Old Como bread (Pane di Como Antico) in the oven

Cheese

Class!

and if instead of bigi take ready-made sourdough? ..
nobody tried it?

and if instead of bigi take ready-made sourdough,

then it will be a different bread.

[Idol32!]

I brought you my bread to treat yourself ...
The bread is wonderful - what my family loves!
Thank you, Idol32!





The dough was a little watery and difficult to work with, but the result was worth it !!!

Good bread turned out! And the dough is liquid, although not obedient, but the bread comes out of it simply excellent! Congratulations!

and if instead of bigi take ready-made sourdough? ..
nobody tried it?

You can take the sourdough, the Italians in this case would say that this is bread made from biga natural. Only the proving time, I think, needs to be increased, since the lifting force of wild yeast is significantly lower than commercial yeast.

You can take the sourdough, the Italians in this case would say that this is bread made from biga natural. Only the proving time, I think, needs to be increased, since the lifting power of wild yeast is significantly lower than the commercial one.

amount of leaven = amount of bigi? Or will it be necessary to count the amount of water-flour?

Yes, the same, biga = leaven. The only thing you may need to count the water depending on the moisture content of your starter.

I wrote and thought that it was not so simple. I wrote "sourdough" meaning a big made not with commercial yeast but with natural sourdough. Usually they take about 30g of sourdough (starter), flour, water and knead a natural biga which is put to ferment, but not as long as a bigu on pressed (Italians say "beer") yeast. As a result, they get a biga natural in the same volume as the usual biga in this recipe. How much starter you need for a natural biga you yourself will have to calculate, depending on the nature of your starter and the fermentation time of your biga natural. Here.

yeah, I see)) right now I have rye and lactic acid wheat sourdough ...
We will try

rose a little, and there are few holes .. 2 sad bars turned out
it looks like the dough still needs to stand even longer (I increased the standing and proofing time by an hour)

Is it wild or commercial yeast? If they are wild, then the time probably needs to be increased three times ...

the wildest
to increase the time of both holding and proofing by 3 times?

I'm afraid so ... But it's better to check it empirically. The preliminary proofing should be done until the dough has increased by three. Then rest 20 minutes after molding (like in the recipe). And the final proofing - until the workpiece doubles. Plus, the length of the final proofing must be checked by pressing on the workpiece with your finger and watching how quickly the dent from the finger disappears (does it disappear?). Or in a rustic way with a piece of dough in a glass of water - as it floats up, then it's time to put it in the oven.

I understand that it will most likely take a long time. But this is wild yeast ... Therefore, it was cultured and bred so that it would work like an established one and raise the bread very quickly and loosen the crumb ...

well, that is, an option - knead in the morning and bake it under the night ... or knead in the evening, mold it at night and bake in the morning ..
we will try)) otherwise the home ones want Italian bread to be without yeast

[Lydia]

Lydia, why don't you like holes? If you compare with the pictures on the previous page (not Vikin's cheese), then you have even more perforated. It seems to me that everything is fine, it can really give more proofing, but focus on increasing the workpieces, and not on time.

[Vasilika]

Vasilika her ...holes here should be larger)))) 2-3 times ...
otherwise why have fun with batter?

And another request to you, Lydia, please write down what sourdough you took, what flour-water ratio, very interesting. I also mainly bake with sourdough, but more often rye, I have been looking at such "Italian" for a long time, but I have not decided yet, and your experience gives hope

I took lacto-sour on tsz wheat flour. 50 g of starter and everything else as according to the recipe (well, except for yeast) in the evening started. kneaded the dough in the afternoon

and by the way, the dough that is not ready is baked very hard ... for a long time ..

Thank you!

