Starter cultures - in questions and answers

natural leaven (optionally 15 g leaven concentrate)
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Program 7 Sour dough allows to prepare a classical sour dough bread. This program is also recommended for bread mixtures for rye bread or wholemeal rye bread.

In this program the ingredients are kneaded and the rest for 9 hours at 25 ° C. The usual preparation and baking program starts.

Bread without yeast is normally very firm and moist. Therefore we recommended to use yeast in addition to the sour dough / leaven. However, pure rye bread will always be very firm, even if yeast is added.
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Google googles like this:
natural starter cultures (optional 15 g starter culture concentrate)
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Program 7 sour dough allows you to prepare a classic sour dough. This program is also recommended for wholemeal rye bread mix or rye bread.

In this program the ingredients are kneaded and rest for 9 hours at 25 ° C. The usual preparation and baking program begins.

Yeast-free bread is generally very hard and moist. Therefore, we recommend using yeast in addition to the sour dough / sourdough. However, pure rye bread will always be very hard, even if yeast is added.

natural leaven (optionally 15 g leaven concentrate)

Well, yes, everything is correct: natural sourdough (optional 15 g of sourdough concentrate) - probably dry sourdough.

the recipe for natural sourdough contains 150 g
I am in vague doubts ... for 500 g of flour, albeit whole grain 400 ml of water - this may already be a bit much. And then how thick should the leaven be?

Okay, tomorrow we will try ... there is no whole grain flour, but 2 varieties of wheat and rye, which includes bran, is also available.
And for bread, which must rise for a long time on sourdough, does the kolobok rule work? Or should the consistency of the dough be different?

Of course it works. I mean, maybe this is so much water, taking into account what is included in the leaven? And then, whole grain flour - she loves water very much.
But for comparison, Romin's recipe for a bun made of c / s flour: (I always bake it on it, if there is c / s flour) Here you can also see the flour-liquid ratio.
flour c \ z 500 gr
serum 338 ml
sugar 1.25 tbsp l.
salt 2 tsp
vegetable oil 2.5 tbsp. l.
yeast 15 g fresh

And the sourdough is 100% I think ...

I started it with all the ingredients according to the recipe from the instructions, took 150 g of my starter, maybe 10 g less water, the dough turned out like soft plasticine. In general, I'll see what will be baked tomorrow (the program will finish work by 6-7 in the morning).

Instead of dry yeast, I added 4 grams of pressed.

girls, today I baked in sourdough from the refrigerator, I unconserved it according to the Lyudin method - it finally grows like a beast, and paaaaahn like at a bakery - such a bread spirit for the whole apartment in one word, I'm happy like an elephant and don't feed it, and bakes properly

To be honest, I stubbornly fed my starter with an equal amount of flour to the weight of the starter. That is, if 50 g of sourdough, then 50 g of flour for feeding. It turns out it was right. True, I did not know that, it just happened that way and that's it.

I got lost there in an article with this deconservation and examples, too many numbers for my almost dormant brain. I'll read it again in the morning. To settle down.

Everything is simple - feed 1: 1, store liquid, re-preserve - 1: 1 feeding, no more, and at 30C after getting out of the refrigerator. key point - T de-preservation 30C, and feeding in an equal amount, no more

but in the morning, yes, it's better to read in the morning, otherwise your brains are on one side

Yes, like brains on one side!
And it is better not to bother, grow and feed the leaven the way you are used to, if only it was healthy and baked delicious bread for us!

I read in Ludmila's LJ a completely revolutionary article on how to store leaven everything changes

"... The power is changing again! ...."

Thank you very much, I just started to grow a new sourdough, now I will store it using a new technology.
I also found an article about our (and not ours) flour in Lyudmila's LJ. It turns out that the high protein content in flour is not yet high in gluten.

I feed and keep my Frenchwoman as before.We have formed with her in this matter, full of love and mutual understanding, we will not have any revolutions

But as the summer heat begins, I will definitely try the conservation method, perhaps it will be salutary for this season.

