Sourdough in meat broth for Asian tortillas (master class)

Lenaaaa, beeeeeeaaa!
The crap didn't work out. If I hadn’t tasted the warm one at night, I wouldn’t have recognized the taste at all. In the morning they were already stale. Maybe this is due to the fact that they were dry in the oven, I saved them a little! Maybe the leaven isn't ready yet. Something she has been sitting in my place since then, does not rock the boat.
In short, you need convulsion consultation.

Natul, you overdried them specifically. Well, you have an oven! I generally baked in the Princess.
Something is wrong with the leaven. Why didn't you add the katyk right away? In the same place, lactic acid bacteria should work. And you added them before baking. They did not have time to work. Shorter. feed the leaven.

I smelled the leaven ... Rare muck
Vanya infection, does not grow, rare former bubbles on the surface with craters zyayut

I smelled the leaven ... Rare muck

Fuuu. She shouldn't stink. What broth did you use?

Strong beef.
I read about the same sourdough that you can add katyk after the start of yeast fermentation, so, they say, the sourdough will not peroxide from sour milk.
Looks like they didn't have time to breed ...
We must go again to add katyk and onions, and I'll mold the broth. What do you think?

I don’t know what your leaven smells like. Maybe on a new charge?

She swirls about something putrid. I had this a couple of times with the eternal at the stage of its cultivation. Then the ICD bred, defeated the "rotten", and life improved, - it smelled like an apple.
It seems that this broth ICD of my katyk was not enough, and the growth of some pathogen was provoked

Added Thursday, January 26, 2017 11:22 PM

I just don't know whether to treat this one or put a new one ...

new

mlaaaaaa

Truncated understood, chief!

Dear girls, save, help, please put the leaven for the second time. Does not work!!! The first time I put on chicken broth + snowball (sour milk) there was nothing else at that moment, but I tried the horror as I wanted + onion + flour. Didn't grow. I waited a day. Brought to bread by adding yeast. I put on a new one: pork broth + onion + sour cream + flour. A day has passed - it does not grow. It smelled good both times. There are rare bubbles on the surface. The first time I put it on a battery in a multi-pot. The battery is not boiling water. The very thing, it seemed. Now I turned on the warm floor in the bathroom, put it on it. In a plastic container for better visibility. Wrapped up. What to do then ??? I really want to learn ...

Added Wednesday 01 Feb 2017 07:50

Help !!! What should I do with the leaven? Throw out ??

[Irina]

Irina, do not need to be thrown away. From my experience I know that the whole point is in sour milk, or rather, in its weakness or the absence of the necessary bacteria. I made sourdough on my katyk. Did it for 5 days. Previously, he did not want to work out. Please see how to make katyk in the cake recipe (in the Recipe Notes) or in Zachariah.
I think that your leaven is weak precisely because of the katyk, or rather, its absence ...
I quote my text from the recipe:

Preparation of a sourdough katyk.
For, for the leaven to become strong, it is not enough to take any fermented milk product... The real sourdough for Asian flatbread is made on katyk. Katyk is a fermented milk product obtained by fermenting one stripped off to 2/3 of the volume of milk (not baked!). In the absence of a real katyk for fermentation, I added old homemade yogurt and loose sour cream in equal proportions (1 tsp) to the evaporated milk (100 ml). Experts recommend keeping fermented milk at a temperature of 28 - 30 * C for 3 days to obtain an authentic product.Since I needed katyk not for consumption, but for sourdough, I cooked it for 5 days.
More details: https://Mcooker-enn.tomathouse.com/in...on=com_smf&topic=419244.0

And here you can see how Zakhary made katyk:

Katyk and Kaymak (Zachary)

Added Wednesday 01 Feb 2017 10:58 am

Help !!! What should I do with the leaven? Throw out ??

I would now put what you have done in the cold, or maybe in the freezer. When the katyk is ready, add it and continue making the sourdough as written in the recipe.

[Ludmila]

Ludmila, thank you very much!!!!!!! And then I put nothing for the second time ((I first read this whole topic and the one in which you bake cakes from sourdough. So, someone wrote in the comments, I don't remember who, that added sour cream and everything worked out .. Apparently, I won't be able to take the "easy" path)) I'll go then read about the kaymak first ... I'll try to do it. I really want everything to work out for me. And if you put under-leaven)) just in the refrigerator, nothing will happen to it in 7 days ??

