The simplest hop starter

Towels let the air through - so the dough has dried up. Covering tightly near the battery - you also need to adapt, since humidity and T can affect.

And then what to do? Maybe then start a dough thinner, do not have time to dry out?

[Lagri]

Lagri, cover with cling film or wet with a towel (and make sure it doesn't dry out)

[Ligra]

Ligra, I will try everything: what will help, so I will do. Thanks everyone for the advice.
marika33, Marina, and my leaven, indeed, has ceased to constantly rise in the refrigerator. She herself has fallen and stands calm. And today I again baked another sourdough bread without any problems. I am very happy, not happy. Bread always turns out

Maybe then start a dough thinner, do not have time to dry out?

cover with cling film or a wet towel

It will be more correct.

[Sergei]

Sergei, thanks, we will try.

[Sergei]

Sergei, welcome back! I remember you and already thought that you abandoned experiments in baking. Well done, you bake bread. Thanks for the photo!
Sergey, the dough can be covered with a lid, it will not be bad for her. I always close the pan with a lid, there is condensation on it, but this is not dough, but dough. Cover the dough for proofing with a napkin or towel.
Light, like everything is observed, only I would add more honey to the dough. You can not put it in the dough. Starter starvation is possible due to lack of sweet. And as a consequence of this, there is no rise.
Maria I'm glad for you that everything is back to normal!

[marika33]

marika33, thanks for the advice!
I decided to experiment again ...
I took out the sourdough from the refrigerator - dissolved 1 tsp of sugar in warm water (50 g), took 2 tablespoons of starter and 25 g of flour. I left it all to look until the morning, in the morning I'll see how my ward behaves ... put it in a room where + 28 + 29 * C

Comrades and gentlemen! Advise me what to do with her in the morning, if successful, so that she does not stand still and wait for me, I will be back around 15 o'clock. Put a dough? Or knead the dough? What and how much to add in this case?
I just doubt how married for the first time ..))))

Advise me what to do with her in the morning, if successful, so that she does not stand still and wait for me, I will be back around 15 o'clock. Put the dough? Or knead the dough? What and how much to add in this case?

This is clearly not enough for kneading dough.
But for the dough, the very thing, start the dough on all this leaven, which will be active by morning.

I did not have time to capture the initial stage of making the dough and the initial process, but in the continuation the following photo arguments.

Kolobok kneading


Forming and proofing


After 2 hours of proofing.


Free-form cuts.


Steam baked goods.



I bake this recipe about 10 times, and each time there are some exceptions and discrepancies, both in time and in the number of ingredients. I play both in time and in the weight of flour in the dough, I want to bring out the original author's. (2 kg. Bun is not the limit, we go to the highest weight as the oven will allow.

But in each of the cases, you still get a very tasty and pleasing not only the eye - worthy bread.

[Light]

Light,

I took out the sourdough from the refrigerator - dissolved 1 tsp of sugar in warm water (50g), took 2 tablespoons of starter and 25 g of flour. I left it all to look until the morning, in the morning I'll see how my ward behaves ... put it in a room where + 28 + 29 * C

explain what you want to get? Is it like a leaven or dough? If dough, then very little liquid. If a new leaven, then why? you have hop leaven.
Valery, good bun!

[Valery]

Valery, for some reason, I only had one photo at first, with a kolobok.
Thank you for the master class! You have very beautiful bread!
Valera, I always knead the dough on the "eye", always add something: different bran or additional oatmeal or buckwheat flour.
Sometimes I don't add anything like that. The bread always tastes different, there is never the same bread, but it always turns out delicious, airy, fluffy.

, I would like to display the original author's. (2 kg. roll is not the limit, we go to the highest weight as far as the oven will allow.

aha, we are waiting for the record weight of bread from you! As they say in such cases: good hour!

I always cover the dough with cellophane film taken from the bags that I bought under the trash. And I also squeeze with an elastic band so that the air does not pass. From above in cellophane with a toothpick I make 4 holes for air so that the oppa can breathe. It has never happened that the oppa has dried up even a little, on the contrary, when you remove the cellophane film, the film is all wet from the inside.