... otherwise the homemade people want Italian bread to be without yeast

You can't do it without yeast. It is a great misconception to consider leaven as a yeast-free product. Its acidity, of course, is greater because there are enough lactic acid bacteria in it, but otherwise it is the same yeast! If you want without them, you will have to bake on a baking powder.

meant "without adding pressed, dry, etc. yeast"))

I want to try baking this bread ...
How to measure this amount of compressed yeast? You wrote that it is about a pea?
And if you bake a full portion, as in the recipe, will 2 such bread fit in a regular oven?
And one more question, about the biga ... In what size dish is it better to keep it, I did not understand how many times it should grow (say, in 48 hours)? Is a plastic decanter per liter suitable or too small?

Another thing about the scales .. We bought the scales for my father-in-law in the extreme market, he is fond of the numismatist. There is a little shop where they sell all these things. Now I understand that I need these too!

And I also wanted to say about the crust ... My French friend says that the crust in bread is the tastiest, and when I visited him, he bought fresh baguettes with the addition of malt, cut them lengthwise, pulled out the crumb and ate only typical French crusts behavior! And I love both the crumb and the crust.

And we have no problems with storing bread, everything that I bake in 2 days is swept away and treats my parents, grandmother ... In general, we need to eat fresh bread and share with friends and relatives

1. Measure out 1g of yeast and then take half. There will be 0.5g. I roll 1g into a sausage in my hand and take half of it.
2. These are the loaves in the photo and were baked simultaneously in a standard oven on one stone (not two floors). So of course you can bake them all at once and on the same level.
3. Biga in the first day (not even a day, but the first 12 hours) grows three to four times. I use a container with a 3 liter lid.

The Frenchman is obviously a miserable person, accustomed to bread baked using an accelerated technology (without long fermentation). Therefore, he actively does not like the crumb. Give it a taste of your Como. Hopefully after that he will change his mind about bread.

Thanks for the quick answers

I have not seen the Frenchman for a long time, for about 5 years, we communicate by phone. So he will have to continue to suffer with crumb)))

Igor, baked some bread. I liked the taste very much, thanks Biga stood for 60 hours in the kitchen, should I have put it in the refrigerator or not? I kneaded the dough on the dumplings mode for 20 minutes, (maybe mixed) in the same place and let it stand, that is, I did not roll it into a ball and did not put it in a greased bowl. So it is possible, is it on principle? When I put it in towels for proofing, the dough was fluffy and bubbly, I poked it with my fingers properly (diligently)
Maybe too much? Now I re-read the recipe, you are writing

Press the dough lightly with your fingers so that it sinks slightly.

She baked in 2 cast-iron pans, barely placed bread on them. There is no stone, but I didn't want to be on the baking sheet. Baked with convection in 25 minutes. I checked the temperature with a thermometer - 94 C.

Now biga stood in the kitchen for a day and put it in the refrigerator. I will bake again, I will not poke my fingers, I will only slightly press down
Criticism is welcome.

Good bread! Of course it is necessary to roll up. The crumb is formed correct and all that, but if it comes out well without it, then do so.It is necessary to press down, otherwise the bread will grow less then, so we did everything right. Good luck and delicious bread!

Igor, this is my laziness and lack of time. I will roll it up, since this is correct. And how to roll it into a cylinder for proofing, to spare air bubbles? I didn't even think about it before, it's a whole science to knead bread correctly

I know you have many books on baking. I have a question for you. How does fermentation of bigi in the refrigerator and at room temperature affect the taste of bread? Rather, the difference in taste. The process is different for different authors. So I'm wondering where it is better to keep the big before use.

I fell in love with your recipes. I am a beginner baker, but ALL of 4 recipes turned out !!! Ciabatta with regular big holes, just slightly modify the taste. I sin on yeast. The baguette is incomparable. I made half the portion, could not resist and ate almost entirely one of the two bars. With olives ... Just a song! Today I baked this one. To say that I am delighted is to say nothing.
We are waiting for new recipes. )))

Maybe someone will come in handy. I was once advised how to measure 1 g of dry yeast without scales. A regular syringe is taken from the pharmacy, the nozzle is cut off and the required amount of yeast is poured, that is, 1 ml is equal to approx. 1 gram of yeast.