Help, nothing happens with bread !!! (Ambulance)

Hello! Tell me who can, please. I'm trying to bake pure rye bread with hop sourdough in the oven. The first time it fell off during baking, it was not baked, in general, it was not edible ((((Well, I think the sourdough is young, I did it for three days. Yesterday I baked it again. I took the sourdough at its peak, 5 tbsp. L. I added brewed malt By the way, what should it taste like? I’m not sweet. Dough fermented for 4 hours, went well every two. Ingredients poured over the eye, about half a liter of water, flour - what would a thick dough turn out to be a standing spoon. On the proofer, the dough also came up twice in an hour, the bubbles were on the surface. I put it in the oven, so I turned on the oven and that's it. Immediately set the temperature to 250 degrees, after 15 minutes lowered it to 200. Baked for an hour and a half. In general, when baking. the dough has fallen off, spread into a pancake. It baked better than the first time, but it still crumples when pressed. And there is no taste or smell of tasty. Many write that something did not work out, opal, blurred, but tasty, but I some kind of no, coriander can only be heard.

For sourdough bread, let's go here to ask questions Starter cultures - in questions and answers

Thank you, let's go)))

Hello! Tell me who can, please. I'm trying to bake pure rye bread with hop sourdough in the oven. The first time it fell off during baking, it was not baked, in general, it was not edible ((((Well, I think the sourdough is young, I did it for three days. Yesterday I baked it again. I took the sourdough at its peak, 5 tbsp. L. I added brewed malt By the way, what should it taste like? I’m not sweet. Dough fermented for 4 hours, went well every two. Ingredients poured over the eye, about half a liter of water, flour - what would a thick dough turn out, to a standing spoon. On the proofer, the dough also came up twice in an hour, the bubbles were on the surface. I put it in the oven, so I turned on the oven and that's it. Immediately set the temperature to 250 degrees, after 15 minutes lowered it to 200. Baked for an hour and a half. In general, when baking. the dough has fallen off, spread into a pancake. It baked better than the first time, but it still crumples when pressed. And there is no taste or smell of tasty. Many write that something did not work out, opal, blurred, but tasty, but I some kind of no, only audible coriander.

Pure rye with sourdough is not an easy task. here you need experience and knowledge. read the recipe carefully. master!

Rye hearth bread 100% sourdough "Without Nothing" (oven) (Tumanchik)

Pure rye with sourdough is not an easy task. here you need experience and knowledge. read the recipe carefully. master!
Rye hearth bread 100% sourdough "Without Nothing" (oven)
(Tumanchik)

Thank you! I'll try)

The dough was fermented for 4 hours, it went well every two times.

When baking rye bread, there are some peculiarities, namely rye bread is not upset, but baked once it has risen, well, this is how the classics write. And the rise during proofing is not desirable more than 1.5 times, or even 1.3 times, as you have 2 times this is a lot. The dough should not be liquid, it looks like plasticine for me, that is, not just a spoon stands and hardly interferes, I make it in HP and help the stove with a silicone spatula, otherwise it does not normally knead the dough

When baking rye bread, there are some peculiarities, namely rye bread is not upset, but baked once it has risen, well, this is how the classics write.

Thanks for the answer! I came across such information too, but in all the recipes on the site they raise the dough, then they still defy it. Yes, now I'll try without proofing, thanks)

And the rise during proofing is not desirable more than 1.5 times, or even 1.3 times, as you have 2 times this is a lot.

Thank you, I will take into account how much I have already read the information, but I have not seen this, thanks!

The dough should not be liquid, it looks like plasticine for me, that is, not just a spoon stands and hardly interferes, I make it in HP and help the stove with a silicone spatula, otherwise it does not normally knead the dough

In principle, I also looked like plasticine. But I'll try to knead it better. I was afraid, on the contrary, to add more flour, so that it would not be quite tight. Moreover, I read recipes where the dough turned out to be fluid, and the bread turned out to be good.

