"Eternal" leaven

Your sourdough is not ready for bread baking.
In three days she went through one stage of fermentation out of three.
Feed her for at least two more days according to the same scheme.
... And all the same, at least the fourth day is needed.
...

This statement applies to the first, well, to the second bread. When I baked the third leaven it was already 3 days of the initial + 52 hours and was fed 7 times.

UPD If so, when should you bake bread?

There are two questions:
What does it smell like now?
How do you store it?

After the last bread, a day ago, I decided to put it in the refrigerator on the top shelf, since it began to eat 1/2/2 of top dressing in the heat in 6-7 hours. I planned to get it to revive and bake it again in the morning. The smell in the refrigerator is not very strong, but a bit like an apple.

Here's the thing:
We count the first three days, and you have 7 additional fertilizing according to the schedule of the finished sourdough. They didn't seem to play a special role.
The first stage of fermentation is simply souring, the second is the bacteria MC multiply, which serve as food for yeast, the third stage is yeast fermentation. Here the rise begins.
Well, this is a thing of the past. In the cold, yeast bacteria will multiply. Which is what should have happened for your leaven.
Now, having taken her out of the refrigerator in advance, let her warm up for an hour. In the meantime, calculate how much sourdough you need for baking, add 50 - 70 grams.
For example, for baking you need 300 grams (so rough). Take 50 gr. sourdough and feed 50 water and 50 flour. As you eat, add 100 grams of water and 100 grams of flour. Should rise twice. Now you can take it for bread, and put the rest as it is in the refrigerator. After such feeding, she should raise the bread. It simply cannot be otherwise.

All the best rye starter cultures smelled like an apple.

.... Take 50 gr. sourdough and feed 50 water and 50 flour. As you eat, add 100 grams of water and 100 grams of flour. .....

That is, does it need to be fed from the refrigerator 2 times?
What are the breaks? Until it doubles?
And you can immediately take not 50 but 200 (I have a lot) and feed 1 time? Or is the effect not the same?
And if I double your numbers for 2 loaves (100 + 100, 200 + 200)?
If you bake tomorrow, then you need to get it out, warm it up and feed it now?
If I feed now, and she eats everything in 5 hours, and I'm still sleeping, or not sleeping, or feeding, how will I wake up?
If you are a lot (5-8 hours) late with the 2nd feeding before baking, is it bad?

Do not sleep - definitely canceled!
We are now making a good leaven from what we have.
How much leaven do you need in tomorrow's bread? Exactly in grams?

200+270=470

200+270=470

470 plus for storage.
Let's turn our chart upside down. This is also how it works and has already been tested.
Let's give her 500 gr. feed in two stages so that you sleep well at night. And more is possible. You obviously have a lot of flour.
For 100 g of sourdough, 200 g of water and flour and you can sleep. It will stand for 8 hours exactly at room temperature. In the morning it will need to be "refreshed" by adding 100 grams of water and flour each. After 4 hours, it should be ready to bake. But there will be a lot of it. How do you like this option? Is the timing right? If not, then the first feeding can be done using cold water and will leave for 12 hours.

[Or is the effect not the same?]

Fine! Do you need to warm or feed immediately? Is it easy to feed or mix with water? The answer to the question is important

And you can immediately take not 50 but 200 (I have a lot) and feed 1 time? Or is the effect not the same?

Do you need to change the dishes, or are they all in one, or for storage one for feeding the other?

You can not warm up and feed immediately. I fed immediately with warm water when it was necessary to quickly and simply at room temperature with water - she somehow did not care.
The important thing is that what comes out of the refrigerator is not leaven. This is called a "starter", that is.That is what we make the leaven from. The starter itself is not suitable for baking. To sleep in the cold, the sourdough preserves itself, as it were, producing acetic acid, which prevents yeast bacteria from multiplying. We need to feed him so as to reduce the concentration of this acid. Therefore, the amount of feed should exceed the amount of sourdough twice or more, but not less.
I always add water to the starter and beat with a fork until foamy. At the same time, it is well saturated with oxygen. Or I think so ... but everyone who tried this option liked it. I do not recognize the whisk. Then I add flour and mix with the same fork. To change the dishes or not - there is not much difference. My friends in America change the dishes and the one in which they also store and pour boiling water over them. I have never done that. Everyone has their own methods.

