Rye sourdough (semi-finished product)

I'd better throw it away right away so that no one would suffer, neither me, nor she?

Unfortunately, it's best to throw it away.
If the liquid is at the top, there are options (the patient is alive, but sick, it can be treated), and if at the bottom, then the patient is dead.

I put in the leaven, after a day it fermented well, fed it, according to the schedule, now after two days it stratified - there is a violent foam on top, and the liquid bounced from the bottom.

She didn't need to be fed in a day. Feeding after 48 hours is two days. And after that, every 12 hours - twice a day.
Start over?

[Viki]

Viki , thanks for such a quick response, it seems I understood my mistake, I went to put it still. For some reason, I have a ratio
water: flour 1: 1, everything was very thick, and I added 2 more spoons of water, in vain, I guess?

with a water: flour ratio of 1: 1, everything was very thick

Fine! You will not recognize this thick in 48 hours.
Everything will be fine!
Good luck!

And I did it
Bread "Pumpernickel" baked. Class !!! One question - can you bake wheat on this leaven? It will probably be grayish or feed the sourdough with wheat flour?

Can you bake wheat on this leaven?

Well, that's wonderful! Congratulations!
About "Pumpernickel" would be nice to be a separate topic .... huh? That would be great!
Wheat, of course, you can. BUT! There will be no such aroma as on wheat leaven, because there are bacteria of wild yeast, but no lactic acid. Raise it, then it will raise the bread and it will be tasty, and even the aroma will be, but not saturated.
What to do to remove dullness:
feed her three times with wheat flour in a ratio of 1: 1: 1, that is, how much sourdough by weight, the same amount of water and the same amount of wheat flour, throwing out half each time.
For example 20 + 20 + 20 doubled, we take 30 grams from it. + 30 + 30 - doubled, we take 45g. and again + 45 + 45 - we get 135 gr. not so dark, but very active leaven. You can bake. Checked.

Thank you. I will definitely try

[Viki,]

Viki,
Help! For the first time I bake on a semi-finished product, and even swung at Borodinsky in accordance with GOST (Luda's version of mariana-aga).

In theory, feeding the starter culture should take 7-12 hours. I decided to use the option of feeding half a portion of flour-water twice. Well, the first time I added half of the top dressing, and the leaven doubled in an hour and a half - isn't it too fast? I will, of course, bury her with a fork, and feed her by the hour, but is there a danger of peroxidation?

! For the first time I bake on a semi-finished product, and even swung at Borodinsky in accordance with GOST (Luda's version of mariana-aga).
I will, of course, bury her with a fork, and feed her by the hour, but is there a danger of peroxidation?

It was on it that I baked it.
Feed twice in 3.5 hours and everything should be fine.
I warn you: he is exactly the same as he was in my childhood - sweet.

[Viki,]

Viki,
You are a miracle! Thank you for your quick reply ... Tell me, please, how do you determine the amount of leaven for the dough? I have now, finally, carefully read the Ludin (mariana-aga) recipe, where 75 g of sourdough goes into the dough, without specifying the% flour-water content. She was asked what moisture the initial leaven should be, but she didn’t answer something. She, quite possibly, did not bring the special leaven to Borodinsky, but used one of her proven ones. But in rye bread, as I understand it, every 10-20 g of water affects the quality of the final product.
In this situation, what are the guidelines for determining how much to put my fed sourdough in the dough so as not to spoil the bread?

And the taste of Borodinsky is unforgettable, and I remember well what is sweet and what is fragrant! I tried to bake it several times, it still came out of a stone consistency, but the aroma Now I want to bring everything else to mind

there, 75 g of sourdough goes into the dough, without specifying the% of flour-water content.

There is 100% sourdough - water and flour are equal in weight.
So, 75 gr. put it safely.
When do we have baked goods scheduled there?

That's great, you don't need to count anything!