[Irina]

And if you put under-leaven)) just in the refrigerator, nothing will happen to it in 7 days ??

I'm afraid the broth can go bad in 7 days.

So, someone wrote in the comments, I don't remember who, that he added sour cream and everything worked out ...

Irina, sour cream sour cream strife. Even my old sour cream and yoghurt didn't want to make sourdough just like that. For 5 days, the katyk did not become sour.
In general, read Zechariah. He has the same principle as me, but he writes in great detail how to make a katyk.
Good luck, Irina!

Apparently, I won't be able to take the "easy" path))

It won't work ... Katyk needs a strong one ...
Irina, katyk, not kaymak. These are two different things.

[Ludmila]

Ludmila, of course katyk)) I have already read the recipe. So. Another headache was added)) where to evaporate milk ... I'll try it in a cartoon on heating. Thanks for the consultation again

[Irina]

Another headache added)) where to evaporate milk ...

Irina, oh, it evaporates so quickly. I evaporated on an ordinary stove. Or on the stove. But cartoon is the best option. the main thing is not to torment, but to let it boil. Stewed will not work. You will get baked milk, but you need evaporated milk.

I will try! )) and another question. And the broth for this leaven should be fatty? or vice versa?)

[Irina]

Irina, what turns out, on this and do. This is usually pork.

I've already baked it several times. Thanks to Kubanochka for a detailed master class. The truth is, I bake on an upside-down pan on the last shelf. It turns out pale, but the taste is more authentic, sometimes I turn it over like a pancake for a minute to make it more beautiful

Girls, for God's sake, forgive me, but did not master the whole topic. Perhaps it slipped here ... Has anyone tried to bake bread in a bread maker with such a leaven? Is there any recipe with proportions?
No - cakes are sacred! In the courtyard there is a warmed Slavic tandoor waiting for its finest hour. But for now, I would like to try this yummy without much dancing with a tambourine - it seems like I threw this leaven into the HP, filled up flour, salt, fat / butter, and forth ...

[Constantin]

Constantin, I don't remember anyone baking these cakes in HP. But I think it's real. You just have to recalculate the proportions for your HP. And, of course, manually control the process, watching the rise of the dough. You can do everything in HP, and before baking, turn it off and wait for the workpiece to rise to its usual size before baking. Its rise with a young leaven will take longer. But after a few dressings, the leaven becomes very strong and the process will go quickly.
The recalculation can be done by focusing on the proportions on the first page of this topic or in the recipe for the cakes themselves:

Asian cakes with sourdough on meat broth, onion and katyk (lappl1)

[lappl1]

lappl1, Thank you! The proportions are already outlined:
Sourdough in meat broth 200 gr.
Wheat flour 300 gr.
Water (warm) 150 ml.
Salt 1 tsp
Fat (fat tail or any) 30 gr.
You don't need to recount anything - my Panasonic can handle such a volume. Probably you can try it completely automatically, but control the rise ...

[Kapet]

Kapet, Constantin, I also have Panasonic. But for some reason bread for 400 gr. turns out a little worse than 500 gr. You, of course, try the 300 gr., As in the recipe. If anything, then increase it by 50%. I would immediately try for 450 grams. flour.

Probably you can try it completely automatically, but control the rise ...

Yes, do everything on the machine (in the cake recipe you can see how I kneaded everything in HP), and before baking, check how the dough rose. If anything, just turn it off and wait for a normal rise. After 4 - 5 dressings, the dough was already rising rapidly. In the beginning, while the leaven was young, the process took longer. Therefore, focus on your leaven, that is, its strength.

[lappl1]

lappl1, very grateful! So I wanted cakes or bread from a carefree Tashkent childhood!

[Constantin]

Constantin, to your health! Try it! I think you will succeed! Good luck!

[lappl1]

lappl1,

Added on Thursday, 16 March 2017 16:59

Shl. It might be worth trying in the baking mode of French bread. There the rise of the dough is about 4 hours ...

Yes, she does not smell. Wool was used for reinforcement. The clay itself is pretty fragile.

Nope! Sorry for your 5 kopecks offtopic, but all the wool burns out in the walls of the tandoor for the first times of kindling, and no reinforcement remains. But then there are small cavities in the walls of the tandoor, filled with air, which helps to retain heat in it.

[Constantin]

It might be worth trying in the baking mode of French bread. There the rise of the dough is about 4 hours ...