I see, thank you very much !!! I went to feed and sleep. I will unsubscribe tomorrow and ask around again.

Sourdough the second day. Tell me what is better to do? Pour half of it and continue feeding on schedule, or do you still change the container to a larger one? I put it in a liter jar, as advised, and it grows like that .... Initially I wanted to put it in a 3-liter jar, see this is my version, right?

7 hours have passed, she is so

Question: when should I feed the second time? The volume seems to have doubled, the roof has not changed. The smell (my wife sniffs, I got a defective nose) is sour and kind of like with black pepper. In general, what are the signs that She has already eaten everything and asks for more.

Finally I bought another flour. When kneading, I immediately saw the difference with the previous flour. This one is clearly better.






A day later, the volume of the leaven doubled, I was inspired, well, I think, flooded.





Then something interesting happened, after 4 hours the volume doubled again! Well, I think it's generally cool, what will happen tomorrow?



For another two hours, the leaven continued to grow slowly. Then the growth stopped, as it turned out later, everything began to fall off.

Here's what happened a day later



Nevertheless, I fed in the hope that the process will resume.



But nothing happened during the rest of the day or the next day. The leaven is dead.



And on top, the first signs of mold appeared, or whatever, in short, a white bloom.

My assumptions: for some reason, my fermentation is going too fast. Can you put it in a cooler place? Or catch the peak of the rise and feed earlier than a day later, just to catch the moment?
I look forward to your advice.

My assumptions: for some reason, my fermentation is going too fast. Can I put it in a cooler place? Or catch the peak of the rise and feed earlier than a day later, just to catch the moment?

After reading, I understand what exactly is so. My opinion is too warm, better still 22-24. Regarding the peak, it is very important at the beginning (the first 5 days), then the peak is important just before baking, and after the first feeding you may not be able to catch it a little (2-4 hours). + Strongly fermented leaven will make the bread more acidic.

Friendly advice: Not everyone has a normal Internet, group, preview and hide the photo under the spoiler.

Friendly advice: Not everyone has a normal Internet, group, preview and hide the photo under the spoiler.

Yes, there are pictures I made from 50 to 100 kilobytes, this is acceptable even for an archaic modem. That is, all 14 photos weigh only 1.3 megabytes, how much less? Is it slow for you?

[Viki]

Yes, there are pictures I made from 50 to 100 kilobytes - this is acceptable even for an archaic modem. That is, all 14 photos weigh only 1.3 megabytes, how much less? Is it slow for you?

The page took 55 seconds to load - acceptable?
It's not very convenient to scroll through 14 photos every time without a preview.
Your photo size is a bit small for me, that is, it is possible that some details (size, number of bubbles, crumb porosity, intensity of inclusions of additives) will be a little more difficult to raze.
But the rest is just wonderful: both the signature on the photo and the sticker on the can. Very informative.
Viki, sorry for the small offtopic. No more.

UPD By the way, there is not enough photo of a white bloom to complete the picture.

7 hours have passed ...Question: when should I feed the second time? The volume seems to have doubled, the roof has not changed. The smell (my wife sniffs, I got a defective nose) is sour and kind of like with black pepper. In general, what are the signs that She has already eaten everything and asks for more.

Can be supplemented when it has doubled
And I'll also put in my five cents, you obviously overexposed your last bread, 3.5-4 hours was enough. By 5 o'clock it has already begun to settle and the peroxide probably. It is enough to double the dough. Make a mark on the side of the bucket with flour so you can see when it's time to bake. The appearance of at least one bubble on the surface "screams" that it is urgent to bake.
You can also add 20 grams of flour when kneading.

