Sourdough bread in the oven

Can I, can I (reach out)
Here's what I got

[suslja5004]

Oh, and you have it so smooth and smooth suslja5004, if I'm not mistaken wheat-rye? What is the recipe?

But according to this recipe, "There was 400 g of sourdough, 50 g. I left it for divorce, and I threw 350 g in a bucket, then 120 g. Flour, 80 ml. Water there (it was just all filtered, boiled, but I didn't want to filter , boil ....) 1.5 tsp salt, 1 tbsp. flaxseed oil, and I forgot sugar. Kneaded in HP, baked in the oven. The dough was sticky porridge, I don't have a scraper, I worked with a plastic spatula, put it on flank and forward "added only more flour.
Flour of 2 grades and sourdough on it. And wheat-rye like this



I did it in HP, the roof failed a little, but it tasted ...

Here's a cutaway


Today we have a fine-pored Delicious!

[kava]

kava
And write down the sequence of actions: what recipe, what and how much, how and in what it was baked, where and at what temperature it was baked. I stubbornly get the impression that your bread is "squeezed" a little, either when proving there is not enough space, or when baking, or you are molding it too tightly.

Sourdough pies are also very tasty, soft, without sourness.

Yes, I am already convinced once again that sourdough baked goods do not give sourness. The same sourdough buns ... there was no time to stand by the dough, so I collected all the products in a bucket, replaced about 100 g of flour and 100 g of liquid with sourdough, added a little less than half of the yeast norm, kneaded for a couple of minutes on Pizza to make sure the flour-liquid ratio was correct, switched to dough and left. After 2 and a half hours, I found a remarkably risen dough at home.
Something I have recently become lazy to take photos ... and so, according to the same principle, I get a wonderful pizza dough, for "donut focaccia" ... by the way, I can show focaccia a la "donut", on it I can laziness has not yet struck down completely and irrevocably

I found along the way a photo of French bread, which I put in a special basket, and baked on a stone:

Zest, what beauty is that, huh? Do not be lazy, upload photos, upload. The same guide "How it should be"
And in New York, I also thought to throw in sourdough, well, how could it be without her, my dear ... I really can't imagine bread without her.
I just didn’t understand how the molding takes place, none of the links came back.

[suslja5004]

suslja5004

Add the sourdough calmly, but if you want to leave the dough unattended for longer than 8 hours, then no more than 2-3 ordinary tablespoons. Do not remove yeast from the recipe.

Pour the dough onto a chopping board, thickly sprinkled with flour, try to lay it down in a strip, sprinkle flour on top again. Hands - also in flour. Then expand this strip a little and stretch it with a scraper, fold the edges towards the center in three times, gently stretch the resulting roller again in the direction of the twisted ends, fold it in three again. In the resulting roller, bend the tips and give the appearance of a ball. For proofing, I left it in a salad bowl covered with baking bouamga, so that later it could be transferred to a wok without any problems. It seems that I have not forgotten anything If I have not confused it even more with the molding

Here's a riddle for me - "fold the edges towards the center threefold," well, I will not drive in. And can you put it right in a baking dish? And then I have a problem with the baskets. There is nothing suitable.

[suslja5004]

suslja5004

try to open this link. There you can see the way of folding and proofing in a towel.I would not let it sit in a baking dish; after proofing, the dough must be transplanted into a hot container so that it immediately "explodes" and swells from the temperature drop.



And there is no need for a proofing basket, you can safely cover the salad bowl with baking paper and let it stand in it.

Thank you. I looked.
And my salad bowls are not round, and if they fit in shape, then they are small. While I fitted the lid from the breadbox, it was just a hemisphere. but the handle is in the way. In general, I get along like that
But in the video, the bread was put into a red-hot mold, but it was not smeared with anything, is it because of the bran?

I have reviewed more than one video on this bread, there the forms are sometimes greased, sometimes they are not greased. In fact, due to the sharp temperature drop, the crust is instantly baked and does not have time to stick to anything. But I never risked it, I preferred to transplant it on baking paper, and if I just flop into a wok or cauldron, I still put the paper on the bottom.