It turned out that I fed my leaven correctly. since my hand did not rise to throw out such an amount of flour. Rye is made with hops, although there is no longer a smell of hops. It is stored in the refrigerator, I feed it as needed before baking, almost nothing has to be thrown away, maybe just a little. The aroma of the bread during baking is wonderful, it lifts the bread without yeast, so it works for now. Wheat with a small amount of c. Feels good too with flour. So it's not that scary. And then at the mere thought that it is necessary to feed her every day, many will lose heart to bake bread with leaven.
And Luda must once again carefully read in the morning with a fresh mind.

Girls, calm down!
I have a wheat starter in the refrigerator and its smell is pronounced acetone. I made sourdough using this link - 🔗, in the same place I read that the smell of acetone is normal. Okay, huh? It didn't smell like that at first. I'm going to make sourdough out of it for tomorrow at night, but now I think, and Mona?

The leaven should not smell like acetone!

The leaven should not smell like acetone!

Exactly exactly?

How did I get this leaven. I started making rye, but after the first day I saw that it would take a lot of rye flour, but at that time I had only 1 kg and where to get it in our city, I had not yet passed through. Therefore, in order to save flour, I set aside half of the future sourdough, and then fed the rye for half a portion. And it was a pity to throw this one away, so I began to feed her separately with premium wheat flour. This is how I got my wheat leaven. I rarely use it, more often I bake rye bread. And I use this one about once every 2 weeks to feed. Well, now, the other day I sniffed, and there was acetone (well, the smell is one to one, like a nail polish remover) and the liquid from above separated.

[Lozja]

Lozjamaybe vinegar after all? I mean, it smells like vinegar?

if you store it in the refrigerator, then only yeast multiplies there, they release alcohol during operation and vinegar can smell if it stands for a long time ... there should not be acetone, maybe vinegar after all

Feed once every 2 weeks - so she was brutalized with hunger! And liquid is not that. You can take a drop of rye (if it's good) and feed it with wheat flour, but not so rarely!

[Lozja]

Lozjamaybe vinegar after all? I mean, it smells like vinegar?

if you store it in the refrigerator, then only yeast multiplies there, they release alcohol during operation and vinegar can smell if it stands for a long time ... there should not be acetone, maybe vinegar after all

No, no, not vinegar, natural acetone.

Okay, so the wheat bread is canceled for tomorrow. I will throw this one out of harm's way and overfeed some of the rye into wheat leaven. And rye is normal, I bake bread on it every 2-3 days and feed it.
Or I won't bother, because I baked in wheat only to feed it, we are more and more on rye bread. And if when you need to bake white, I use yeast.

Thank you all for your help!

I rarely use it, more often I bake rye bread. And I use this one about once every 2 weeks to feed.

Feed once every two weeks ... She starved, was exhausted and died.

Lissa, the question is probably for you, since you started using the leaven using the "revolutionary method",
but in general I just ask you to help me figure it out, otherwise I'm a mathematician of course very weak

Look, if I have such a quantity of leaven, for which Lyudmila gives an example - 400 g !!! (where do I need so much! I use a maximum of 250-300 sourdoughs) is completely unnecessary, then after de-preservation (pulled out of the cold, stirred the flour, added water 50 * C, left at 30 * C for 2.5-3 h) - do I need to feed the leaven again 1: 2?
Initially, I had 135 g of 100% moisture sourdough, sprinkled with 70 g of flour. If I add another 70 g of water, I already have my 270 g of starter culture.
So I should feed her again 1: 2 and withstand at 30 * or what? But then there will be a lot of leaven! - 540 g !!!!
I'm confused

Feed once every two weeks ... She starved, was exhausted and died.

So he writes there - you can store the starter in the refrigerator for up to two weeks. So I didn’t worry.

[rinishek]

rinishek

I'll climb in while Lissa is gone))

I have not used this method yet, but I have already roughly figured out how I will do it in the summer

“Initially I had 135 g of 100% moisture starter dough sprinkled with 70 g of flour. If I add another 70 g of water, I already get my 270 g of starter.
So I should feed her again 1: 2 and withstand at 30 * or what? "

According to Lyudmila, it turns out that your 270 g of sourdough is already ready for use in the dough, and further feedings - only if you need to increase a large amount of sourdough.

but I would still feed it a couple of times after the refrigerator ... I can't believe that after the cold she will become cheerful and beautiful at once ...