Can be supplemented when it has doubled
And I'll also put in my five cents, you obviously overexposed your last bread, 3.5-4 hours was enough. By 5 o'clock it has already begun to settle and the peroxide probably. It is enough to double the dough. Make a mark on the side of the bucket with flour so you can see when it's time to bake. The appearance of at least one bubble on the surface "screams" that it is urgent to bake.
You can also add 20 grams of flour when kneading.

But this is a very small amount of bread. There were no bubbles on the surface, but they were visible in the cracks. I tried to make a mark, but apparently the imaginary is not enough to recalculate the volume formless "ill-formed" sausages to the volume of an almost regular-shaped bucket. But in the photo of others, it is SIGNIFICANTLY higher. He did not reach such a height, for some reason

But this is a very small amount of bread. There were no bubbles on the surface, but they were visible in the cracks. I tried to make a mark, but apparently the imaginary is not enough to recalculate the volume formless "irregular" sausages to the volume of an almost regular bucket shape. But in the photo of others, it is SIGNIFICANTLY higher. He did not reach this height for me, for some reason

And what is the total weight of flour in the dough, incl. the one in the leaven?
Something tells me that either you have a larger bucket, or you bake a small loaf

And how big is the bucket?

Here on

.
.....
"Bucket" 3-3.5 liters

... Generally I try to do everything according to the recipe.
By the way "Bucket" 3-3.5 liters

Mine is also 3.5 liters. 13 x 18, h 15
I bake black from 600-650 g of flour, it turns out for 2/3 of a bucket. The crumb is always good.
You might have a not entirely correct idea of ​​the size of the loaves in the photo, since many bake in small forms, and even photos can distort the real size

You baked this bread, please show me a photo.

You baked this bread, please show me a photo.

I bake my
You can see in your profile
There is a photo, including step by step

[P.S.]

I bake my
You can see in your profile
There is a photo, including step by step

Very clear, thank you. Here you can see very well that yours is 2 times higher than mine, the section is almost a regular square. Mine, with a width of 13 cm, has a height of 5.5 cm. In your 565 g of flour, in mine is 435, that is, 0.77 of yours, you have a cross-sectional area of ​​approximately 170 square meters. see my 71.5, i.e. 0.42. It turns out that yours is 1.8 times more. I'm sorry for the math. It turns out it's not about the size of the bucket and my vision of the size of a rye loaf.

Most likely, as Viki said, the leaven hasn't come up yet. Soon it will ripen prepared according to her advice

470 plus to be left for storage.
Let's turn our chart upside down. This is also how it works and has already been tested.
Let's give her 500 gr. feed in two stages so that you sleep well at night. And more is possible. You obviously have a lot of flour.
For 100 g of sourdough, 200 g of water and flour and you can sleep. It will stand for 8 hours exactly at room temperature. In the morning it will need to be "refreshed" by adding 100 grams of water and flour each. After 4 hours, it should be ready to bake. But there will be a lot of it. How do you like this option? Is the timing right? If not, then the first feeding can be done using cold water and will leave for 12 hours.

I will unsubscribe about the results, we will think further.
P.S.
Rate the bubbling

[Tat_yanka]

Sourdough the second day. Tell me what is better to do? Pour half of it and continue feeding on schedule, or do you still change the container to a larger one? I put it in a liter jar, as advised, and it grows like that .... Initially I wanted to put it in a 3-liter jar, see this is my version, right?

Tat_yanka it is better, of course, to remove part of the leaven and feed a smaller amount, or even a 3-liter jar will not do. : nea: For example, I used a part in bread or pancakes, it was somehow a pity to throw it away.

[P.S.]

P.S.
Rate the bubbling

Appreciated
10 out of 10

Appreciated
10 out of 10

In terms of . Can I bake?

