Choice of size and crust

Please share your experience; Has anyone baked "regular white bread" in size XL? And then I even have a loaf L in height, it turns out right next to the top lid. What happens with a larger size?

XL is a few millimeters taller in size than L.
The only difference will be in the density of the loaves. XL - denser (heavier).
There is no special sense (for lovers of airy bread) in a large loaf.

Hello! Hello !! I've been baking at 255 for a week already - a pleasure !!! Here a question arose: what changes in the process of baking a bread machine when the size of the bread changes ?? I suspect that when the crust color changes, the temperature changes. And what changes when the size is changed?

Most interesting.
I watched the kneading, I did not see the difference for a small and a large loaf.
Most likely, the heating algorithm changes slightly. Since the oven heats and bakes with the same tubular heater. Then it would be nice for her to know, "hang in grams".
And since the temperature sensor is not inside the loaf, but next to the heater. That your information about the size of the bread helps HP to correct the absence of this data.

It is like using a gas burner (several thousand degrees) to heat water in a mug or saucepan. He brought the burner to the wall and removed it. The mug should be warmed more carefully, overexposed it - and instead of warm water there is already steam.

That is, in other words, does the average baking temperature change? And it seemed to me that this happens when the color of the crust changes ...

I think that the difference when changing the weight of the baked goods is only in the heating time. And no more. The temperature is the same, it cannot change. After all, the dough is the same, because it has become more, it did not become cast iron, it does not need higher temperature. But more time is needed to warm up a large mass.
It's another matter if the type of test is different. Here you already need to change the temperature. But only for this type of dough, but not depending on its mass. The crust is regulated by the baking time. It also (time) depends on the mass.

As for the color of the crust and mass - here are the specific data (there they are in the form of a table) from the instructions for the Delonghi 125, where all its standard modes are described every second, minute by minute and by degrees.

Classic bread.
Weight 1) 750 grams 2) 1000 grams 3) 1250 grams

Crust mode: a) light b) normal c) dark

According to the instructions - the difference for one type of bread - ONLY DURING baking:

1a - 53 min
1b - 61 min
1c - 71 min

2a -57 min
2b -65 min
2v -75 min

3a -62 min
3b -70 min
3v -80 min

This means that baking 0.75 kg of bread for 61 minutes will give you a NORMAL crust color. But for 62 minutes, 1.25 kg of bread, you will only get a LIGHT crust. This is because the heat from the surface of the bread more intensively goes deeper into the more massive piece of dough. To get the same crust (NORMAL) at maximum weight - the time is increased by 8 minutes!

If you hear how something clicks periodically in the HP, then know that the temperature is maintained discretely, that is, there is an "on-off" system using a relay. If there are no clicks, then the semiconductor thyristor controls the heater. The second option is more sensitive to heat and therefore less reliable (but only in a bread maker; in other devices, semiconductors are more reliable than relays). Delonghi uses a relay (you can hear it clicking quietly). It is not afraid of temperature. It by itself cannot smoothly regulate the temperature (a thyristor can), but this is not necessary in a bread maker, since the heating element cannot instantly heat up or cool down - it has thermal inertia.Therefore, the relay is just right here, and even it gives "smooth" regulation.

Interesting ... it turns out the more dough, the more you need to bake, and therefore knead, and it is also possible to raise, but the total time remains unchanged and the time of baking itself, judging by the instructions, remains unchanged ... How so? ...

Interesting ... it turns out the more dough, the more you need to bake, and therefore knead, and it is also possible to raise, but the total time remains unchanged and the time of baking itself, judging by the instructions, remains unchanged ... How so? ...

The fact is that the more dough, the better it is kneaded with a mixer, due to inertia. That is, the mixer HINDERS a larger piece of dough, but rotates a smaller piece of dough. Therefore, the mixing times can be the same. But baking is no longer possible, since the heat capacity is directly proportional to the mass of the dough. Therefore, it takes longer to heat. But not stronger - the heat will not have time to go into the dough and the crust will burn. In Delongy 125, this is done, and the basic programs (all stages, duration and temperature) are described by second in the instruction manual.

Perhaps I was looking badly, but I did not find a similar problem on the forum.
Question to the owners of Panasonic - 255.
I have Panas - 255, my friend - 207. When baking I use only the "light crust" and the bread, in my opinion, turns out darker than I would like ... My friend does not use the "light crust" at all, since her bread crust is in this mode turns out to be almost white.
On my oven, a relatively light crust comes out only on accelerated baking. In normal modes, you can’t call it light, and I don’t dare to expose the middle or dark crust - I’m afraid the charcoal will turn out. Inside, the bread is good, not baked and not raw, but the crust confuses me ... Maybe you need to contact the service or it’s like that for everyone ?

I use a medium crust. A dark crust is obtained if I bake butter bread containing eggs and milk.

The middle crust is not at all dark ...
You can try turning off the oven early, for example 10 minutes before the end of baking.

But if the light crust is not light, then, obviously, something is wrong with the stove.

The crust color also depends on the ingredients in the recipe. For example, more sugar, eggs - the crust is darker.
Try to set the size for small loaf (L) in addition to the Light Crust setting.
For me and Panasonic-207, with the above settings, the egg bread also turns out darker than we would like.
I reduce the baking time by switching off the oven 5 minutes before the end of the program. At the same time, the bread is baked.
Just 5-10 minutes before the end of baking, quickly look under the lid and evaluate the color of the crust.