Constantin, Sorry, for some reason, notifications from the topic did not come.
Maybe it will work in "French". But it will not be superfluous to control the process at the stage of lifting the workpiece.

In some ways, this leaven reminds me of "eternal bread" from the science fiction novel of the same name by Alexander Belyaev:

The main action of the novel takes place in late autumn in a German fishing village on the Fair island of the Friedland northern islands (apparently, the North Frisian) in the German Sea.

Biochemist professor Breuer, who left the University of Berlin to continue his research, lives near a small fishing village, hoping to make people happy with his discovery. He developed a culture of "simplest" organisms, which grows without requiring care, and is a hearty and tasty "dough". To test the safety of his discovery, he hands over a pot of "eternal bread" to poor old Hans with the condition to keep a secret. However, the secret becomes known to the villagers. The professor's promise to give the fishing families free "eternal bread" after the end of the test does not satisfy them and they secretly buy it from Hans, who shamelessly profits from this. Gradually, the professor's discovery becomes known in Berlin and gets out of his control, spreading with incredible speed, despite the professor's admonitions that he has not yet studied the "simplest" organisms in the culture he developed. Businessmen discover the secret of "eternal bread" and begin to produce it for sale against the wishes of the professor. However, spring and summer come and it turns out that the growth rate of the culture is much faster. She quickly fills the houses of residents, and then the land around and even the ocean. People are dying, a worldwide catastrophe is impending. The professors are arrested in an attempt to blame him for what happened. Already in the prison laboratory, he manages to remove the "fungus", which is able to quickly destroy the "eternal bread".

That is, you that ... this ... - do not overfeed the leaven. So that then something bad does not happen to the planet ...

[Constantin]

Constantin, exactly ... I remembered the novel with pleasure.
So it is, this leaven is eternal ... In any case, as in the novel, it grew stronger and stronger with me day by day ... And nothing happened to it. Only the onion-broth aroma disappeared. Then I made a new broth and the aroma came back.
But the yeast-killing fungus didn't have to be invented. She just baked bread on her before moving and her life ended.
And I haven't started it in a new place yet. Why start if we have an Uzbek tandoor shop not far from the village, where delicious authentic cakes are baked?
So I don't have this leaven yet. But I will take a warning for every fireman ...
Thank you, Konstantin, for an interesting comparison!

Why start if we have an Uzbek tandoor shop not far from the village, where delicious authentic cakes are baked?

Swallowing my saliva, I express my deepest gratitude for your research in the field of flat cake production! Your, with the author of the topic, recipes in the history of baking will definitely not get lost! Thank you very much!

[Constantin]

Constantin, to your health! I am very glad if I could be useful to you!

So, accept my thanks - the leaven is ready!

Never worked with leaven before. But then the desire to taste the cakes overcame laziness and fear.
I took one and a half small onions, chopped them in a Bamix chopper until puree.
There was broth on lamb brisket. Not very thick - meant for bean soup - but full enough.
There was German spelled flour, as well as purchased expensive bio-fermented baked milk, and Armenian yogurt "Matsun".

But where are we going to ferment all this, at 28 degrees? The first thought is on the battery. But we have a cat with a cat and two dogs at home. That is, the hope that the leaven will survive on the battery until the morning is very ghostly ... And here the craftsmen from the Mcooker-enn.tomathouse.com forum come to the rescue, in particular the idea from the topic "Warm" rise of the test in the Panasonic SD-2501 service mode.

I put everything in a standard glass liter jar, according to the author's recipe. At the very beginning I used only fermented baked milk. I put the jar in the bread maker, first in the bucket. Turned on the test heating mode on the bread maker, and forward.

Three hours later, a gurgle appeared, after another three - two. I subconsciously understand that something went wrong. Suspicion fell on the fermented baked milk. Added two Art. spoons of matsuna, mixed everything well. Things went more fun, but still not like decent people.

Mine went to think a lot ... I took the bucket out of the bread machine, and put the can directly on the twisting mechanism, - the can stood up confidently. It was late in the evening, and I went to the side. At two o'clock in the morning, without much hope, I went out on reconnaissance. I opened the bread maker, and there ... The leaven bubbled to the limit. A small part of the sourdough escaped to the bottom of the bread machine, - he rubbed it at night, in hot pursuit, until it dried to death ... In the photo below, all traces of the escape have already been eliminated, and the can with sourdough has already been removed from the refrigerator ...