It also bothers me that there is neither taste nor smell of rye. The first time I thought that because of the weak leaven, but now the leaven seems to be good, and not even tasty (((

[Svetlana Kravchenko]

Svetlana Kravchenko, raising the dough is not considered raising the dough, one raising after all the ingredients put in, oh, I hope it was clearly expressed And the taste of rye bread also depends on malt, there are non-tasty malts, so if it is possible to smell the malt better when buying, the bread will smell like it ... I use this one, very aromatic.

the rise of the dough is not considered the rise of the dough, one rise after all the ingredients are put, oh, I hope it was clearly expressed.And the taste of rye bread largely depends on malt, there are non-flavorful malts, so if it is possible to smell the malt better when buying, the bread will smell like it. I use this one, very aromatic.

Ah, then everything is correct with me. Once the dough came up to me, and then one proofing and baking. I also ordered malt from an online store, it's dark. Here steamed one smells good, when bread is baked, in the kitchen it also smells like bread, and ready-made bread does not have a pleasant taste or smell

and the finished bread does not have a pleasant taste or smell

strange, I really have an eternal rye sourdough, it gives sourness, and the taste and smell of malt ... The bread is aromatic and tasty. I think you put salt, it is still a taste enhancer, and then suddenly it is salt-free. I don’t know what to think anymore ...

strange, I really have an eternal rye sourdough, it gives sourness, and the taste and smell of malt ... The bread is aromatic and tasty. I think you put salt, it is still an enhancer of taste, and then suddenly it is salt-free. I don’t know what to think anymore ...

I added salt. Is it really bad malt?

[Svetlana Kravchenko]

Svetlana Kravchenko, and can increase the amount of malt, how much do you put it in?

maybe increase the amount of malt, how much do you put in?

a tablespoon, water about 500 ml. The first time I put a few spoons, it's still bad.

[Svetlana Kravchenko]

Svetlana Kravchenko, I have 50g of malt in one of the recipes, I brew in a coffee cup, that is, with a small amount of boiling water, I put spices there, my husband loves cumin and coriander, a teaspoon each and salt with sugar here, I brew everything together. I add the cooled "tea leaves" to the finished dough. I have less water, somewhere around 300ml, sometimes when I have whey, I do everything by eye, so I won't say the exact amount of flour, since much depends on flour. By the way, I don’t like Kudesnitsa flour, it’s not tasty bread lately, I think I’m buying Limak or Altai flour.

I have 50g of malt in one of the recipes, I brew it in a coffee cup, that is, with a small amount of boiling water, I put spices there, my husband loves cumin and coriander, a teaspoon each and salt with sugar here, I brew everything together.I add the cooled "tea leaves" to the finished dough. I have less water, somewhere around 300ml, sometimes when I have whey, I do everything by eye, so I won't say the exact amount of flour, since much depends on flour. By the way, I don’t like Kudesnitsa flour, it’s not tasty bread lately, I think I’m buying Limak or Altai flour.

Thanks, I will experiment)))

[Mandraik Ludmila]

Mandraik Ludmila, good day! Tell me, what does your malt taste like, sweet? Do you brew malt without flour? I came across information that the malt is sweetish, but mine is not sweet, neither dry, nor steamed with flour or without flour.

[Svetlana Kravchenko]

Svetlana Kravchenko, I have not tasted it, I will try to do it - I will unsubscribe, I brew without flour, but with all the spices and salt with sugar, so that the bucket of HP does not scratch. I bake once a week while there is bread ...

Added Saturday 01 October 2016 04:35 PM

Now I chewed dry - it tasted sour at first, there was no sweetness at all.

[Mandraik Ludmila]

Mandraik Ludmila, good day! Tell me, what does your malt taste like, sweet? Do you brew malt without flour? I came across information that the malt is sweetish, but mine is not sweet, neither dry, nor steamed with flour or without flour.

Making malt at home (Rus)

Wheat germ flour (NataliARH)

And look here for info on malt CONTENT OF THE INGREDIENTS AND ACCESSORIES FOR BREAD SECTION

[Mandraik Ludmila]

Mandraik Ludmila, Thank you!

Added Saturday 01 Oct 2016 05:35 PM

Admin, Thank you! I will study

Girls, help the deer, I broke my whole head.
What's wrong?