[wasabi]

wasabi, yes, yes, quite right! Only you better take cling film, nevertheless, droplets can fall from it into the dough.

Thank you all for your advice, I will try, otherwise I completely relaxed with this electronics. And I have a thermometer and even an electronic one, such as a pistol - you point at an object and the temperature displays on the display, or are there any better (?) So it shows the temperature unevenly, much less at the top. Gas. the stove has only positions 1-8, and the heating temperature at each position is not indicated, as on an electric oven. And what is more depressing is that there is no light in the oven, like in electric, to watch the process you need to open the door.

Hello colleagues!

I caught some kind of influenza virus and for several days only ate tea with milk and honey
With the accompanying consequences in the form of poor thinking and other bullshit
And he suspended all his bakery research experiments.
Wait like oklemyvayus and continue.

with a wet towel (and make sure it doesn't dry out)

I don't know how in baking, but for flowers (when there is no way to regularly water the ground, and the flower must be left for a reasonable long time autonomously and not dried), they did this: one end of a damp cloth into a pot of earth, the other into a bowl of water. The rag gets wet and slowly wets the soil in the pot.
Here you can do the same - so as not to track whether the towel is dry or not: pre-moisten the towel, place the edges of the towel in a container (s) with water, and pull the middle of the towel over the pan with the dough dough. The main thing is to pull it correctly so that the towel does not sag in the saucepan - otherwise water may drip from the towel at the minimum point of sagging.

Well, it's easier, it seems to me, to use cling film.

explain what you want to get? Is it like a leaven or dough? If dough, then very little liquid. If a new leaven, then why? you have hop leaven.

Good day!
I just decided to check in what state its viability)))
In the early morning, the leaven was quite lively with active bubbles - in general, so the warming stage passed! I mixed flour with sweet water and left for work, returned - to immediately check how she was?
Just a beauty! With the previous kneading of dough, the result was much worse, therefore, I hope, the bread will be successful this time too ...
Here is a portrait of today's dough. Well, isn't she a beauty?

[Ilya]

Ilya, Recover!

In order not to get sick, you need to strengthen your immunity by pouring cold water over yourself. Helps a lot!

Thanks for the advice, but I also think that it is much more convenient to cover with a film or a lid than to bother with wet towels.

Light, the dough is wonderful! We are waiting for the end of your experiment! Good luck!

Well! And I waited! One could, of course, have a more spacious apartment for him ... Not to say that he was handsome - the cuts did not work out, everything clung to the knife, but in general it was very good!
It seemed to me that I gave him a little distance - I was in a hurry! I was in a hurry! It's time to sleep, but I want to see)))
Judging by the holes, even on the crust, it will be spongy! Cut and taste - tomorrow!
For now, here's just this:

[Light]

LightThe experiment was a success, great! Very good!
I don’t think there was little time for proofing, everything is great! If there was not enough time to climb, the roof would have been blown off. And she is there, beautiful. Congratulations, very happy! And then I also get upset when it doesn't work out.

the cuts failed, everything clung to the knife,

Lubricate the knife with rast. oil will not cling.

Congratulations, very happy! And then I also get upset when it doesn't work out.

Thanks for the support!
and you - do not be upset! You yourself know that a complex of factors influences! So I changed the flour, and changed the temperature of the proofing (room), and reduced the flour a little! I will still try to make thinner dough ...

Lubricate the knife with rast. oil will not cling.

Duc lubricated - the result is obvious))) It is necessary to change the knife! Rather, buy a razor)))

Thank you all for your support!

We need to change the knife! Rather, buy a razor)))

The blade, put on a large skewer, cuts without problems.

[wasabi]

wasabi, missed the question, sorry! I wait for the dough to rise 2-1.5 times and put it in a cold oven, turn it on in the middle (I have a gas oven) when the thermometer shows 180, turn down the gas. Have Admin modes are described better, sometimes I subtract 150, depending on how the crust turns brown! Light, very beautiful bread !!!!