After the so-called "storage according to the French method" in the basement, my sourdough began to be capricious, she does not like the cold-dark ...
Well, and so ... practice will show, I will not undertake de-preservation before summer

[rinishek]

rinishek, hi! Zest, thanks for writing!

rinishek, I already baked this sourdough from x-ka, this is how you write - there are 135 leaven + 70 flour, add 70 water - if this quantity is enough, then you do not need to feed the second time!

here the essence is what - to feed in a ratio of 1 part of sourdough to 1 part of fresh dough (you have 135 sourdough + 140 fresh dough (70 flour + 70 water) - that is, almost 1: 1)

and the second - ALWAYS dilute with water 50C, and MUST ferment at 30C. I put a mug of boiling water in the oven and turn on the light bulb. and put a room thermometer - it is stable 32-33, just in the leaven it will be 30. rinishek, she rushes like crazy for the first hour, the whole hole is full, and it increases by 10-15 percent, and by the end of 4 hours - by 3.5-4 times according to any of my previous experiments with leaven, I could not achieve this

and immediately can be put into the dough after 4 hours. I needed a lot of sourdough this time according to the recipe, so when I fed her the second time, it jumped 2 times in an hour already ... that is, if I put it into the dough, it would already work there perfectly

Well, I hope I still had time

py. sy. rinishek, do not forget that you still have a ripe piece, otherwise I calculated everything to a gram, and it all went into the dough well, I had 2 jars of sourdough, otherwise I would have to withdraw a new spontaneous fermentation

py. py. sy

ch-t, I can't believe that after the cold she will become cheerful and beautiful at once ...

Zest , but I couldn’t believe it, I’m more for confectionery, not for bread, so my leaven never grew more than 2 times before

here, after all, the trick is that we preserve it as ripe as possible! at the peak of its, that is, szat, life. like jam and then we wake it back. that is, the maximum of MCB and yeast go to the cc, they gradually die there, but since there was a maximum of them, not all die. and now, when we take it out, these survivors immediately find themselves in an ideal environment for reproduction (there Luda gave graphs that at +30 - every hour their number grows several times, the largest reproduction is at this T. at higher - die, at lower - they multiply more slowly). and we feed it 1: 1 so that the leaven does not dissolve in a huge amount of undeveloped dough, but so that it populates fresh territories with the necessary, already excreted organisms ..

in general, in short, it worked as Luda described, if everything is done accurately and with observance of temperatures

oh, I love to write ... IRR, brevity is not my sister too

I report - I didn't feed her anymore - I immediately put it on pizza. Really rushing! , and it is clear from the dough that the leaven is in good shape, but ...
I read the last comment in LiveJournal - it turns out that Lyudmila described it all NOT FOR A FRENCH.
So Zest is absolutely right - intuition did not disappoint - you see how, she does not want her sissy in the refrigerator at all, even for experiment

and I have a Frenchwoman - but still my hand does not rise to throw away the flour, the toad presses, I will continue to try the conservation method. I'm not losing anything - if something goes wrong, I'll grow another one.

Lissa, in principle, I also defined for myself just such a scheme, as you described, so girls, thanks for the productive discussion on the topic

In general, it seemed to me that way, or Lyudmila really often contradicts herself - then it is ALL about wheat leaven, and it is not even specified that the French are not included in this list, then something else is so important, but it turns out quite by accident (take the same epic with water, sort of like the GOST recipe, but it turns out that the role of the amount of water in the recipe is far from the last element, and I keep quiet about the quality of flour). I noticed this several times. But it might well be that I read the article so inattentively

I read the last comment in LiveJournal - it turns out that Lyudmila described it all NOT FOR A FRENCH WOMAN.

Shaw, has the power changed again? Here I just didn’t see this valuable remark. It turns out that you can hope for Lyudmila, but don't do it yourself.