In general, the first pancake came out, as it seemed to me, not lumpy at all. A jar of sourdough is in the fridge, waiting for me to take the next step. The time turned out to be about 28 hours, taking into account my mistakes. The sourdough smell is normal. The saturation of the onion and bouillon odor has become less intense than it was initially.





I don’t know what will come of it all, but in any case, many thanks to the author and the collective thought in this topic!

[Constantin]

Constantin, this is the report! So detailed, thorough and humorous! I read it with pleasure and was very happy for the result! Thank you for trying to make the starter culture in HP. My Panasonic is older and there is no such functionality in it. And I would definitely have adopted it. Well, other bakers will need your experience!

In general, the first pancake came out, as it seemed to me, not lumpy at all.

Not lumpy at all! The sourdough looks great! My dear is ready!

A jar of sourdough is in the fridge, waiting for me to take the next step.

It's time, it's time, make up your mind! And although the leaven is very active, I do not think that the dough preparation process will be rapid. I would try to do it for every firefighter in a spicy way. It will always be possible to control.

The saturation of the onion and bouillon aromas became less intense.

Yes, yes ... it is. The bacteria have worked and ate the vigor. It should be so. But in bread, the aroma and taste will be guessed.

Constantin, I'm waiting for when you decide to bake bread. Moreover, with impatience!
Thank you very much for your report!

[lappl1]

lappl1, thanks for the support! I will definitely try. Much depends on experience, which does not exist, but also on the straightness of the hands. An attempt is not torture, and the road will be mastered by the one walking!

[Constantin]

Much depends on experience, which does not exist, but also on the straightness of the hands. An attempt is not torture, and the road will be mastered by the one walking!

Constantin, nothing, you start, and if you have any questions, we will always help! Good luck!

[lappl1]

lappl1,

There is no sour milk at home, because it is not bought, and my own sourdough is not made, but there is 3 liters of farm milk, I poured it into a glass - it will ferment into a natural product overnight, tomorrow I will put the leaven, the mood is decisive)))

[katko]

katko, Katyushka, I think: what kind of dances are songs with tambourines heard? And then it turns out Katyuha hamsters cakes
Probably delicious?))))) Clever girl!

[Tatka1]

Tatka1, awesome !!)

I started experimenting with this leaven again)
the third feeding of the sourdough, broth and again rubbed the onion, fed it in two stages, there were a couple of spoons left from the previous one, first 35 g of water and flour each, then 100 broth and flour each and an onion
is growing

chekich bombed a real one for 190 re, the current drawing is not flowers, but I will order it too

[Katyusha]

chekich bombed the real

Katyusha, prick where you bombed?

[kubanochka]

kubanochka, tama already no, even I didn't get a flower



simaland

[Lena]

Lena, kubanochka,

Thanks for the recipe and the science! I carefully and more than once read this topic, took everything into account and set the leaven. It worked on the first try.
I had "Tashkent" in the oven on a stone. In the evening, I put the leaven, and by lunchtime I was kneading the dough into flat cakes. It turned out very tasty. True, it takes a long time to bake one cake in the oven, but it's worth it.

Oh, I haven’t baked bread in meat broth yet, but I have this good, like shoe polish. We must try.
My relatives once moved here from Uzbekistan, so they always made sour dough with sour milk, and not with yeast. I remember that this, at first, was very surprised, I didn’t know another, yeast-free life.

[kubanochka, Helen]

kubanochka, Helen, thanks for the recipe for sourdough and tortillas

The sourdough was prepared in Moulinex RZ7101 La Fournee plant. Heating 32 °:


Dough:



Sourdough after feeding:

The first version is much richer
The second version is more neutral than the first. Only a slight smell and taste of onions remains. But the cakes are also delicious.
On prescription:
Asian cakes with sourdough on meat broth, onion and katyk
https://Mcooker-enn.tomathouse.com/in...om_smf&topic=419244.0

Is it cooked in the oven? Not in the tandoor? I always admire the ability to cook such cakes and how chebureks are prepared))

[Elena Tim]

Is it cooked in the oven?

Prepared if there is no tandoor. And in Princesk:
https://Mcooker-enn.tomathouse.com/in...348.0
Quote Elena Tim in the subject: "Pizza makers Princess 115000, Travola SW302T, Fagor MG-300":
"Citizens, this is not a pizza, this is some SHAYTAN-TANDYR, I swear, on my word!
No, you just look at what kind of cakes our Princess-opa baked for me! "