I tried to make this leaven - there were very few bubbles. Apparently, not warm enough or something else. Today I added half a spoonful of yeast - maybe at least it will turn out that way.
But how to calculate - how much starter culture to take for the test?

Hello,

matured to formulate questions on baking sourdough bread.

I tried to do it in two ways (as a result, 4 loaves: 1 not clear, 3 good):
1. Using dough, which is placed "... in a warm place (preferably at night) ...".
2. When all the ingredients are put into the bread maker at once and the dough is made.

In this letter I will ask questions (and I will write what I did and what happened) using the dough method, in another letter - the second method, when everything is in the "bucket"

For some reason, the technology with dough didn't work out for me
The dough seems to have gone (I didn't realize it). But for some reason the dough mixed in HP did not rise for a long time.

What I put in the dough:
- starter culture 1.5 tbsp. l.,
- water - 270 ml.,
- BC flour - 120 gr,
- sugar - 2 tsp.
Stirred to the state of "no lumps", put it overnight. It stood for a long time, from 10 to 12 hours, perhaps it stopped?
I took the sourdough at the rate of 1 tbsp. l. for 200 ml. water (in the basic recipe - 1 liter of water and 5 tablespoons of sourdough)

dough:
- sugar - 1 tsp.,
- salt - 1 tsp,
- flour (BC + buckwheat) - 320 gr,
- water (in addition to the one in the dough) - 30 ml.,
- sunflower oil - 1 tbsp. l.
Total water: 300 ml, flour: 440 gr.
Water to flour ratio: 0.68 ml / g = 300 ml / 400 g.

I made a mistake with sugar, in the basic recipe you need 1 tbsp. l., but I did not realize that 1 tbsp. l = 2 tsp.
When I started making the dough, I looked at how many teaspoons are in the dining room ... I saw that I had put the norm according to the recipe in the dough, but do you also need sugar in the dough? so I put 1 tsp in the dough.
Therefore, 2/3 of sugar is in the dough, 1/3 of sugar is in the dough.

The dough rose slowly.

Bread maker operating mode:
- quick kneading 4 min, basic kneading 22 min,
- rise temperature (proofing) - 32^aboutFROM,
- lifting 40 minutes, kneading 10 seconds, lifting 25 minutes, kneading 15 seconds,
- rise 7 hours 20 min (440 min = 50 + 90 + 90 + 90 + 120).

As a result, the dough lay in a bucket and did not rise well (it feels like when baking the dough suddenly "woke up" and decided to rise - but no, it's too late to rush about).
Maybe I should have waited further, but I started baking.
As a result, the taste of the bread was sour (if you sniff, burying your nose in a fresh cut, then there seemed to be a sour smell).

Below is a photo of what happened after baking the bread (in the photo of the boxes - this is not an advertisement, but a "measuring" ruler).

Photo from all sides (fired with a phone, for some reason, sometimes he depicts a "noble beautiful" crust with a black burnt biscuit):


Photo of bread in a cut and a little on top:


Accordingly, the question is, what was not done correctly, why did it not work?

Well with a proofing temperature of 32^aboutC maybe a lot (I realized this later), but at this temperature other breads rose

Thanks for answers).

[il-ir]

il-ir, if you take 300 ml of water and 440 g of flour, then for the dough you need to take all the water 300 ml and 220 g of flour.When kneading dough from dough, water is no longer added. For other modes, someone else can respond. And the dough is likely to stand if the bread is sour.

[Ligra]

Ligra, I originally took all the water for the dough according to the recipe. But when I began to transfer the dough from the saucepan to the HP bucket, I realized that it is easier to add a little water and rinse the saucepan out of the dough than to scrape the remaining dough with a spoon. Therefore, I wrote that I added 30 ml of water to the dough.

And another question.
You wrote that you should put 50% flour on the dough.