Given LG bread maker
Mixtures of poods.
a year and a half ago I was buying pride, everything was ok, any bread rose to the edges of the mold.
now ready to kill myself with a bread maker.
well, that's all.
half form only.
White bread, mixtures, overpowered rises only with yeast of a certain firm and 25 ml more water.
And rye and mustard, well, nothing.
direct somewhere or give advice.
what is that (((I have strategic reserves ... what to do with that.

[Cat in slippers]

Mixtures of poods

the rise of bread depends solely on the strength of the yeast. If your yeast doesn't pick up bread, you need to change it. Look at the weight of your mixture for other strong yeasts.
You mentioned the "strategic reserve", that is, the mixtures lay for a long time. Although, in order to store flour for a long time, it is necessary to create certain temperature conditions for it so that it does not deteriorate. Hope your mixtures are tasty.
But you increased the water in white bread, because during storage the flour became drier. Most likely, the same can be observed in the remaining stock.
This means that you need to observe the bun during kneading in order to adjust the amount of water. And it is necessary to replace the yeast with another, new, strong, by weight mixture.

Added Thursday, 03 Nov 2016 10:13 PM

Cat in slippers, I do not want to upset you in advance. There is the worst case, when the flour is hopelessly spoiled and the bread becomes tasteless and it is also impossible to raise it, because there are changes in the composition of gluten. I hope this is not your case. Try to shove a cafe-moment, or live yeast Lux - they are thermonuclear.

[fffuntic]

fffuntic, thanks for the answer!
Mixes were bought about a month ago.
Manufacturing on the package costs the month of August.
Fast dry yeast, I tried those that come in the package, and everything that I found in the store.
I'm in insane disorder, this is the first time I've done this.

6th kosyachny kolobok (
how to understand that there is not enough water or vice versa?

but does not rise.

Try adding your yeast additionally based on the amount of flour The amount of flour and other ingredients for making bread of various sizes

And adjust the flour-liquid balance. The rise of the dough may also depend on the stiffness of the dough, if there is little liquid, the dough will be tight and will not rise.

[Cat in slippers]

Cat in slippers, yeast and yeast are different. Look for a cafe moment, and with a recent date of manufacture.Second, it would be nice to see the composition of the mixture. If it contains at least 50 percent wheat flour, then the bread should behave like wheat flour.

If you watched the test at every stage in HP, you would understand the reason.

What else can you observe. Perhaps from dry storage, the flour swelling time has increased. Now she does not have enough time to knead in HP. In addition, you have a stove in which the modes are shortened compared to Panasonic or Hitachi.
And the yeast doesn't have enough time to work properly.

So, the first thing to check: the flour should be at room temperature, not lower in any way, not cold. Add warm liquid. In the cold, yeast will dramatically decrease its activity.
Second, you place the yeast according to all the rules: first you mix it with non-cold flour, and only then add some water. Place the quantity of yeast purchased according to their label, dancing from the mass of your mixture. Knead the mixture with yeast using HP, turn off the program, and leave it for half an hour or 40 minutes, let it swell like a human.
Knead so that it is sticky, like a very thick porridge.
Then reactivate your bread maker's program. But before starting the program, we look at the mess. It should already be like dough stickybut soft. If you have poured some water, add a couple of tablespoons of flour. When you start the program, after 10-15 minutes a very pleasant to the touch bun should be dangling in your bucket. Well, just like Admin in the pictures. Neat, soft, delicate, beautiful. With a smooth surface, not like clay. The maximum that is allowed is a beautiful ball, on one side clinging to the wall like a comma. Examine the pictures by kolobok.
It will be clay, with a torn surface - you did not add water. Shapeless, cling to the walls smear bottom - poured.
With a maximum of water, it stops smearing and takes on a beautiful appearance right before the end of the batch. At a minimum - somewhere in 10-15 minutes. Choose according to your taste. But .. it should stop smearing by the end of the batch, and at first there should not be a hard lump dangling over the bucket.
The point is to lengthen your HP cycle and allow the flour to swell properly before further mixing well. Well, yeast will work for half an hour longer. And then you stick your nose in the HP just before baking and watch and sniff. If it has grown normally and smells like alcohol, then you can bake. If this is not observed: it means that either you need to report the yeast another time - which is not very good, or lengthen the fermentation cycle, or add whey to the bread. Sour milk will improve and speed up.
Also .. you can lick your mixture. If it does not have a pleasant sweetish aftertaste, increase the amount of sugar slightly so that the yeast has something to eat and it works harder.
The temperature of the water is also important. On the one hand, it is better for the yeast to work warmer. On the other hand, when kneading, the dough should not be too warm, the machine may tear it. Therefore, choose the middle ground based on the mixing intensity of your stove. With vigorous kneading, your dough should not heat up over 30 degrees.

