Liquid yeast based on fruits, vegetables, herbs, tea ...

9 chemistry was ...

I barely hatched one, and then 9 ...

[Lenochka]

Everybody took a course in organic chemistry at school

Yes, only I seem to have passed by

therefore the bulk has removed this knowledge far, far away. Let's try to move them a little closer. Below is what everyone knows, just a little forgotten.

After all I have read, I have the impression that I didn’t go to school at all!

Lenochka, exactly the same thoughts visited!
Veronica, thank you very much for such a lecture! Very instructive for me! You were lucky to study in Soviet schools, and not, like me, after the collapse of the country ... Teachers changed every six months, especially in chemistry and mathematics with physics. Textbooks were sprinkled at a breakneck speed. That is why I have practically zero knowledge in these subjects. Until now, I remember with tears our history textbook for grade 9 (which, by the way, we bought at our own expense, and brought it to us to the bookstore on order), in which about the Great Patriotic War the war was only 2-3 paragraphs, but there was one paragraph about the blockade of Leningrad ... That's how it is ...

[Elven]

Elven, Lena, yes, they taught us in such a way that I still remember a lot. Nothing, if someone knows what is needed, shares here with the rest with great pleasure.

[Veronica]

Nothing, if someone knows what is needed, shares here with the rest with great pleasure.

Veronica, for which many thanks to all of you!

It is a pity that I have passed this topic for some time: you are already baking with might and main with liquid yeast, I only put them on three days ago.
I made three jars: in the first - apple + water + honey, in the second - banana + honey + water, in the third - apple with banana + honey + cabbage brine. The third one had the highest hopes, but for some reason this jar is standing without fermentation. In the first two, the process went, but so far by the end of the third day there is no foam, although they are all near the battery. Maybe you need to add something there?

[Olga]

Olga, pickling cabbage and other vegetables is a process in which the decomposition of sugars occurs with the help of lactic acid bacteria, and not yeast. When fermented, yeast and, as a result, alcohols and carbon dioxide can be formed, but in small quantities. This process is called lactic acid fermentation, and we need alcoholic fermentation. More likely to make vinegar than baking yeast ...

I put all my jars in the refrigerator ... my grandchildren arrived and I was excommunicated from the kitchen until next Sunday.
So let my railroad cars rest and gain strength. In the meantime, I'll cram theory.

I forgot to add to the lecture: do not keep the jar of yeast warm for a long time, after about 7 days, depending on the amount of sugar, the intensive formation of alcohols begins. And one more thing: yeast does not like sudden temperature fluctuations in any direction.

[Veronica]

Veronica, Thanks for the clarification. The temperature is constant, tomorrow (it turns out, on the 4th day) I will rearrange the jars on the table. Pour out with brine.
So I want to try to bake bread as soon as possible!

[paramed1]

paramed1, Veronica, thanks for the lecture on yeast. Often I just lack understanding of the process, and knowledge of the theory makes it easier to practice. It becomes clearer what you are doing and why.

By the way, Lyudmila, stumbled upon your last year's lecture on doughs on the topic of Easter cake, sat there, even memorized. It turned out to be useful too. Thank you !

Lena, and on the contrary, I had 9 chemistry ...

I also had a lot of chemistry, only somehow they were more and more associated with oil, and there it is still not fermentation, but distillation. And Yeast does not want to obey me, again the mold revealed a temperature of 26 degrees, the jar is clean, why does mold form?

[Svetlana_Ni]

Lyudmila, stumbled upon the topic of Easter cake at your last year's lecture on dough, sat, even memorized. It turned out to be useful too. Thank you !

Svetlana_Ni, Sveta, really, I said something about doughs too! glad it came in handy!

Why does mold form?

Gulya, maybe on the material from which you make the railway, is it there?

I will rearrange the jars on the table. Pour out with brine.

Biryusa, Olga, do not rearrange the jars on the table. Let them also be warm. Veronica wrote that railways do not like temperature changes. I noticed it too.

And for some reason I didn't succeed
I put sourdough on ivan tea and raisins. On day 4, there was very little foam. And the smell was fermentative and sour. I shook her. But after 6 days it got moldy. And there is almost no foam. What I did wrong?
Do you need to open it to breathe for a long time?