Started to feed the sourdough three hours ago. No matter how it grows, I will periodically (once an hour or two) upset it until 7 hours have passed, and the doubled by this time (after all the precipitation) - straight into the dough, right?

More questions!

1.for compressed yeast:
Did you add 0.5 g of yeast to the dough as per recipe, or more? Is 0.5 g not enough?

2. for dough:
Luda's fermentation takes 4 hours - and if I have a different temperature regime, then how not to miss the dough readily? Wait for a rise of about 3 times?

3. by kneading the dough: how much time to knead in the combine, what are the signs that the kneading is ready?

1. 0.5 gr. in Canada it is 1 gr. from the Odessa yeast plant.
2. Add to lukewarm tea leaves and wrap in a towel. After 4 hours into battle. Do not overdo it.
3. In the combine, at the minimum speed, it mixes very quickly. In a minute and a half it will be uniform.
And one more thing: the first stage of brewing was thick for me. Added water. Then from 300 gr. took away. How many - I do not remember.
It will be necessary to bake it specially for our forum. Can you do it? I would like to!!!
I hope I answered all the questions. I disappear for a day. Job.

[Viki,]

Viki,
Thanks for the tips and kind words!
What a pity you disappear! Oh, I feel that I will break the wood without wise leadership.

I would be infinitely grateful to you, and I’m sure I’m not the only one, if you really ever found the opportunity to host a master class on Borodinsky.

[Viki,]

Viki,

With a sad report on Borodinsky - and the hope that you will tell me where I got pierced! My attempt number N suffered another fiasco: I wanted what was best, but received, as always, a tool of the proletariat. I can't understand where I made a mistake and how to live with it further.

Everything was weighed to a gram, yeast was animals, temperatures were strictly maintained. The only gag in terms of ingredients - at the (last) stage of kneading the dough, I added 1.5 along with flour. table. tablespoons of gluten.

The sourdough was fed according to the regimen, some went into the dough (where it sabotaged the process), and some went into the refrigerator (where it continued to rise briskly in the Siberian cold).

It seems that the main failure happened precisely at the stage of making the dough. While in a warm oven (the light was on, T was about 30 * C), it only doubled, a maximum of 2.25, but it was sent to the dough, which turned out to be quite difficult to knead because of its density for my not very sickly stationary mixer-KitchenAid ' at. I started kneading with a hook, but he only smeared the dough on the walls, then I changed awl on soap hook on the shoulder blade. At the same time, in a few seconds, a stone block was collected on the blades, and the machine had to be stopped every 15 seconds in order to pick out the lump and let the dough somehow knead. In general, in 15 minutes of such a batch, we both sweated with a mixer ... yes, there was a desire to add a little water, but did not dare. Probably in vain, but again - I don't know how much!

I left the dough to "rest" for 40 minutes - it practically did not change in volume. Then she blinded the bread with wet hands, left it in the mold, increasing the proofing time to 70 minutes. - as a result, the dough grew by 25-30 percent, even a few holes appeared on the surface.
First baked at a temperature of 260 * C, after 7 minutes reduced to 200 * C. A deep crack appeared at the junction of the roof and one side, and a very small crack on the other side.

Bottom line: after overnight aging in a linen towel, the "bread" is cut and tested. The density is the same as that of a white dwarf, holes are close to zero, and no unbaked areas are observed.

You can break off your teeth about him, but all the same, the pets chew and praise - they are not spoiled for me
Woe to me - I can't pay for my malt

[Viki]

Viki, Goodnight! It's been 48 hours and it's good that you Right again, it looks like my new leaven is doing well, it is bubbled up and smells good. Now I have to take 1 tablespoon ... and here's the question, what kind of dining room - with a slide, under a knife, or is it easier by weight?
Please, tell me a little more, and suddenly, what happens.

it is bloated with bubbles and smells good. Now I have to take 1 tablespoon ... and here's the question, what kind of dining room - with a slide, under a knife, or is it easier by weight?