In general, it seemed to me that way, or Lyudmila really often contradicts herself

there is such a letter in this word))

[mariana_aga wrote:]

Zest, to be honest, I'm already confused, here's a quote

divlesika wrote:
Mar. 17th, 2011 09:45 pm (UTC)
Luda
I dare to ask: I've heard a lot about the aroma of "greenhouse" sourdough as opposed to "refrigerated" .. What about this moment? More precisely, your opinion interests ..
Link | Reply | Thread
mariana_aga wrote:
Mar. 17th, 2011 11:31 pm (UTC)
warm or hot-cold method, do not combine!
No way, follow the recipe for your starter. if you brought out French, then store in the French way, never placing it in the refrigerator, only speeding up or slowing down its fermentation by a slight increase or decrease in fermentation T. That is, it usually ferments at 20-24C, but it can be slowed down by reducing the T of the ferment to 10-12C. The French have one temperature range, a continuous comfort zone, from 10C to 24C. it cannot be cooled below 10C, otherwise it will fizzle out, and it cannot be fermented at T above 24C, otherwise it becomes infected with putrefactive bacteria, "blooms", turns green, red, purple, dissects, stinks and needs to be washed and saved.

..... [10C, 12C, 14C, 16C, 18C, 20C, 22C, 24C] ...

If you brought GOST, then use GOST, ferment it only at 30C or "turn off fermentation" at 2C. Well, imagine the Russian tradition - from a hot bath to an ice hole and then back to the bath. In a bathhouse, in an ice-hole, in a bathhouse, in an ice-hole ... Russian bakery technologists treat sourdough in this way. They either wander "in the heat" (Russians have leavens that wander even at 50-60C!), Or sits on ice, does not breathe.

..... [2C, 4C, 6C] .............. [28C, 30C] .....

Neither at 10C, nor at 12C, 14C, 16C, 18C, 20C, 22C, 24C, the starter culture according to GOST, in contrast to the French, never ferments and it never gets full of unleavened dough and is never as steep as French. ON at 30C and OFF at 2C, so to speak, this is all that is allowed for GOSTOV sourdough. Never treat her like French. They don't overlap.

It’s not about hothouse and refrigeration, that is, where the leaven spends most of the time when it’s not used, but the sum of all the components of the method.

That is, "warm" sourdough is a sourdough that ferments all the time and has its own feeding rules, temperature regime, etc.

And "cold" is a leaven that is canned for a while, the fermentation processes are turned off in it, in compressed yeast in a pack, where they are "turned off" for up to 4-6 weeks, while they are stored in the refrigerator or taken out and diluted in hot sugar-free milk or water to ferment violently. And they do it completely differently from the "warm" one, where the leaven is never turned off.

Different rules, different feeding proportions, etc.

The problem of losing the lift and aroma of the sourdough begins when a sourdough that is fed according to the French method (very steep, feeding 1: 3, 1: 5 and above) is placed in the refrigerator (i.e.try to continue fermentation there, in the cold). Or when the starter culture, which is fed according to the rules of GOST (liquid, feeding 1: 1), is tried to be kept warm or cool. She will not stand this, she will die.

"Warm" leavens are designed for bread in the French tradition - non-acidic, aromatic, fermented for up to a day. starter cultures in accordance with GOST are designed for the enormous acidity of traditional Russian types of rye and the increased acidity of white bread and they have a colossal lifting force so that the bread quickly ferments and quickly decays and is ready for baking not in 3-7 hours, like the French, but in 20 30min, like Borodino and all our other sorts of leavened bread, including wheat.

Oddly enough it sounds, but in the sourdough according to GOST d and e yeast is not commercially available pressed yeast! Yeast in French sourdough every ten times the commercially available pressed yeast. THEREFORE THE FRENCHES TO THE STEERING TEST Stir the store yeast, and the Russians, on the contrary, remove the yeast from the sourdough dough so that the store yeast does not inhibit the fermentation of the sourdough dough!

And the aroma of both of them is excellent. Those who ate good French bread and who remember the good Soviet bread, which is still baked in many places, they know.

and here's how to understand it? French, but thick (and in fact we have almost all of them here liquid), feeding 1: 3, but in the article about feeding the most optimal is 1: 2
In general, I understood it this way - an article about SOME wheat leaven, but not French or Kalvelevskaya, because Kalvelevskaya seems to be also French
now it remains to understand how the sourdough on grapes and raisins can be attributed - and we can say that it will become clear

Don't figure it out without a bottle ... I'll keep it outside the refrigerator as before.