And in the basic instructions, flour in a dough is about 1/3. From this I started:

for dough
...
rye flour 2.5 - 3 cups
...
Add in the morning:
...
ZH flour - 3.5 cups
flour sun 1.5 cups.
...

total:
7,5 = 2,5 + 3,5 + 1,5
8 = 3 + 3,5 + 1,5

0,3333% = 2,5 / 7,5 = 1/3
0,375% = 3 / 8

Therefore, the question is - is it significant if you put not 50% of the flour from the recipe into the dough, but 30%?

[il-ir]

il-ir, you had to scrape off with flour, you break the kneading process.

[Ligra]

I had to scrape off with flour

Who knew

Now I'm smart

Can this breach of technology result in poor dough rise?

Ligra, I added a question about the amount of flour in the dough a little higher in my answer, see, please.

[Hope]

Hopehow much dough did you have? It is necessary to keep it warm for at least 1.5 - 2 days.
Should it be active with yeast, is it pressed or dry?
First, try to bake a small loaf, in 300 ml of water, take 2-3 tablespoons of sourdough. To then convert to hop, prepare fresh hop broth, add rye flour, honey and heat. When ripe, refrigerate.
Ilya, I'm sorry, I'll answer a little later, while I'm busy.
Ligra, thanks for the help!

[il-ir]

il-ir, traditionally, half of the flour and all the liquid are added to the dough, and all the other additives are added when the dough rises and it is time to knead the dough. A good brew (if yeast) resembles a bubbly sourdough. For her part, sugar and salt were added to the dough (leavening and yeast) for better dissolution (although not recommended).

[Ilya]

Ilya, look here here sourdough bread recipe from Mistletoe, more here and more... Ksenia has everything calculated to the gram. I don’t bake bread in a bread maker, and basically I take everything approximately. When I start to measure and hang, everything turns out worse for me.
How did you answer Ligra,, all the liquid is taken into the dough and no water is added when kneading the dough.
There is a lot of time for dough at 12 o'clock, so your bread is sour, if you don't like it, then put it on for a shorter time.
For proofing 32 degrees is also a lot, try 28-30.
From the photo: the bread has no lift, so the roof was blown off. And there was no rise, because there was not enough sugar and the temperature was high. some part of the yeast could die at this temperature.

Therefore, the question is - is it significant if you put not 50% of the flour from the recipe into the dough, but 30%?

here the amount of flour in the dough is not at all important. You can then align everything when kneading. the main thing is to have a normal bun.
If something is not clear explained, ask. We'll figure out. Success!

[Marina]

There is a lot of time for dough at 12 o'clock, so your bread is sour, if you don't like this, then put on a shorter time

Marina, and how long does it take for dough on average?

[Maria]

Maria, I usually put it overnight, at 10-11, and in the morning I knead the dough at 7-8. Dough is worth 9-10 hours, respectively. Sometimes I put dough in the morning, then it turns out it costs 6-7 hours, fresh bread is baked for dinner. I don't see the difference.
I say many times about hop sourdough, that it is not capricious, it works flawlessly!

and how long does it take for dough on average?

Doughs with sourdough ferment 6-10 hours at 28-30C, until the dough triples in volume (for 100% rye dough - until it doubles). At this point, the sourdough dough is considered ripe and is used to ferment the dough.

At a temperature of 25C, the dough is fermented from 10 to 12 hours. with the ratio of all the liquid in the dough and 50% of the flour from the total recipe.

I tried to do it in two ways (as a result, 4 loaves: 1 not clear, 3 good):
one.Using dough, which is placed "... in a warm place (preferably at night) ...".
2. When all the ingredients are put into the bread maker at once and the dough is made.

Here I will probably rejoice at the three successful results, in my opinion, and ask for advice and criticism.
These three breads were baked when everything was immediately put into the bread machine's bucket (that is, according to the second of the options listed above).

Therefore, I will voice a request to colleagues, to the masters in advance: since I do not understand very well how it should be (for me, if it is tasty, then it is enough), then I can skip some essential points - please focus on my attention on such "not small things".