Unfortunately, I could not respond in a timely manner.
Everything will be fine in any case - even a full spoon, at least not full. I usually stir and take as much as the spoon fits.

Viki, thanks! I think it's better later than never.
I did not measure with a spoon, weighed 20 grams and fed it, after 12 hours I fed it again, it wanders well. What's next, put it in the refrigerator or feed it one more time? Oh, she is a glutton ...

Wall and I did not feed her so much 25 gr. fed and put it in the chill-nik;) When I need to bake bread and in the recipe, let's say I need 200g. sourdoughs, in the evening I take from a jar g. 20-30, add 100 g. rye or wheat flour and 100g. water, mix well and leave it in the kitchen until morning, and in the morning I already knead the dough-bread and so on for 3-4 weeks, depending on how often I bake. When I have just a little starter in my jar, I add 100/100 flour of water to it. I mix well and in the chill-out. That's why I like this leaven (Thanks to VIKI), because it practically does not require attention and flour, lives in a wither and waits in the wings
Vikulenka, I explained correctly

Vikulenka, I explained correctly

Of course that's right, Irochka!

[Nut]

Nut, only when you update it, do not immediately put it in the refrigerator, but after 12 hours .. We must let it accelerate!

When I have just a little starter in the jar, I add 100/100 flour of water to it. I mix well and in the chill-out.

I'm talking about this moment ...

[Viki, Nutlet,]

Viki, Nutlet, thanks for your help, I follow your advice implicitly! I bring it to the refrigerator, one spoon for bread and go, if I don't ruin anything, I'll report back.

Girls, I am again with questions ... I understand that you can feed wheat flour and put on white bread?

I understand that you can feed wheat flour and put on white bread?

We have recently discussed this issue. See how I do:
https://Mcooker-enn.tomathouse.com/index.php@option=com_smf&Itemid=26&topic=42973.0
More precisely, as I did, now I started wheat again, and in the summer there was simply no other way out.

Viki! What about debriefing?
I baked the first sourdough bread according to this recipe:
wheat flour - 250g + 2 tbsp. l. on the bun
rye flour - 50g
sourdough - 200g + 1 tsp dry yeast Saf-moment
dry kvass - 1 tbsp. l.
salt - 1.5 tsp l.
vegetable oil - 2 tbsp. l.
water - 200 ml.
Kneading for Pizza -15 minutes, turned it off, pulled out the stirrer, it was 3.5 hours on the proofer, it looked very nice, even regretted that I did not for the oven, then baking for 1 hour 10 minutes, pulled out a very even, light, but shaped brick. Under the towel, an hour later the roof became very bulging. The crust is already soft today, the bread is quite edible, I don't understand what taste, I expected more. Please, prompt errors
what I did.

URL = https: //Mcooker-enn.tomathouse.com/r-image/r.1/F/s001./i193/1012/2b/adcc7df81ffd.jpg.html]

Please, prompt errors
what I did.

There is only one mistake. You let him rise "all the way" and turned on the baking. And you need to start baking a little earlier, so that he still has room to climb.
Then there will be a wonderful roof.

Viki, but how to understand where this emphasis is? I carefully tried to press down when the hole stopped leveling - I turned on the baking. I slapped him before the deadline, apparently.

I carefully tried to press down when the hole stopped leveling - I turned on the baking.

This is the rule for the oven. After all, you put it in a preheated oven. The most heated.And in HP the warm-up is smooth and the rise continues. Here it is necessary to experimentally select the moment.

Viki came with some bread and thank you! I slightly overfed the semi-finished product with wheat flour and baked 2 loaves in a row, a simple white one and a French one from the instructions, both without supervision at all - it turned out that way, but I needed two breads. Your criticism, but my only gratitude for advice and attention! Sometimes I wanted to dump everything and forget, but I'll go into the topic, and you answered and I again had strength. In my opinion, it turned out, we will still work out the taste, now I will go again to some kind of rye "torment", and suddenly ...
🔗
This is not a trace from a stirrer, these are such large pores.