[rinishek]

rinishek

Opensource projects, eh ... I still read the "clean" article itself, without comments. Now I just ran over the pieces that you brought here.

I understand the whole thing in this way:

- French (here in a heap it is thick, liquid, whatever + it feeds in high proportions, that is, above 1: 2) can be kept EXCLUSIVELY in the range of temp. between + 10 and + 24. The "conservation" method is absolutely not suitable for it;

- some GOST sourdough must be thrown out of the heat and into the cold and vice versa. This is how the steel was tempered)) And feed exclusively 1: 1.

The case is small - to find out who the GOST leaven is, and where to carry all the rest, except for her and the French women

in general, I decided not to bathe and store-feed my girl according to a long-established scheme.
I will not even try this very preservation, my whole practice of communicating with a French woman screams that she cannot stand cold and dark ... And she really gives me non-acidic aromatic bread ... and really constantly eats, wanders, grows , as in continuous production ... And it is impossible and harmful to "switch off" it and place it in unsuitable conditions.

Would someone ask Lyudmila a question, what kind of leaven does she throw out of the fire and in half-time. What exactly can she preserve?

And in the summer I’ll go for bread on pulish, cold fermentation, (y) fragrant to madness. Here is Reinhart's recipe https://Mcooker-enn.tomathouse.com/index.php@option=com_smf&topic=120769.0 I redrawn it for bread, beautiful)) The taste, to be honest, differs very little from the starter

Zest, I agree, the Frenchwoman should not be put in the cold, although I also had a grape one - I also did not very willingly endure the solemn carrying out to the balcony
But of course I will experiment a bit. Let's see how it goes.
And what is there to ask Luda - every time you get a different answer

thanks for the link to the recipe, I will study

Calvel's sourdough is really French and cool. But GOST is the one that has been used since Soviet times at our bakeries. The peculiarities are imposed by the fact that Russians prefer sour rye bread. Accordingly, our domestic starter cultures have always been made with high acidity. Yes, and in the villages all their life, leaven was called sour dough. And the French have bread without acidity and the leaven is much less sour. Another, shorter.Therefore, such a difference in the treatment of them.

But our (GOST) starters are, by the way, thick and liquid. They are also different. I have met at least a thick, liquid with infusion, liquid without infusion and concentrated lactic acid starter cultures.

ABOUT! I deliberately went and found in my collection of recipes "making a thick sourdough in the exploration cycle on dry lactobacterin". True, the cycle is described under factory volumes. It all starts with 300g, and ends with 120kg of rye flour.

Luda brought out Sarychev's leaven for herself, here is an article about it 🔗 - this is for gostovsky breads, where the taste is sour and there is no or very little yeast

but I didn’t take out Sarychevskaya, but first of spontaneous fermentation of grape according to Nancy Silverton, and then transferred it to the production head according to GOST. and I diluted this ready-made head with cold water and put it in the refrigerator for conservation, I brought it out on RYE flour. I wrote all my posts about her

here, I deduced according to this recipe, below. Lyuda closed it in LJ, so I am citing a quote from my file

Luda writes:
"This is how real rye sourdough is prepared

First, a good quality spontaneous fermentation starter (with a strong lactic acid aroma) is prepared. It can be made from wheat flour or rye, from flour of any grade - no difference. For those who have never removed the spontaneous fermentation sourdough, but want to learn how to bake rye bread, I recommend the Nancy Silverton method. According to it, in contrast to the "French method", much more vigorous starter cultures with high acidity and a correct, "lactic" acidity profile are obtained.

SPONTANEOUS FERMENTATION STAR (N. Silverton, 1996)
The spontaneous fermentation sourdough can be created on wheat or rye flour of any grade. Take 250g of red grapes, 2 cups of flour, 2 cups of water. Lightly crush the grapes, mix the water with flour, pour over the grapes, cover the dishes with gauze and leave for 5 days, stirring once a day. Strain, freshen 3-5 times in the proportion of ½ cup of sourdough, ½ cup of flour, ½ cup of water every 3-4 hours. Throw away the unused portions of the leaven.