Look for exactly the cafe moment

After all, yeast is called Saf-moment

Regarding pudof mixtures ... No matter how much I tried to bake them, something edible turned out in 30% of cases ... This is despite the fact that yeast was always used not even saf, but Fermipan, everything rises on them many times better than on the saf. With the selection of quantity, water, and control of the kolobok ... There is no sense. Mixtures are not consistent in quality. I didn't play with them for long and forgot about their existence. As they were unsuccessful from the very beginning, so, apparently, they remained.

Here they correctly wrote about flour drying. Now they heat, the apartments are much drier, so more water may be needed.

Try to bake your usual simple recipe from a book with your yeast. To check the operation of the oven and the quality of the batch.

p.s. find on the forum the recipe for Mustard bread from Mumla. She recalculated the recipe in accordance with GOST. The taste is amazing. Mustard oil is available. You will really feel the difference with the boxed one.

[Mams]

Thank you for not leaving me in my trouble)))
For a long time I did not use Pudov, but then the inner hamster decided to make supplies for the winter.
I really liked their Borodinsky with raisins. But apparently a lot has changed since then.

I have an accelerated mode in the stove for 1.5 hours and he is a Russian cook 3.30. It is not enough?

Added on Friday 04 Nov 2016 00:06

Mams, white bread is excellent, and from poods too.
But with rye Moscow and Borodino ambush.

[no]

But with rye Moscow and Borodino ambush.

well, rye bread contains less gluten. There gluten is only from the addition of wheat flour, and it rises on it. But such a level as in white bread cannot be obtained in principle.
One should know the level of wheat flour in rye mixtures. If it is at least 50 percent, then I wrote above how you can act.
But if there is not enough of it, then you need to mix it in a very special way.
If the mixture is very rye, then you must adhere to the rules for kneading rye bread in a bread maker. You can't, on the contrary, mix.
The only thing I would have left is to hold the mixed mixture for a longer time, so that the addition of gluten in the mixture swells for a long time before kneading. Suddenly she was dry and that's the problem.
Then I would add yeast and run the program.
Here in detail for completely rye bread is
https://Mcooker-enn.tomathouse.com/in...ion=com_smf&topic=72478.0

and especially pay attention to the addition of dry gluten improver.
That is, you will have to improve this mixture, and at each stage follow the hp, as indicated in the topic.

Added on Friday 04 Nov 2016 00:40

Yes .. and more. In fact, when rye breads are baked, they choose a program in which no intermediate workouts. After you have set it to rise once after adding yeast, you can no longer touch the dough until the baking itself.
You so program?

[fffuntic]

fffuntic, yes, I also thought about it now.
I'll go look for instructions. I now have a question for myself how I did it before. ))))
I bake everything in the main mode.
and for a rye in a Russian cook, there is a mark for rye.

[White]

white bread is excellent, and from poods too.

White and without pounds it turns out great. Honestly So, the baking mode was chosen incorrectly. I don't like short cycles at all, and for these mixtures they will not work for sure. The standard mode is needed here.

I dug up the instructions yesterday.

All modes come with 2 or 3 rises.
Even the dough mode goes the same way 2 rises of the kolobok.

And I also bought a pound of Black bread, and it rose perfectly, not like white (white flush with the form) a couple of cm lower but already a loaf.
But I decided to pour more water there and it turns out that instead of 290 I poured 340.
Such dances ((((

And I also bought a pound of Black bread, and it rose perfectly, not like white (white flush with the shape) a couple of cm lower but already a loaf.
But I decided to pour more water there and it turns out that instead of 290 I poured 340.
Such dances ((((

miracles do not happen. If the bread is really black, that is, with a minimum of added gluten, which stretches and gives a beautiful fluffy frame, then the second crush will kill the bread. This means that these mixtures have a large percentage of wheat flour, or at worst just gluten.
If there is a desire to bake a truly black bread on your own, and not from a mixture, you will have to make sure that there are no flips.
Judging by previous experience, Borodino bread turned out to be more critical, apparently there is less wheat gluten there.