[wall]

Kaaaky bread!
wall , just a handsome man, did it really turn out like this on rye sourdough - a semi-finished product?
Once again I am convinced that it does not matter what sourdough you grow, it is important that it works !!!
Super, Valyusha! Congratulations!!!

[Margit, Ritochka,]

Margit, Ritochka, I myself did not expect it to go like this. Thanks Viki for help and patience, she answered me every time, that's why it worked out. For me, this is a godsend, I bake normal bread on a timer, I don't like to be in the kitchen a lot, there is plenty of other work. Now I have made up wheat-rye from what was, baked. the roof of the first had sagged, but the taste was correct. Rita, thanks for your support!

Hello! Tell a newbie how a 2 week old fridge smells like. I have fermented wine, but vigorous enough?

[Mar go,]

Mar go, , I don't know about 2 weeks, I smell only 1 week, but my smell is pleasantly tasty sour, not vigorous, I have a hole in the lid so that it breathes, and if it is tightly closed it will start to smell harshly, in my opinion. She herself has not yet understood everything about her, at what temperature it is better to store. Today I baked Darnitsky on it, I liked the taste, thanks Viki !

[Viki]

My sourdough tastes pleasant, slightly sour, I keep it in a kh-nik in the door, the jar is covered with a lid with holes, you know, they drain through such marinade when preserving, though I put 1 layer of a thin paper napkin under it. so that the leaven does not dry out on top.

Viki , and I tried to feed the sourdough with wheat flour 3 times, according to the scheme that you gave. I liked it so much that I left part of it and continue to feed it for several days, 2 times a day. The leaven is so active, it fits with pleasure, it bubbles. There is no taste or smell left from rye.
What does it live with me, what is it called and what is behind it competently to look after, in the sense of maintaining in working order?
Please direct me to the right place with this question.

Hello! Tell a newbie what a 2 week old fridge smells like. I have fermented wine, but vigorous enough?

Bring it back to its original state quickly. So: 1 tbsp. spoon of your starter culture + 100 gr. water + 100 gr. flour and let ferment, but not 12 hours, but less. About 6 hours and refrigerated. There will already be ripening.
I suspect that your refrigerator is 5 degrees. Under such conditions, you need to refresh it every 2 weeks, it accumulates acid too quickly. I had a month at 3 * C.

What does it live with me, what is it called and what is behind it competently to look after, in the sense of maintaining in working order?
Please direct me to the right place with this question.

This is called wheat leaven, as I understand it - 100% moisture. Take care of the same as for any other. We have a well-scheduled care for the French. Look here:
https://Mcooker-enn.tomathouse.com/index.php@option=com_smf&Itemid=26&topic=33627.0
Good luck !!!

[Viki]

Viki , Thanks a lot for your help! Very informative!

Viki, thanks, I'll try to do it according to your advice, in the refrigerator (we have Atlant) + 10, it may be too warm for the sourdough. Do you think the sourdough is peroxidized, and it should have been fed more often? It grows slowly in the refrigerator and it confuses me, and the smell too, and very sour, more than 100 grams. fed sourdough (40 gr. sourdough + top dressing 100 gr. water and 100 gr. rye flour) for 400 gr. I do not put flour.What remains of the fed I send to the refrigerator. And it stayed so thick. Still, I did something wrong initially, because this smell appeared at the moment when it was necessary to send the remainder to the refrigerator. Maybe grow a new leaven?

Maybe grow a new leaven?

A new one is also possible, especially since it is not at all difficult.
For this 10 * C is too much and you need to take this into account. After feeding, it must be kept at room temperature for an hour and then it will ripen in the refrigerator.
If I want to use the starter culture tomorrow, that is, save a day, then I keep it for 3 hours and in the cold. I'll get it out tomorrow, warm up and ready to go. This is how I handle any leaven that I store at 10 * C. I have + 3 * C in one refrigerator, + 10 * C in the other (small, specially for fermentation).