[kava]

kava
And write down the sequence of actions: what recipe, what and how much, how and in what it was baked, where and at what temperature it was baked. I stubbornly get the impression that your bread is "squeezed" a little, either when proving there is not enough space, or when baking, or you are molding it too tightly.

Zest, did everything by eye. Fresh yeast - 6 g, water - 260 ml, flour - about 500 g, 1 tbsp. l. sugar, 1 tsp. salt, 1 tbsp. l. sunflower oil, starter culture approx. 150 g. Knead everything in a bread maker on the "Dough" mode (1 h. 30 min.) I took it out, kneaded it on the table (the dough was a little sticky, added a little flour, but not a lot), formed a loaf, transferred it to parchment and put it in glass form and tightened on top with a film, so as not to wind. About an hour later, the dough grew to the top. During this time, she warmed up the gosyatnitsa in the oven. I quickly transferred the dough piece along with the paper to the gosyatnitsa, tried to cut (the dough was pulled behind the blade), covered it with a lid and for 15 minutes at maximum (220C). Then I took off the lid and another 35-40 minutes

Zest, your "Frenchman" killed me outright. I myself really wanted this. Can I have a link to the recipe?

[kava]

kava

Well, here's the most common mistake that their baker's legs are growing. We want to get a classic bun, add flour ... and the bread dough for the oven should be much more liquid than we are used to with a bread maker. Look at page 1 - I practically pour out the dough for molding. Your bread is running low on liquid. If we take the flour-water ratio, then I would also add about 65 g of water to your dough.
It is necessary to learn how to fold the dough before molding, in this case the gluten is stretched, the workpiece keeps its shape and, when cut, bursts like a ripe watermelon, and does not reach for a knife, despite its moisture content. You can't show it on your fingers here, you have to go to youtube and watch videos on working with wet dough.
The initial temperature is also low ... but there's nothing you can do about it, if the oven is like that, you will have to do everything perfectly otherwise.

Sorry that I arranged such a "debriefing" for you, but I really want your bread to be beautiful

Zest, your "Frenchman" killed me outright. I myself really wanted this. Can I have a link to the recipe?

Hi, I like it myself, although I'm rarely completely satisfied with something: D Sometimes I miss the shape of the loaves, but heating the stone in the oven does not always raise my hand, it takes about an hour to heat the electric oven

I can't give a link to the recipe, this is from Ludmila's LiveJournal, but now the old links do not open in it.
Let's try this. This bread went under the name Pain au levain naturel. I have the recipe in the saved file. Here is the text itself:

Recipe

For two oval or round hearth breads, 420-450g each (pain boulot with several diagonal, two central overlapping or one straight cut along the length, boule, pain fendu). Contains 1.9% rye flour.



Dough: 38g sourdough (25g flour), 52g wheat flour, 4g rye flour, 32g water.6-8 hours at 25C, 3.5 times in volume.

Dough: 493g wheat flour, 7g rye flour, 1g yeast, 11g salt, 325g water, whole dough. Flour with water 4 minutes on the 1st, 20 minutes of swelling, 5 minutes of kneading on the 2nd.

Fermentation 1h 20min; select a piece of "sourdough" dough for dough for tomorrow's bread. Preliminary proofing 30 min. Final proofing 2.5 hours upside down in baskets or seam bottom in burlap. Cut except for fendu.

Steam oven or lid oven, 40min at 465F. R. Calvel 1994
And if you want with a photo and with all the explanatory notes, I can send a file to your email

Dough: 38g sourdough (25g flour) - how much flour should be in the sourdough?

Thank you very much, Zest.
I completely forgot everything with Easter cakes. I also have a whole daddy with Lyudmila's recipes. I have long wanted to start them, and forgot
Now I will look for this recipe. If suddenly I do not find, then I will ask the club for help.

Dough: 38g sourdough (25g flour) - how much flour should be in the sourdough?

It is exactly 25 g of flour that should be in the sourdough. 25 g flour + 13 g water, this is a dough leaven. Since I have a French woman in which flour-water is 50% to 50%, I take 50 g of sourdough (it contains 25 g of flour), but I take 12 g of water from the water in the recipe. Although, in comparison with the difference in the quality and moisture of flour, this is all sooo relative

Zest, I used to ask a question about French bread, I will ask again. It says 38g of leaven (25g of flour), - 25 is the flour content in the leaven? and - 52g of wheat flour, 4g of rye flour, 32g of water - you can immediately replace it with 88g of sourdough. So?