Girls, did you grow acetic acid? Maybe it's vinegar film? Second: mold loves high humidity in the environment. We went through this when fermenting tea. There the tea was fermented in the bathroom. It is necessary to open it in order to release excess carbon dioxide - shake it, open it and immediately close it. Oxygen is not needed for the reaction. And with prolonged opening, the mold will populate, it is very volatile. What kind of raw materials?
Try adding a little more sugar. The reaction will be more intense

: (Banana skins with orange peel. - did not work. Apparently I also dragged the jar back and forth, opened it, looked (since 4 days have passed). Maybe I just put a little, I don’t know. Generally, I poured it out. But the yeast on dates is good I have already started bread 2 times. True, the bread is obtained without large holes (like ordinary bread). It’s probably still in the oven. Baked according to the recipe for millet. ”The children liked the taste, but there were no holes.

How did you do it on dates? sugarless?

[Natalia]

Natalia, Luda has a very correct proportion of raw materials and sugar in her recipe. Do not increase the amount of raw materials, it is better to put a little more sugar. And don't open the bank for at least a day at all. The amount of carbon dioxide that is formed does not interfere with the course of the reaction. A day and a half is better. In general, in our case, we are trying to release carbon dioxide, as it is important in baking. And the alcohol evaporates from the dough. When making wine, on the contrary, we need to remove all carbon dioxide, and alcohol should remain.

well, that's what I did ...

[An-net]

But for some reason I didn't succeed. I put the leaven on ivan tea and raisins. On the 4th day there was very little foam. And the smell was fermentative and sour. I shook her. But after 6 days it got moldy. And there is almost no foam. What I did wrong? Do you need to open it to breathe?

An-net, Anna, as the Chinese write - the presence of mold - low temperature and the beginnings of mold on the material itself or dishes. It seems to me that low temperatures are one of the factors leading to mold. And you don't need to open the jar for a long time - you shook it, opened the jar for a few seconds and closed it again. By the way, yeast can suffocate from excess carbon dioxide. I still remember this from the theory of baking bread. Yeast has no legs and cannot move. That is why - aeration is needed periodically.

True, the bread is obtained without large holes (like ordinary bread). It's probably still in the oven. Baked according to the recipe for millet. h. The children also liked the taste, but there are no holes.

baba nata, you go to my other breads. Only on the banana I have big holes. And on other types of bread, they are small - just a porous crumb. If the dough is soft and you shape it gently, the holes will be larger. Maybe you had a thicker dough and you did not stand on ceremony with it when molding. And again I repeat - there are more holes on fresh material than on dry material (this is my case).

Girls, once again about the holes. Study the question about this in the topics about Italian bread - ciabatta. How are the holes formed there? Due to the fact that the dough is liquid. If you look at my banana dough, then it is. And I also handled him very carefully during the formation. Remember, in the recipe I always write - "carefully, trying not to squeeze out the bubbles ..."? But on other types of yeast, I don't have such holes. Although I used folding there. This could have affected too. And the Chinese have such holes on almost any bread. I don't know if I would have laid out the railway recipe if I hadn't got such holes on the very first bread.
In general, we look at the thickness of the dough and shape it. carefully.

In general, I will come home from work today and will try again. I will check everything again: both the can and the material. our temperature, again 26 degrees, is not cool at all.

Luda and I have holes in the bread, different - both large and small. And I very carefully stretch and fold the dough, in no case do I press down or press on it. And everything turns out beautifully, and very tasty!
The carbon dioxide should be vented, but the lid should be kept open for a short time. And it is better to take a jar of such a volume that half remains free, no less.

[paramed1]

paramed1, VERONICA, super nice on apple!
Linadoc, beautiful Easter cake and super cut !!!!!!
I think you can not open the jar for two days, or even three ??? Veronica, I transferred the whole theory into the notes, I will study!
At the expense of mold, it was like this: I opened a jar of exotic fruits, and there one raisin on top was covered with light moss, I scooped it up with water and threw it away, it didn't grow moldy anymore. Most likely, it's the fruit that is to blame for the mold!

An-net, Anna. I added 1.5 tbsp. l. (removed the bones).

Lyudochka I am reporting !!!!! My yeast, prepared according to your recipe (remember, cabbage pickle + honey / brown sugar + dried apples / pears), allowed me to cook butter cake according to Elena Bo's recipe for Easter without using industrial yeast. At the end, the yeast resembled an amber honey mass of light honey with the aroma of fruits and honey. It turned out so incomparable that it is impossible to describe. There are no photos due to holiday worries and fatigue, as well as the rate of consumption of yummy. Everything that was not eaten on Sunday was packed in the bag of the student's eldest son. Thank you very much for the opportunity to cook delicious cakes for your family! In addition, after making the cakes, I still have residues of liquid yeast and sourdoughs 100%. And since I was not accustomed to throwing away food, I quickly cooked pumpkin puree, added an egg, cooking fat, sugar, candied fruits (I can’t reproduce the proportions anymore) and bungled a pigtail for cakes and just buns. Very tasty and beautiful! And the scent was all over the house. Thank you dear!

everything was like that with me, and it was warm, and everything was according to the recipe, and the jar was big ... I'll go put on bananas

Oksana, you can not open it until you notice changes in the bank, then release excess carbon dioxide.