Dilution of a rye sourdough means four refreshments of a spontaneous fermentation sourdough according to a special method. They begin with the fact that a yeast head is prepared from the spontaneous fermentation sourdough and baker's yeast. Then the intermediate is removed from it, from the intermediate - the original and, finally, from the original - the production head: a real rye starter with an acidity of 14-16 degrees and a special microflora (rye sour). After the rye sourdough is ready, it can be maintained by simply feeding it with flour and water for months, it can be frozen, etc.

Dilution of rye sourdough until acidity reaches 14-16 degrees
First, a yeast head is prepared: 90 g of rye flour, 85 g of water, 25 g of ripe sourdough, 2 g of pressed yeast. T 25C, allow to ferment for 4.5 hours until the acidity is 10 degrees.
Next, an intermediate head is prepared: 100 g of a yeast head, 125 g of rye flour, 110 g of water. T 26C, ferment for 4.5 hours until the acidity is 12 degrees.
Finally, the initial head is prepared: 110 g of the intermediate head, 155 g of rye flour, 130 g of water. T 27C, ferment for 4.5 hours until acidity of 14 degrees.
Now the starter culture is ready for making the final production head from it: 125 g of the original head, 150 g of rye flour, 125 g of water. Т 28-29С, 4.5 hours of fermentation until acidity of 14-16 degrees.

The finished production head is used as a starter culture for preparing rye dough and a new batch of starter culture (production head). Such maintenance of rye sourdough for baking and preservation of the microflora of the sourdough will lead to the fact that on the fifth day in the production sourdough the correct composition and activity of microflora will be established and they will remain constant for one to several months, after which you should take a piece of the production head and refresh it according to the full program, having prepared from it a yeast head, intermediate, initial and production.

Since the process of removing rye sourdough takes more than 18 hours, and we are ordinary people and we need to sleep sometime, the breeding process can be interrupted by keeping the sourdough of any of the intermediate stages in the cellar or in a warm place in the refrigerator (at 6-10C), but not longer than 8-12 hours. "

I beg pardon that I confused your "Frenchwomen"

Oh, girls, my sourdough has become something vigorous, the smell is not kefir, but a sour spirit sizzling in my nose.
I tried to rejuvenate - no change. Before her, the very first leaven had such a pleasant kefir aroma that when I fermented mixed feed for chickens on the remains of the leaven, there was a smell in the kitchen, as if a bucket of kefir had been spilled. I don't know what to do with the leaven, tell me.

And what is the age of the leaven? Maybe it's time to start a new one?

She is with me in November, 2010

Girls, I grew Sarychev's rye sourdough (from Lyudmila's blog)
Fortunately, I had free days and I can regulate the temperature of the batteries myself.
What can I say! For a year, I was probably friends with a Frenchwoman.

But this one !!!! Such a smell !!!!!!!!!!!!!! In short, I'm like a cat near a valerian. She smells like that! This is an amazing smell so fruity!

I read the blog very carefully.
There are new accents - somehow
1-sprinkle the sourdough with flour so that it is not wet and unnecessary bacteria do not develop.
2-it is necessary to store in the cold liquid, because the thick quickly turns sour.
3-you need to understand how to translate thick into liquid and vice versa.
4-well, and finally I realized that I still have to strictly adhere to the technology and weigh everything to a gram, maintain the temperature regime, then there will be a result.
5-yeah, well, and the last thing, finally figured out the humidity and percentage.

I tried to bake rye only with sourdough that Lyudmila has on her blog.
The sensations are interesting.

I'll try to grow it like I did ... I need to come to an agreement with the moon, I'll go count the best days for a new leaven.

Today is the full moon.

Yes, and the moon is sooo close to the ground.

well, well, it seems like through joint reflections we figured out that
- Calvela - French
- grape - NOT French (very strange for me, because she feeds exactly the same way as a French)
- sarychevskaya - also understandable

- and what kind of raisin? following the logic of the grape - it seems like not French, but she also feeds like a typical Frenchwoman?

- and what kind of raisin? following the logic of the grape - it seems like not French, but she also feeds like a typical Frenchwoman?

Are you trying to categorize by feeding?