Dancing with water should be taken as normal. Flour is differently dry at different times of the year and in different storage locations in the apartment.

[fffuntic]

fffuntic, yes, I want this bread.

How then to be with hp, if it gives out 2 or 3 crunches in all modes? (

Peace be with you bakers!

Miss

How then to be with hp, if it gives out 2 or 3 crunches in all modes? (

immediately after kneading it is necessary to pull out the spatula from under the dough. Then the machine will have nothing to beat

Peace be with you bakers!

and more delicious bread

Good evening. Maybe you can help, I want to figure out why my bread is not high. Ingredients: Water 270 ml, 200 g rye flour + 200 g. wheat, yeast 1.5 tsp, salt 1.5 tsp, sugar 1 tbsp. spoon, oil grows. 2 tbsp. spoons. I measure the water with a measuring cup, salt, sugar, yeast with a measuring spoon, weigh the flour. Bookmark order: yeast, flour, salt, sugar, oil, water. Makfa flour, Safmoment yeast. Bread maker Panasonic 2511, rye mode. The height of the bread is 7.5 cm. The girls make it 12 cm. I like the structure and taste very much. I just don't understand why it's low. Here is a photo

The bread in the photo is quite decent, everything is with it

The amount of flour and the recipe for 400 grams of flour is quite optimal for medium-sized bread - small.

Therefore, you need to look at the size of the bottom of the bucket, if it is large, then the amount of dough should be a lot so that the walls of the bucket support it.
If there is not enough dough, then it will spread along the bottom of the bucket and the bread will turn out lower under any conditions.
It's like frying an omelet from one egg in a large frying pan, whatever one may say ... but it turns out a pancake.

Dough made from a mix of wheat and rye flour 50x50 is a borderline option between baking wheat bread (two proofers) and rye (1 proofing) - here you need to select the optimal program by typing in order to guess between these two breads.

Bread with a high content of rye flour will not be very high, up to the top of the bucket is rye flour!

Thanks for your answer, Tatiana. I also agree about the rye flour bucket. It's just interesting that in the same Panasonic the same recipe with rye flour for some reason turns out to be different in height. By the way, his weight is small, 590 gr. turned out. Yes, I really like the bread. It is tasty plump, almost does not crumble. Thanks to Valeria the author for the recipe. (a link to the recipe, as a beginner I can't insert).

[Varvarka]

Varvarka, try substituting a good strong flour from another manufacturer. Perhaps even higher bread will come out. I don't like Makfa in bread at all 👎. In everything else, it is normal, but in bread it is very bad 👎.

Peace be with you bakers!
Makfa she is not understood
then everything is in order, then it does not rise
I stopped taking it due to unpredictability

Although in fairness - if a good one is caught - a loaf of sore eyes comes out

stopped taking it due to unpredictability

It is for this reason that I have not bought MacFa for 6 years. From the word at all.

I have a very good relationship with McFa, I bake bread only on her. With other flour, the result is much worse. If I bake with the addition of rye, then I put more yeast, because rye flour rises hard.

Thank you all for the advice, I will try to replace MacFa with Predportovaya. I already baked on it, but the portion was increased, it rose well. But you need to compare the original portion.

[yeast 1.5 tsp]

Why didn't anyone pay attention to

Ingredients: Water 270 ml, 200 g rye flour + 200 g. wheat, yeast 1.5 tspspoons,. Bread maker Panasonic 2511, rye mode.

Firstly, it would make sense to first find out how they bake bread of this composition from the owners of Panasonic in the subject of Panasonic.
Panasonic's rye regime is initially very short, no more than 1.5 hours are given for the rise. It is a very specific mode, it is hardly possible to get high bread on it, whether there will be makfa or not makfa in the form of flour.
I dare to assume that what program they chose - they got it.
It makes sense, again, go to the Panasonic topic and find out exactly how the bread was baked by those who got it in 12 cm.