I'll go put on bananas

If this continues, then the next market that will bring down HP will be a banana one.

[Tumanchik]

Tumanchik, Ira, just don't get carried away with cabbage pickle. It will not give a taste, but the fermentation process can disrupt.

Here is yesterday's bread with holes.

Tumanchik, Ira, just don't get carried away with cabbage pickle.

in what sense? what does it mean not to get carried away? I like it more than not washed banana skins. And the honey aroma is simply mesmerizing!

the fermentation process can disrupt.

specifically what process?

Specifically, the process of alcohol fermentation. Sauerkraut is a process involving lactic acid bacteria, not yeast. Therefore, the honey taste and color is not from the brine, which also contains salt, and citric and malic and oxalic acids, but from pears, honey and the rest. This means that there were more raw materials, and the sugar along with the raw materials killed the lactic acid bacteria.

This means that there were more raw materials, and the sugar along with the raw materials killed the lactic acid bacteria.

Veronica I'm sorry, but I didn't understand anything. Explain if this is good or bad. Is it good or bad? What exactly is harmful? The yeast itself? Or pickle?

If this continues, then the next market that will bring down HP will be a banana one.

We have been bringing it down for a long time - my children eat 2 kg a day

Ira, in brine on pure yeast will not breed. Fermentation is produced by lactic acid bacteria. And we remove yeast. So there is very little yeast in the brine. But if you got them with the addition of brine, then there is nothing harmful in them, just the brine does not play any role there. If only what taste. But it does not help the yeast multiply. Maybe honey gave it a taste? And the fact that bananas are unwashed - alcohol disinfects the skin, which is obtained during fermentation. And the rest will be finished by the baking temperature. Try regular apple peels, they work great.
And I have an idea in my head. After all, yeast should come from potatoes, and very quickly. Starch is also there, and alcohol is obtained from potatoes. If you grate the potatoes, pour sugar in there, pour water, I think that the active yeast will turn out very quickly, it will take a day.

But if you got them with the addition of brine, then there is nothing harmful in them, just the brine does not play any role there.

Ira, just don't get carried away with cabbage brine.

I do not understand again. the phrase was - do not get carried away. but this is not harmful. then why? yeast may fail? there was not much honey there. 50/50 with sugar.

I report
Today is my 7th day.
I do not observe any special movements in the bank.
Previously, there were small bubbles in a very small amount at the top along the perimeter, but the second day they are not.
At the bottom there is a cloudy sediment (about 2 mm), the rest is transparent.
The smell is pronounced fruity-alcoholic (made on apple and raisins).
The taste is sour, leavened, intoxicated.
Not everything is similar to the description at the beginning of the topic. I don’t understand yet what to do with this. Wait for a more obvious fermentation? Feed? Shake? Clean up in the cold? Trying to start a pre-enzyme?
Please respond if someone had a similar case

[Olga]

Olga, Ol I was very similar to your situation, I put some bread. Happened.

[paramed1]

paramed1,

And it seems to me that for rye bread - it is the most. I'm talking about cabbage pickle. In a classic sourdough (with flour and water) a tandem of wild yeast and lactic acid bacteria. The richness of the taste is amazing. And acidity for rye bread is a classic. You don't need much of it (brine, in the sense), but I think it's not bad to enrich the taste at the initial stage of production.
I got kvass on these railways generally non-acidic.))) I tried to acidify it somehow, stood in the air so that the acidity increased - nifiga!))) Carbonated, with a taste of wort, sweetish and that's it. I had to top up my mother's self-leavened (I love sourness)))).

And it seems to me that for rye bread - it is the most.

Natasha, I'm ready to shout that there was not any acidity in the kulich with liquid yeast in brine at all!

[Tumanchik]

Lyudochka I am reporting !!!!! My yeast, prepared according to your recipe (remember, cabbage pickle + honey / brown sugar + dried apples / pears), allowed me to cook butter cake according to Elena Bo's recipe for Easter without using industrial yeast. At the end, the yeast resembled an amber honey mass of light honey with the aroma of fruits and honey. It turned out so incomparable that it is impossible to describe. There are no photos due to holiday worries and fatigue, as well as the rate of consumption of yummy. Anything that was not eaten on Sunday was packed in the student's eldest son's bag. Thank you very much for the opportunity to cook delicious cakes for your family! In addition, after making the cakes, I still have residues of liquid yeast and sourdoughs 100%.And since I was not accustomed to throwing away products, I quickly made pumpkin puree, added an egg, cooking fat, sugar, candied fruit (I can’t reproduce the proportions anymore) and bungled a pigtail for cakes and just buns. Very tasty and beautiful! And the scent was all over the house. Thank you dear!