As far as I understand (if I'm wrong, correct me please), raisins means that raisins and bacteria that live on raisins are used in the cultivation process.

Lyudmila has this thesis that they use raisins-grapes to soften the terrible smell during the fermentation of putrefactive bacteria in the first three days.
And I'll tell you the smell, well, right fu, and then when lactic acid bacteria begin to develop rapidly, well, just yum-yum (I'm impressed by the smells like a cat purring in March).

Yes, I have already read this article several times. I have my own opinion on putrid odors and their masking. Perhaps it is based solely on emotional principles and is not at all supported by theoretical foundations, but I don't care much about that.

I like the smell of grape sourdough at any time of its cultivation, the French one, having neither grapes nor raisins in its composition, also smells like a maximum of rotten grass - in the first days - and this is by no means an unpleasant smell. For me, it is rather just a smell.
No, girls, I certainly can be mistaken about the classification according to the principle of feeding. But I would just like to understand which then the wheat leavens available on our forum do not belong to French

No, girls, I certainly can be mistaken about the classification according to the principle of feeding. But I would just like to understand which then the wheat leavens available on our forum do not belong to French

What for do you need it?
Maybe I should?
I have been using a French woman for a long time, and now I started a rye, so I have a carriage of time now, I want something new.

Let's wait for the pros!

me - to try the preservation method for wheat sourdough. Moreover, for wheat, as it were, suitable for conservation. And Lyudmila pointed out in her LJ in the last comment to the article about conservation that a French woman does not fall into this category
Sarychevskaya does not suit me. We do not like sour breads or rye breads - at home we use bread without sourness at all. And rye is so in general - a couple of times a year

I'm sorry to throw away the flour, I'm greedy, and self-leavening dough does not fully satisfy our tastes.
I have French now, so I tried the conservation method exactly one day before the last comment appeared in LJ on this topic
now I'm experimenting. I have a couple of weeks ahead - if something goes wrong, I will put one more leaven on the young moon
PySy wwwika, can we switch to "you"?

No misters!!!!
On the contrary, I wanted to switch to rye. My white people began to eat poorly.
Well, except that the son sometimes asks for Italian from Admin
And rye can be converted into wheat. True, you need 2-3 feeding-transition.
I can't preserve it, because I can't find 3-6 degrees. Is that a new refrigerator to buy
If you put the starter culture in the refrigerator at 10 degrees for 24 hours, and then transfer it to wheat in 2-3 feeding, then you can just calculate it 2 times a week.

me - to try the preservation method for wheat sourdough. Moreover, for wheat, as it were, suitable for conservation.

Why canning wheat?

Duc I say - the toad strangles me to throw away the flour. I already thought - it seems that during the year there runs up to 30-50 UAH. But it's still a pity - these UAH 50 still need to be earned! I would also like to have a sweet-spirit-sweet wheat sourdough and not to throw away the flour.
And now it is hot in the apartment, so I had to feed the sourdough 3 times a day - to throw out 100-150 g of flour a day!

wwwika, and why in the refrigerator 10 * (in this it is possible to keep a French woman, in principle, probably) in general in refrigerators 5-6 * like

and the wheat, overfed from rye, did not impress me at all. I tried both the ISS and rye p / fabrikat so translate
It's somehow easier for me to grow French (because I still had a desire to try raisins, then I stopped something) - not a translation, the most purebred wheat

My refrigerator does not hold well, old!

How often do you bake?

I bake 2, maximum 3 times a week
Last year I absolutely calmly put up with production waste. And in this the flour has risen in price, and something is SO straight the toad strangled

[rinishek]

rinishek

I feed my Frenchwoman no more than once a day, or even less often ... this is our schedule.

I keep it on the windowsill in the kitchen with a window ajar. The usual proportions are the remains of the old sourdough on the walls of the jar + 100 g of water + 100 g of flour in a half-liter jar. As soon as the starter culture after feeding begins to prop up the lid, I mix the contents thoroughly. She then calmly continues to eat up those parts of the flour that she could not reach. It grows to the lid - I mix it again, it grows again ... but as soon as it stopped growing after mixing, I feed it.

Thus, it significantly reduced the number of "empty" feedings