I like flour on. The bread does not spoil for a long time.
Yes, and harmful, they say to eat yeast: 🔗

And who tried the thread on the intoxicated sourdough to bake?
Is there a taste difference?

I like flour on. The bread does not spoil for a long time.
Yes, and it's harmful, they say to eat yeast: 🔗

And who tried the thread on the intoxicated sourdough to bake?
Is there a taste difference?

Take a look Monastic leavens.

In terms of . Can I bake?

In my opinion, a great working young starter culture!
If you're baking, don't knead the dough for too long. Rye doesn't like that. You can overdo it and mix it up. 10 minutes is great!

Everything doubled

I put 50 g in the refrigerator

Kneaded the dough

If you're baking, don't knead the dough for too long. Rye doesn't like that. You can overdo it and mix it up. 10 minutes is great!

According to the recipe, it is supposed to be 30 minutes, my hp is 20. And how can you spoil it with a mixture.
Measured the depth without dough, laid the dough and measured with the dough

I put it back in HP (in which the dough program continued (heated for proofing), 60 minutes remained).
As soon as information appears, I will unsubscribe.

After 1:10

Raised from 3.5 cm to 6

Today Darnitsky baked. I decided to add pressed yeast (4-5 g). In an hour, my loaf rose to the brim!
🔗
🔗
The roof did not break this time, it is not very even, because when the dough rose, it stuck to the film with which I closed the mold, and I could not level it.

[yayawa]

yayawa super!!!
Looks great, almost choked with saliva. I am sure the taste is also very good. How the crumb cools down in the studio.
Unfortunately, it is not shown to me with yeast

Mine will come soon

[McCleod]

McCleod, thank you)) I take a picture of the crumb, there is already half a loaf)) You can do it without yeast, I just didn't feel like waiting for 3 hours until it rises on sourdough.
Today I was kneading the dough in HP. I also wanted to bake in HP, but changed my mind at the last moment. All the same, the bread from the oven is completely different, and this form fascinates me)) I have it old, old, from the bakery.

behold
🔗

The crumb is very good, but they hurried to cut it.
A

I have it old, old, from the bakery.

Just awesome. I feel when I grow to the oven, this form will become an obsession for me

Yes, how can you resist and not cut warm)))

And yours, how is it, probably already approached?

[Tat_yanka]

Tat_yanka it is better, of course, to remove part of the leaven and feed a smaller amount, or even a 3-liter jar will not do. : nea: For example, I used some of it in bread or pancakes, it was somehow a pity to throw it away.

Everything has fallen, or maybe it should be so? Does not smell sour, smells like raw flour, bubbles are still there. I understand that until it smells sour, then this is not sourdough and you cannot make bread on it. So?

Throw out half, a mound of flour, water by eye, so that it is creamy and in a warm place. And will grow)

I'm generally in a half liter jar, and not in 3 x.
I take it out of the refrigerator, into the bath on the warm floor. Then I put flour and water on the floor again until a full jar grows. Growing fast.
With such a small jar, I have 10 tablespoons of table sourdough.

I use it all for baking.
There remains smeared on the walls of the jar, there is again a bit of flour and water, after 30 minutes everything is there again in a bunch. And in the refrigerator)

Mine will come soon

Where's Duncan McCleod? Looks like the bread rushed up so that now everyone is busy catching it

Where's Duncan McCleod? Looks like the bread rushed up so that now everyone is busy catching it

Someday it will be so. ... While everything is not very good, I wait until it cools down to immediately fully report. 6.5 cm.

Someday it will be so. ... While everything is not very good, I wait until it cools down to immediately fully report. 6.5 cm.

I look forward to
Do not forget to include the total proofing time

So.

After 1:50 proofing, the rise was from 3.5 to 7 cm, the dough pressed with a finger did not try to regain its shape at all.

It was decided to urgently bake. He baked 1:10. It turned out like this.