[Viki,]

Viki, thank you tremendous !!!! : flowers: I put a new one, but I will try to revive this one, although there is little hope, now I shake up 1 tbsp. l. your own sourdough with water, the smell of mash in the whole kitchen ...

wall, and thank you for your response, and covered my leaven with a film and made the holes with a toothpick, and kept it. Do you think this option is suitable for storage?

[Viki, Girls,]

Viki, Girls, all good day!
I overfed the semi-finished product completely into wheat, baked milk and French several times, I think I understood, thanks Viki for a wonderful leaven. The truth made everything with jars and bowls, for some reason their hands do not rise to throw away.
Here's some bread!
Weight 834g, height 21cm, the top of the head is slightly crushed by the lid
Mar Go,, it seemed to me that it is better to cover it in the refrigerator with a wet napkin for sourdough, I also have Atlant and is not new at all.

[Viki, Girls,]

Viki, Girls, all good day!
I overfed the semi-finished product completely into wheat, baked milk and French several times, I think I understood, thanks Viki for a wonderful leaven.

wall- Valyusha! 🔗
Delicious bread!
Join the Starters Club! We wait! 🔗

[lana7386,]

lana7386, thanks for your feedback and support!
Without you, my dears, I hardly succeeded! Join the Starter Club, and how is it?

[Join the Starter Club]

Join the Starter Club, and how is it?

Run? https://Mcooker-enn.tomathouse.com/index.php@option=com_smf&Itemid=26&topic=96253.0

[Thank you Viki! lana7386!]

Thank you Viki! lana7386! I ran, looked, I'd rather live here again, if everyone doesn't mind. Where to me, there are aces, I still have to study and learn - according to all the precepts. Besides, I feel good here, warm, cozy ... how battery sourdough.

[ZAKVASKI - in questions and answers]

Background here:
ZAKVASKI - in questions and answers
"Replies # 658-679: December 10-13, 2010"
https://Mcooker-enn.tomathouse.com/in...on=com_smf&topic=3704.650

While I was running around, slamming the doors of kitchen cabinets in search of a suitable jar, I came across my peroxidized "semi-finished product". And what do you think ?! She's up to something again So it smells like braga, there is no doubt that it wanders! Well, what do you want to do with her next? After the last manipulations, it has been in the refrigerator since 12.12.2010 and wanders!

[So]

And what do you think ?! She's up to something again So it smells like braga, there is no doubt that it wanders! Well, what do you want to do with her next?

I am not an instigator, but I would not have endured such a creature's struggle for life.
I would take 1 tbsp. spoon of the creature and went through the points from the first page, starting from point 2.

I am not an instigator, but I would not have endured such a creature's struggle for life.
I would take 1 tbsp. spoon of the creature and went through the points from the first page, starting from point 2.

from the 1st Art. spoon everything is clear, but where else?

ah-ah, I already saw on the 1st page, where

"Semi-finished product" on peeled rye
15/12/2010 20:30
Took art. spoon of "mash". She fed 100x100.
Sealed the top with a film, pierced many holes with a toothpick. I put it at room temperature 24-26. I marked the level with an elastic band.

16/12/2010 08:30
It rose well (seen by the mark) and bubbled. Upon stirring, it turned out that the dough was stringy in the threads. The smell of fermentation is still there, mixed with the smell of yeast dough.

She fed 100x100. I put it at room temperature 24-26. Marked a new level with an elastic band.

16/12/2010 15:00
An attempt was made to escape. The leaven has grown to the very film. I took half of the sourdough for baking. Stretches in threads, well porous, smell of finished dough or dough. Stir half of it and leave it until evening.

16/12/2010 20:30
The remaining half has doubled. I fed 100x100 and left for 1 hour, then put it in the refrigerator on the lower shelf (+5^aboutC) by twisting the container with foil with holes.