Zest, I used to ask a question about French bread, I'll ask again. It says 38g of leaven (25g of flour), - 25 is the flour content in the leaven? and - 52g of wheat flour, 4g of rye flour, 32g of water - you can immediately replace it with 88g of sourdough. So?

like I already answered this question ...

Dough: 38g sourdough (25g flour), 52g wheat flour, 4g rye flour, 32g water. 6-8 hours at 25C, 3.5 times in volume.
Yes, 25 g is the flour content of the sourdough. If you feed a 100% sourdough, in which half the flour and half the water, then the sourdough must be taken 50 g. It is imperative to introduce the required amount of flour in the sourdough into the dough. At the same time, we got "extra" 12 g of water.

Be sure to separately add the required 52 g of just flour, not from sourdough. We make only one change. We take not 38, but 50 g of sourdough.

Dough is the first stage. After it has matured, knead the dough.

Dough: 493g wheat flour, 7g rye flour, 1g yeast, 11g salt, 325g water, whole dough. Flour with water 4 minutes on the 1st, 20 minutes of swelling, 5 minutes of kneading on the 2nd.

When kneading the dough, we subtract the excess water that was sorted out in the dough, that is, we take not 325 g, but 313 g.

Is it clear now?

Zest, I'm wildly sorry. Indeed, you answered, but I leafed through and did not notice. Thank you, everything is clear, I basically thought so, but nevertheless I decided to clarify again so that there would be no punctures. Where did you get the baking stone?

I decided to make another experiment in "pictures", maybe it will make it easier to work on mistakes

This is how the dough looked during the kneading process.


This is after an hour of proofing


As a result, such a dough mass came out.


Which I raked (trying to pull) with inhuman efforts into such something


This is 15 minutes from the start of baking, after removing the lid


And this is my result today.


Seems better already?

[kava]

kava

you remind me of someone in your obstinacy. Seems like me

Almost perfect With the dough - complete order. There is just a little more work to be done on molding ... now I will try to find a video for you, which clearly shows how to mold and stretch loaves from wet dough.

here is a smart girl)) I decided to go to the bitter end and not give up.

kava, this is a completely different matter, well done, what kind of dough, my hands were combed straight, so I wanted it with a scraper, a scraper

Now I myself am looking at the dough and I cannot understand - why are you collecting it into a mold with inhuman efforts? After all, it is such, that you have it that it itself asks to a handful

And in a cut, please show your handsome

[Zest]

Oh girls, thanks for the moral support! Zest, I have some kind of sticky (in the sense of dough). I dipped my hands first in flour, then in butter, but it stretches and sticks.Already I helped with a scraper (but I have it small, I see a new purchase is ripe) As soon as I start to fold it and pull it, it strives to crawl back.
Kseny, now it will cool down - I will cut it

[kava]

kava

nothing is sticky with you. Just as it should be. It is just difficult to mold it with bare hands, it must be lifted with a scraper, with a scraper.

I put the video somewhere ... in such a prominent place that I can't find it ... or it's saved in my second computer ...
Now I'll look there.

[kava]

kava

Yeah, look here, how cleverly the aunt copes with your test, literally two coups and not even a trace of stickiness remains.
Slightly lower on the same page, there is another video on the technique of incisions.

🔗

Yes! Auntie - well done! Well, nothing, we'll catch up with her. I kind of already understood the principle Here's a cutaway

Already half of it has been reduced Such a crisp-crispy crust !!!

[kava]

kava, what a tall wonderful bread, and the cut is simply wonderful.
I also baked the first bread with young leaven yesterday. It turned out to be two small loafs. It seems to me that my dough has stood a little while proving, a slight sourness is felt, although the cuts were done well. Next time I will try to shorten the rest time after the first batch and the proving time and bake with one loaf.
Yes, and also, I have baking paper tightly baked to the bottom crust.