Added Wednesday 16 Nov 2016 05:59

The bread contains 50 percent wheat flour, which allows it to be baked on longer basic modes of Panasonic. And adding rye flour may require more yeast. Although it turns out tasty, I personally am against such a measure.It is better to change the baking mode by increasing the rise time on the appropriate setting.

Added Wednesday 16 Nov 2016 06:14 AM

It's just interesting that in the same Panasonic the same recipe with rye flour for some reason turns out to be different in height.

because the strength of wheat flour is responsible for the height of the bread in this recipe, the gluten of which gives height, well, the yeast that raises this very gluten.
Different yeast, fresh from an unopened pack or stale, of a different brand, unevenly collected in a measuring spoon, and for yeast and fractions of a gram are critical in small bread, then dry or wet flour, fresh or stale, of different strength from different purchases will give different koloboks, and then bread.
Rye flour is also constantly uneven, roughly speaking in terms of the "weakening" power. The flour is not even the same immediately after purchase or after two months.

[fffuntic]

fffuntic, when bread does not work, you do not need to go to the topic of profile HP, you need to go here: girl-yes: Otherwise, I completely agree. Actually, Admin above wrote the same as you
Well, as for me, the normal size of the bread. I sometimes get even lower from 500g of flour

[fffuntic]

fffuntic, when bread does not work, you do not need to go to the topic of profile HP, you need to go here: girl-yes: Otherwise, I completely agree. Actually, Admin above wrote the same as you
Well, as for me, the normal size of the bread. I sometimes get even lower from 500g of flour

As the owner of just Panasonic, I know for sure that my stove has a big difference from others, and the topic of the owners of Panasonic is very friendly, I remember that the girls there half-brown bread discussed in great detail about the peculiarities of baking them in our oven.
Tatiana - Admin should not learn the modes of Panasonic. It seems to me that it makes sense to load it with problems when the question is fully clarified in relation to your technique, but nothing happens. And here Tatiana is alone, and there are a lot of us
The girl wants to get different options - so let her ask those who have already mastered these options.

Added Wednesday 16 Nov 2016 06:55 AM

Peace be with you bakers!
Makfa she is not understood
then everything is in order, then it does not rise
I stopped taking it due to unpredictability

Although in fairness - if a good one is caught - a loaf of sore eyes comes out

Makfa is rarely "bad" at all. But at times she behaves "badly" in xn. But in reality it only means that she requires additional time for swelling before main kneading. I do not want to attribute the authorship of this discovery to myself. This was noticed and taught how to cope by the wonderful Luda-Marianna-Aga.
In this regard, it is good for the owners of Hitachi, their smart stove itself gives a long pause for swelling for any flour. For them, any tricks of flour are not terrible.
And in other CPs, it makes sense to quickly knead the dough, then let it stand for half an hour to an hour to swell in the cool, and only then start the program for a full cycle with good kneading.
This measure helps me to cope. Maybe you will like it.

[fffuntic]

fffuntic, no need to be so (so?) categorical to everyone
If there was no answer, I could have sent the author of the question to Panasonic, but we figured it out here.
Let the moderator decide how to behave in this topic

fffuntic, and put in your profile your male or female gender, it is difficult to determine by posts which category you belong to: M or F

Good evening! Send it to the address or tell me about rye bread ... Here in white you focus on "bun and lobe", and in rye how to clearly determine whether there is enough water / flour?

If the dough with the content of rye flour is less than 50%, then the dough is like wheat. If more than 50%, then a little smears along the bottom of the bucket when kneading.

Good evening! Send to the address or tell me about rye bread ... Here in white you are guided by "kolobok and lobe", and in rye how to clearly determine whether there is enough water / flour?

We go to the section CONTENTS OF THE SECTION "BASICS OF KNEADING AND BAKING"

And we look at the topics MASTER CLASSES on KNITTING Dough (BOLS), including about pure wheat bread and wheat-rye bread - all the answers to questions are there, with pictures

I kind of realized
And the question crept in, suddenly tell me ...
In England, dark bread is sold all so fatty (the package is fatty from it) and porous ... are there any recipes for such breads here?