I am especially interested in whether I correctly caught the moment when it is necessary to stop the proofing (for the second and third options below, in the first option I seem to have missed this moment).
I do not understand why my bread is flat, but the pictures given earlier in this thread show bread with a "high" roof. Can the small size of the bread (when the shape, that is, the HP bucket, is larger than the area required) affect the fact that the bread is flat?
I sincerely envy with white envy - I want to learn the same

for example, to get a roof of bread like this:

Steam baked goods.

or like this:

For now, here's just this:

Unlike the dough with dough, in which I put 1.5 tbsp. spoons of leaven, in these breads I used 2 tbsp. spoons, taking into account the fact that water is only 270 ml.

In the photo, the boxes are used as a "measuring" ruler.
My very first sourdough bread (the version with dough discussed earlier is the second sourdough pastry), in my opinion, has stood still That is, the dough has stopped, I started to bake late
It affected the sunken roof, but not the taste.
The water-flour ratio, which can also affect the roof, seems to me to be normal (I check the bun with every dough).

This is exactly about this bread I wrote earlier:

About my first sourdough bread after not even tasting it, but eating it, I confirm:

it turned out delicious

Technical details:

dough:
- ferments - 2 tbsp. l.,
- water - 270 ml,
- sunflower oil - 1 tbsp. l.
- flour (BC + buckwheat) - 400 g,
- sugar - 1 tbsp. l.,
- salt - 1 tsp.

Rise temperature 32^aboutFROM.
Dough rise time 4 hours 10 minutes.

The weight of the finished bread is 587 grams.

Photos from all sides:


Photo of bread in a cut and a little on top:

The next bread in which I took into account the rise time of the previous one and reduced it for this baking.
Technical details:

dough:
- ferments - 2 tbsp. l.,
- water - 270 ml,
- sunflower oil - 1 tbsp. l.
- flour (BC + buckwheat) - 400 g,
- sugar - 1 tbsp. l.,
- salt - 1 tsp,
- cinnamon - 1/2 tsp.

Rise temperature 32^aboutFROM.
Dough rising time 3 hours 40 minutes (i.e. 30 minutes less than first bread).

The weight of the finished bread is 595 grams.

Photos from all sides:


Photo of bread in a cut and a little on top:

To do this, I did the bread a little differently: I made an analogue of the dough (or is this dough?), Only the dough rose for only 1.5 hours. And put all the sugar in this conditional dough.
In other words, I first conditionally "multiplied" the yeast, and then added the remains of flour, oil, salt.

Technical details:

For this bread, the lifting mode changed - by reducing the temperature from 32^aboutС (standard installation in HP) up to 27^aboutC (less in HP simply cannot be installed).

I put it in a conditional dough (I put the ingredients in a bucket of a bread machine and put it in a bread machine):
- ferments 2 tbsp. l.,
- water - 270 ml.,
- BC flour - 120 gr,
- sugar - 1 tbsp. l.
Stirred as best he could to the state of "no lumps", but could not eliminate all the small lumps, and to be honest did not try. He assumed that all the lumps of unmixed flour would be stirred during the main batch.

Rise temperature 27^aboutFROM.
The rise time of the "dough" is 1 hour 30 minutes.

During this time, the dough has become, it seems, a little more in volume, but it is certainly homogeneous (that is, the unmixed lumps themselves stirred and dissolved).

Dough (reported to what has already "nested" in the bucket):
- sunflower oil - 1 tbsp. l.
- flour (BC + buckwheat) - 280 g,
- salt - 1 tsp.

I put 400 g of flour = 120 + 280.

Rise temperature 27^aboutFROM.
Dough rise time 4 hours 45 minutes.

As far as I understand, the rise time increased compared to previous baked goods, as I reduced the temperature at which the dough was proofed: set 27^aboutC instead of 32^aboutFROM.

Photos from all sides:


Photo of bread in a cut and a little on top:

Thanks for answers).

[Maria]

Maria, I usually put it overnight, at 10-11, and in the morning I knead the dough at 7-8. Dough is worth 9-10 hours, respectively. Sometimes I put dough in the morning, then it turns out it costs 6-7 hours, fresh bread is baked for dinner. I don't see the difference.
I say many times about hop sourdough, that it is not capricious, it works flawlessly!