It seems like I raised my Frenchwoman, converted her into a thick form and what to do next? How to store it until the next bake. I read it, can't it be in the refrigerator? Although I have a shelf with +10. In general, my poor wretch has been in the bank at the window for a day and I don't know what to do with it

[Yuliki]

Yuliki

I am very sorry that you tell us very little about what and how you bake. I would like to pinch off a little from your experience
Joy

well, here)) And you worried yesterday. Everything turned out great! Beautiful, neat, well shaped and notched pictures!

With a "Frenchwoman" you need an eye and an eye. She is naturally strong and active. Rest and proofing times indicated in many recipes. it is necessary to mercilessly reduce, otherwise the bread will hopelessly stop. Then you will adjust to it. And as the first bread with a new sourdough - just a role model

Buy a different paper for baking, better quality. This stage has already passed. As soon as I take it a little cheaper, it will surely be welded, and good quality quietly lags behind the sole.

The cuts are gorgeous ... but I still can't, and I seem to be digging deeper, as Viki advised, and in no way

The surface should be well stretched, then they walk easily and open well. In addition, there should be more space in the baking cauldron than in the proofing basket (salad bowl, etc.), so that when transplanted into a red-hot cauldron, the bread immediately "swells", and the cuts diverge so pretty.

Zest, thanks for the answer. Did you mean that you need to put it back into a liquid state? 10g sourdough + 200 g water + 200 g flour? And then, before baking, do we feed in what ratio? and for how long after that do we leave to wander? And I tried to bake, just not very successfully. At the weekend there was no access to Ying-tu to see the recipe: without our website - as without hands!

Zest, thanks for the answer. Did you mean that you need to put it back into a liquid state? 10g sourdough + 200 g water + 200 g flour? And then, before baking, do we feed in what ratio? and for how long after that do we leave to wander? And I tried to bake, just not very successfully. At the weekend there was no access to Ying-tu to see the recipe: without our website - as without hands!

Store in a liquid or thick state - it's up to you, whichever you like best. It is better stored in a thick state, but liquid is easier to feed and use. But with +10, the storage problem disappears
If you decide to store it in a thick form, then the approximate proportions are:
25 g of sourdough per 100 g of flour and 60 g of water, knead the dough, keep it for about 1 hour at room temperature and send it for storage.Such proportions are enough for about three days. To store longer without feeding, increase the proportion.
You can use the leaven at any time during these three days. Get either all or part, feed 1 to 1, or until the amount of sourdough you need, let it ripen (the time will depend on the strength of the sourdough, and on its amount, and on the proportion, and on the temperature), but about 4 hours, I'm guided up to the peak, and use.

Throw away the leaven that has not been used in three days, it is no longer suitable for baking, taking a small portion from it for reproduction.

And then, in terms of proportions, you need to determine yourself, depending on the strength of the leaven, the frequency of baking, the required quantities of leaven. It will all depend only on your needs.

P.S. proportion is the ratio of the weight of the leaven to a portion of fresh dough, 1 to 20 is 1 part of the leaven to 20 parts of the new dough, that is, if you take 10 g of leaven, then add 100 g of water and 100 g of flour.
If so, as you wrote, then it will already be 1 in 40. I immediately remember school problems))
Don't worry, feed it a couple of times, then you will determine by eye what and how much to add to keep for three days or a whole week))

[Zest, Yuliki,]

Zest, Yuliki, Thank you so much.
Zest, of course I was worried. Thank you very much for your advice and support. Next time I will count the recipe for 2/3 loaf, so as not to divide the dough.
I have German baking paper, it is brown, and this white one is Polish. To be honest, I didn't even think that this could be.

and I had everything Polish, only the white didn't stick, but when I bought the brown one, just have time to add it.
Today, due to the lack of paper, I made rye mold. Om-Nom-nom.

Girls, I, puzzled by the stuck paper, decided to ventilate this question. Here's what I found -
🔗
🔗
🔗
Has anyone used this or heard anything?

Girls, I, puzzled by the stuck paper, decided to ventilate this question.

Very comfortable fabric 🔗... You can cut as your heart desires. I have been using it for almost 2 years

Very comfortable fabric 🔗... You can cut as your heart desires. I have been using it for almost 2 years

2 years with the same piece of fabric?
Leska, tell me, please, what is the thickness of this fabric, if it is laid out in a cauldron, there will be thick folds?