Tumanchik, your every word in the report is like a balm for the soul. I am so glad that you succeeded! And, most importantly, the fact that you liked the process, taste and aroma of the cakes.
Now try to bake bread on the railway. Everything will be easier there. And faster. You will see. Peki, Ira, healthy bread for your health. Let your family be tasty and healthy! Thank you, Tumanchik, for such a report! I read it with pleasure!
And the benefits in your railway on cabbage brine - to fig! Veronica is simply worried that the lactic acid bacteria from the cabbage brine will not defeat the alcoholic railways from apples, pears, and honey. Everything worked out great for you. Just watch further. There is no talk about harm at all! The main thing is that everything works out!

[Olga VB]

Feed? Shake? Clean up in the cold? Trying to start a pre-enzyme? Please respond if someone had a similar case

Olga VB, Olya, everything is fine! I had a similar case with raspberry yeast (if you look at my raspberry yeast, you will see). Also sediment at the bottom and a cloudy liquid. This sediment seems to be called wort. It does not do any harm, on the contrary, benefit. On it, even leaven for bread is taken out.
So, you can already put the pre-enzyme.

[Tumanchik]

Natasha, I'm ready to shout that there was not any acidity in the kulich with liquid yeast on brine at all!

Tumanchik, do not shout ... I confirm that bread with this yeast is never sour. Unless we specifically put something sour there, as I, for example, added an infusion of dried berries instead of water to raspberry bread. There was a slight sourness there.

Oh, but I'm not talking about the same! In order not to get carried away. You don't need to add a lot! If there are more lactic acid bacteria, then fermentation may either not proceed, or go very slowly. If there is a little brine, that is, with something else, then the yeast will multiply. The mechanism of fermentation and fermentation reactions is slightly different. And if the cabbage brine ferments, then you can get not what you want to get - vinegar, acetone, rotting ... Or yeast can. So I don't like experiments without a known end result, sorry, that's how I was taught. Chemistry she is such a lady, she loves precision.
Why should there be sourness? Where from? The result of the alcoholic fermentation reaction is carbon dioxide and ethanol. No acid is formed. In contrast to lactic acid fermentation, which occurs during the manufacture of lactic acid products. This is where lactic acid is formed. And as a result of fermentation, also lactic acid and others, depending on what is fermented.
Something seems to me that we need to start a separate topic, with formulas and scientific calculations ...

Here is yesterday's bread with holes.

Veronica, especially cute in the center!

Olga VB, Olya, everything is fine! I had a similar case with raspberry yeast (if you look at my raspberry yeast, you will see). Also sediment at the bottom and a cloudy liquid. This sediment seems to be called wort. It does not do any harm, on the contrary, benefit. On it, even leaven for bread is taken out.
So, you can already put the pre-enzyme.

Luda, it was the same with my Ivan-tea, the bubbles disappeared, everything fell to the bottom, there was a sediment, I intuitively decided that it was time to put the pre-enzyme, put it on, filled it up and refilled it into the jar with the railway. The pre-enzyme stood for two days without stirring, and even a dried crust formed on the surface, and mold appeared in the jar with the railway, as I wrote yesterday. In my opinion, the diagnosis of crookedness can be made safely

[Veronica]

Something seems to me that it is necessary to start a separate topic, with formulas and scientific calculations ...

Veronica, it won't hurt us to write. Just don't write terrible formulas ...

[Matilda_81]

Luda, it was the same with my Ivan-tea, the bubbles disappeared, everything fell to the bottom, there was a sediment, I intuitively decided that it was time to put the pre-enzyme, put it on, filled it up and refilled it into the jar with the railway. The pre-enzyme stood for two days without stirring, and even a dried crust formed on the surface, and mold appeared in the jar with the railway, as I wrote yesterday. In my opinion, the diagnosis of crookedness can be made safely

Matilda_81Gulya, was it cold for them? The pre-enzyme is very fond of heat! if you do not give it to him, it will easily be covered with a crust. I always lean my pre-enzyme against the wall of a warm stove. Then it grows. And if you just put it next to it, then figs will wait for him. Stove wall temperature - 28 - 29 *.

in our apartment there are batteries in the wall, the temperature in the room is about 26-28 degrees, I put them on the cabinet right in the place where the batteries pass. As already announced, today is attempt # 3. I'll drive home and try to deliver.