The bread "shrunk" from 7 to 6.5. Yes, and moved away from the walls. When tapped on the bottom, the sound does not really sound like a dummy. The bread is springy. The crust is thin on top, almost invisible, on the sides and on the bottom, thick, hard, crispy. Little crumb damp a bit damp. The taste of black bread. Tasty. With a slight sourness.
My daughter liked

As a result, the question is: why is it wet? And what to do?

And about the leaven (it just came to me now): When I was making bread, I put 50 g aside and in the cold-ik. Did I have to feed her in front of the refrigerator? I read here that it is growing in the refrigerator, but mine has already stopped and there is nothing to grow it with.

[McCleod]

McCleod, what a wonderful taster you have. The main thing is that she liked it)) And I liked the crumb in appearance, but I'm not special ...

McCleod, it worked well! It seems to me that you have it in proportion to the amount of ingredients. The roof is beautiful, so is the crumb.
With regards to finger pressing, this is more of a test for white. The rye dough will not spring, it will simply deflate.
As for drying out, that's right, the bread shrinks a little during baking, the moisture leaves.
Well, and on the crumb - you can bake a little longer, you can slightly increase the proofing (30 minutes) for a while until your leaven gains strength ("Immortal"). And then she (leaven) will work more professionally, while she is also studying
And the daughter is great, she knows a lot about food! And she was lucky with her parents: all the best - to the children!

Thank you!
1. How then to determine the end of proofing?
2. If the stove does not burn for a longer time?
3.

When I was making bread, I set aside 50 g in the cold-ik. Did I have to feed her in front of the refrigerator? I read here that it is growing in the refrigerator, but mine has already stopped and there is nothing to grow it with.

I'm sorry about interrogation. It's just very important.

1. How then to determine the end of proofing?
While empirically. Just add half an hour. Control the dough at this time, when a bubble appears on the surface, cracks, turn on the baking.

2. If the stove does not burn for a longer time?
Add 10 minutes. Once you get it out of the bucket, sprinkle water on the crust so that it doesn't look too oak. While the bread is hot, the water will evaporate quickly, only slightly softening the crust.

3. Did I have to feed her in front of the refrigerator?
You need to feed the starter culture in front of the refrigerator, otherwise it will accumulate acetic acid too quickly, then you will take it out for a long time. You can get it and feed it, it's never too late. And it would be better for you to keep it at room temperature for a couple of days to get stronger. Feed as needed 1-2 times a day, depending on her behavior. If it rises quickly, then 2 times, say, in the morning and in the evening.

MacLeod, I support the previous speaker, everything is fine, there was little dough initially, only 3.5 cm - how much flour? gram 300?
judging by the crust - there is a little extra moisture.
well, absolutely wonderful grizzly taster

People! Help! I understand that for certain has already been discussed, but enter into my position - a small child does not allow reading at all, but he wants healthy bread. On the third day, my leaven stopped showing signs of life. On the second one it bubbled and doubled, but after the third feeding it stopped and not a bubble. This is the end? Or can you still feed and see? Smells nothing bad, however, as well as good (sour). What to do with her? Or maybe not fooling around and not transferring the products and immediately adding a new one?

It is clear, just 1 post says how to double in the refrigerator, so you need to get it out and feed it. Horror, it's because I have it there for 25 hours already without food. And how to feed, as usual an hour to warm up, feed and back? And if I need to get it out tonight and start feeding it for bread for tomorrow evening, what should I do? feed now (then it will turn out three times before baking and a lot of sourdough) or wait until evening?
And after that another question: I began to overfeed "eternal" wheat flour. He took 15 grams and fed 15 + 15, after a few hours (4-8 I don't remember) when it increased as much as possible (as it seems to me), I fed 100 + 100 again, then when it doubled I put it in the refrigerator. And the question is, is it similar in properties to rye or is it younger and needs to be fed?