[Joy]

Joy

I looked at your links, then it's already steep, not paper. Now I use ordinary Polish parchment for baking Horeca, it lags well behind the bottom of the bread. I buy in the Metro.

Freken Bock paper (white!) Never let me down, but the gray paper did.

Freken Bock paper (white!) Never let me down, but the gray paper did.

Yeah, no problem too. But she's a little narrower than Horeca, and I have all large-sized houses

2 years with the same piece of fabric?
Please tell me what is the thickness of this fabric, if it is laid out in a cauldron, there will be thick folds?

The joy depends on how often you use it. For example, cut fabric for baking trays has been in working order for almost a year (bun pies once or twice a week), for Napoleon cakes - from the moment of cutting (I rarely do it), for a multicooker, a round one is cut out - almost every day at work (baking or if the meat is in with a bone - so as not to scratch the bottom) - I have definitely not changed it for a year.
The fabric is as thick as parchment paper, there will be folds, but small.
In a skillet for clarity:


And one more thing: the width of the fabric is 1 meter, the length is as required. So from this piece a skirt can be bungled

The right starter culture is one that is well fed and not refrigerated. Storing in the refrigerator is death for lactic acid bacteria, which means you won't get any aroma.

Zest, but what if I use sourdough very rarely - once a week - at two, because I'm still at the beginning of the journey and before baking each of my bread I sit for several days on the internet, studying. I have two leavens.Now I want to concentrate on CM, and temporarily not use the "eternal" one. While I kept it in the refrigerator, now I understand that in vain. How to restore the presence of MC bacteria now? Just by pulling it out of the fridge and feeding it? Again, how to feed it: in the same way as it was grown, or "more modestly" - after all, I'm not going to use it yet ...

Consult, otherwise I am completely confused:

"Throw away unused starter culture in three days, it is no longer suitable for baking, having taken a small portion from it for reproduction. "

"Do not worry, feed a couple of times, then you will determine by eye, what and how much to add to store three days or a whole week))"

[bagirra225]

bagirra225

"I'll tell you one clever thing, but don't be offended" - if you bake with sourdough only once every one or two weeks, then there is no point in bothering with it. It is not worth it. Or you need to have a storage space with a temperature of about + 10 *.

If the starter culture has been stored in the refrigerator for a long time, then it is almost impossible to revive lactic acid bacteria in it, it is easier to grow another one. Simply pulling it out of the refrigerator and feeding the MK bacteria will not revive.

Next, you quote phrases that relate to storing and feeding French sourdough.
It was about storing the starter culture in the refrigerator at + 10 * in such a proportion that it was enough to preserve its vitality and strength for 3 days without additional feeding.

If you increase the proportion of sourdough to fresh dough by 2-3 times, then you can accordingly increase the shelf life up to one week.

But now I would advise you to grow a new leaven. It makes no sense to preserve what only wild yeast already live in.

[Zest]

Zest, we have, alas, no options. I am forced not to look for easy ways. Only sourdough bread without yeast (artificial). The children and I have metabolic disorders, problems with the gastrointestinal tract. Dry yeast and products with them are strictly prohibited, pressed yeast can be used on major holidays. We cannot refuse bread. Therefore, I will have to master the science of baking, especially since this is a creative process, and it draws me in.
And rarely do I bake purely because of my inexperience. The further - the more often, I hope
Now I am growing kefir sourdough. The dream is to learn how to bake long-fermented bread.
I wanted to ask you.
1. On the forum, bread baked exclusively with sourdough is not very popular, most of the recipes contain dry or pressed yeast in the composition. In this regard, I wonder how to recalculate the amount of sourdough from "yeast" recipes in relation to my situation? Maybe there are some approximate proportions? I vaguely guess that it will not work stupidly to "convert" the yeast into a sourdough. Probably, the time factor should be taken into account. Since the yeast speeds up the process, it will take more time to make the "sourdough-only bread".
Or is it enough to follow your recommendation from the original "master class" and skip the "yeast" item when kneading the dough, giving the final proofing until it doubles?
2. Is the "final proofing" in the specified recipe 50 minutes for pre-fermentation?
3. Does the "eternal" leaven also contain MC bacteria or not? There, in the original composition, flour and water.