Marina, thanks, understood. I have already made good friends with my leaven, and the bread on it is one better than the other. The yeast is now resting.

[Hope]

Hopehow much dough did you have? It is necessary to keep it warm for at least 1.5 - 2 days.
Should it be active with yeast, is it pressed or dry?
First, try to bake a small loaf, in 300 ml of water, take 2-3 tablespoons of sourdough. To convert then into hop, prepare a fresh decoction of hops, add rye flour, honey and heat. When ripe, refrigerate.

The leaven stood for 3 days. On the second day I added honey and flour, but it was very sluggish. Here is a photo after adding Saf-Moment dry yeast

Can the small size of the bread (when the shape, that is, the HP bucket, is larger than the area required) affect the fact that the bread is flat?

Yes maybe. It is recommended to take a mold for the dough so that it rises up and does not blur.

I sincerely envy white envy - I want to learn the same

If there is a desire, then everything will work out!

Dough rise time 4 hours 10 minutes.

This is a lot. Of course, the dough stopped and therefore the "roof" fell.

made an analogue of the dough (or is it a dough?), only the dough rose for only 1.5 hours.

this is very little for dough

And put all the sugar in this conditional dough.

Sugar could not have been added to the dough, but it was necessary to add it to the dough. Therefore, there is no rise or it is very long.
Ilya, but in general, the bread is not bad. the roof has collapsed, but this is fixable, you don't need to overexpose the dough. And for such a form, take a larger volume of water so that the loaf is full. Or take another form for bread.
Look at the links that I gave.

[Maria]

Maria, very happy about you!
Hope, it means that you have not quite fresh hops. Try to buy elsewhere and add fresh broth.
The girls added yeast to the hop sourdough, put the dough, but the dough took a very long time to rise.

Bread - Darnitsky - according to GOST. on hop sourdough.

[Valery]

Valery, very nice bread! Thank you for the photo, for sharing your successes in baking with us!

[Marina]

Marina, I also want to show a photo of bread made in 6.5 hours on hop sourdough. I am so glad that everything started to work out well. Basically, I bake this kind of bread in a bread maker in a baking form. Hop sourdough is just super!

[Maria]

Maria, I am delighted! Beautiful bread! Ruddy, to the point of being golden! Rise, crumb, shape - everything is great! Joy to the depths of my soul, looking at such pictures! Thank you, Good Girl!
How is such bread for a husband? Proud for you, is it not yeast, but leaven?

[Marina]

Marina, yes, the husband is delighted and with a great sense of pride speaks about bread to friends and relatives. Each new bread makes us happy. Therefore, whoever wants such bread will definitely get his way. I went through all the stages very patiently and now I am very pleased with the result.

[Valery]

Valery, very nice bread! Thank you for the photo, for sharing your successes in baking with us!

And thanks to you for advice and support.

[Maria]

Maria, very happy about you!
Hope, it means that you have not quite fresh hops. Try to buy elsewhere and add fresh broth.
The girls added yeast to the hop sourdough, put the dough, but the dough took a very long time to rise.

I decided to do it again. The hops are fresh, according to the date on the package. Or could it be stored incorrectly?

[Lagri]

Lagri, Maria, what a perfect handsome man !!!! what can you say? Well done! I really liked it. I poked the last messages, and here such beautiful breads!

[Loksa]

Loksa, Oksana, thank you, I tried very hard to achieve successful breads and all thanks to this Temka, Marina, forum users who provide recipes, various tips, and of course, you. I am slowly mastering baking with hop sourdough and I (and my family) really like it. Now we are with the bread that we have been waiting for on our table for a long time.

[Marina]

water (whey, broth of wild rose, hawthorn) 1 liter
...
rye flour 2.5 - 3 cups
...
ZH flour - 3.5 cups
flour sun 1.5 cups.

Marina, what volume do you have? If you count flour per grams, how much is it needed?
Water in conventionally absolute units (liter), but flour - in conventionally relative units (glass)

Thank you.