, baked for 1 hour 5 minutes ... The roof is even, not convex, but not collapsed ... The only thing is that the structure of the roof is not entirely uniform - in a bubble (oh, I picked up the word - not smooth), probably a bit stood ...
I tried this morning - soft and very tasty bread - I ate 2 pieces, for me this is a lot
My changes - vinegar 30g (water, respectively, less by 10g), unmilled coriander - 2 tsp, then grinded a little in a mortar, coarse salt - 2 tsp.

Now I'm trying to understand why the dough was liquid Wheat flour was the same, but freshly bought. I had to sleep a lot, I don't even know how much. But as it turned out, this did not affect the quality at all

[Rina]

And I baked bread according to the method Rina, for which I am grateful
In my Orionchik 27 there is no Rye program, but Rina gave me advice to knead the dough with wheat flour, let it stand for 1-1.5 hours, add rye flour, oil, malt and spices and bake on a suitable setting with a single batch. Orion 27 has this "glute-free" regime.
Everything worked out, the current I, confused, withstood the dough for 40 minutes, overcame me. So the roof burst ...
And here is the bread ...
🔗

I am a beginner baker, the model of the stove is the same as yours, I really want to bake rye bread, you can describe this process step by step, otherwise it is not very clear about the dough. And in my instructions there is no "gluten-free" mode, is there "gluten-free bread" - is it the same thing? Where did you get the malt?
And about 9-kopeck buns, the baking process is incomprehensible, and the photo is "delicious"
Help me please.

[Aksinka]

Aksinka, until ukka no, I'll try to answer. We were just discussing and thinking about how to cook this bread in Orion.
one.knead yeast, wheat flour and water for 10 minutes on the "dough" program until smooth. Reset the program leave the dough alone for an hour and a half.
2. While the dough is brewing, measure out and pour rye flour, malt, coriander over the dough.
3.in the remaining water dissolve salt, honey and vinegar.
4. Pour the solution over the flour and start the gluten-free bread program (aka gluten-free).
5. You can add oil at once with all the ingredients, or you can when the dough, flour and water are already mixed (carefully add a couple of tablespoons of oil).

[Aksinka,]

Posts in this thread

Quote
Aksinka, until ukka no, I'll try to answer. We were just discussing and thinking about how to cook this bread in Orion.
1. Knead yeast, wheat flour and water for 10 minutes on the "dough" program until smooth. Reset the program leave the dough alone for an hour and a half.
2. While the dough is brewing, measure out and pour rye flour, malt, coriander over the dough.
3.in the remaining water dissolve salt, honey and vinegar.

This is exactly what I do. Until this very stage.

4. Pour the solution over the flour and start the gluten-free bread program (aka gluten-free).

Have Aksinka there is no gluten-free mode. I have it, but I do not use it in this task. I just knead again in the "dough" mode - 20-25 minutes. Then I reset the program. And I leave it on the switched off stove to rise for an hour 10 - hour 20 minutes.
Well, and then I turn on the "baking" mode for one hour.
And everything - further "take away the ready-made" (c) - already 9 pcs. baked.

Thanks for your help, now only the malt needs to be found! I will definitely bake, then I will report