We have Panas 254, purchased 1 month ago. At first it baked amazingly, the first 3-4 loaves, but then when the bread cools down, the top crust becomes soft, damp. Bakli and French, reduced the amount of water, sugar, but nothing helps. The bread is normal inside, all but the top crust is crispy. What is the problem?

Most likely, the flour has changed, the crust has changed.
How do you cool the bread.
Judging by the forum and my experience - the grill from the microwave or from the oven is the best place to rest the bread after the bread maker.
If I don't cover it with a towel, I get a crispy and crumbly crust on all sides. If it cools down wrapped, then a completely elastic crust is obtained.

I also sinned for flour, but I have already tried everything and the one with which I started.
Cool it on a wooden board, since there are no metal gratings. We tried to cover. but the effect is the same.
Maybe because of the difference in temperature, it is cool in the kitchen, and hot in the stove, but the kitchen temperature cannot be corrected in any way, there are no drafts, the window is closed.
Today in the morning I was baking French, when I opened the HP the crust was just right, crispy, ruddy, and it stood for 5 minutes and became soft.

I also sinned for flour, but I have already tried everything and the one with which I started.
Cool on a wooden board, because.no metal grates. We tried to cover. but the effect is the same.
Maybe because of the difference in temperature, it is cool in the kitchen and hot in the stove, but the kitchen temperature cannot be corrected in any way, there are no drafts, the window is closed.
Today in the morning I was baking French, when I opened the HP the crust was just right, crispy, ruddy, and it stood for 5 minutes and became soft.

Try to leave it in the oven until it cools completely, well, or for 15 minutes at least to begin with.

Our model was heated, left until completely cooled, but the crust is not crispy at all

Our model was heated, left until completely cooled, but the crust is not crispy at all

Do you add fat as indicated in the recipe? Refined vegetable oil or butter? If so, then the crust should crunch, well, how is that! If there is fat and sugar, the crust should crunch!
Try to take it out as soon as it is baked - and be sure to immediately put it on the wire rack, without covering it with anything. When covered or placed on a flat surface, the steam that comes out of the hot bread softens the crust. And of course, if the kitchen is cold (less than 20 degrees), then the crust can also soften due to increased condensation of moisture.

We always bake according to the recipe, where we need fat, of course we add, today we will bake and try to put it on the wire rack. how will I write what happened

[Cool on a wooden board]

I also sinned for flour, but I have already tried everything and the one with which I started.
Cool on a wooden board, since there are no metal gratings. We tried to cover. but the effect is the same.
Maybe because of the difference in temperature, it is cool in the kitchen and hot in the stove, but the kitchen temperature cannot be corrected in any way, there are no drafts, the window is closed.
Today in the morning I was baking French, when I opened the HP the crust was just right, crispy, ruddy, and it stood for 5 minutes and became soft.

I think the problem is that you are cooling on the board. When cooling off the wire shelf, the crust will be soft, since it will be more difficult for the water vapor to escape from hot bread. The moisture will settle on the crust. The bread "sweats" as it were.

As a grate, you can use a microwave grill stand, a board with holes for making dumplings (dumplings).

But in general, yesterday's bread does not crunch a crust either.

I got this kind of bread today, baked egg bread according to the recipe of my HP, bought new Dr. Oetker and Nordic took flour, medium loaf, dark crust, how many times such bread has never been baked like this
But the crust still softened a little, I don't have a grate, I put it on a ladle (seen in the first picture)

I bought PANASONIC 255. when choosing only two crust options: light and dark. And where is the middle option?
The manual describes all three ...

The middle crust is indicated by a point between light and dark.

The middle crust is between light and dark, but it is not duplicated by the inscription on the bread maker. Press the crust selection button - you will see that the arrow on the display points to 3 positions, the middle position will just be the middle crust.

sorry, I'm already baking bread. By the way, the first time !!! Exposed the dark ...

sorry, I'm already baking bread. By the way, the first time !!! Exposed the dark ...

Congratulations on your first baking experience!
Well, if you don't want a dark crust, then you can turn off the bread maker 5 minutes earlier and take out the loaf, or you can do nothing, ordinary white bread works well with a dark crust.

Well? I bought the second HP - Panasonic 255. I tried to get on it (not really straining - I’ll get it, I don’t get it, then it’s not time) for almost four months. Of course, the quality of performance is much higher,
which pleases. I used to think: the buckets in all stoves are the same made of pressed (or what is it called?) Aluminum, but here it is cast! But this is the only thing that made me happy, disappointments followed ...
The crust color is regulated only on one "Basic" program, there is also on the "gluten-free" program, but only medium or dark. What about everyone else? I'm shocked! I baked a cake according to my own recipe, but it turned out with a clearly burnt crust, it would reduce the degree of its friedness, but no - there is no such possibility. Even in my old Mulineshka, this function works on all programs except one, and in Delongy 125 it is generally regulated everywhere.
But that's not all ... It turns out that weight is not regulated everywhere. It's just that there are three sizes (M, L, XL), but in fact, in many programs there is a standard. The size is set only in "Basic" and "Diet".
What a bummer after so many months of waiting! How could I not have thought of studying the instructions in detail, but believed the admiration of users? Naive ...
How do you like Panasonic USERS get out of this situation. I am now also doomed to get out. Maybe I'll also understand all the charms of this miracle unit. Help!!!

[natalka]

How do you like Panasonic USERS get out of this situation. I am now also doomed to get out. Maybe I'll also understand all the charms of this miracle unit. Help!!!

natalka, it seems to me that it is better to start with the most ordinary bread.

I have HP for only a couple of months, I have honestly not tried all the modes (I have never baked the whole grain one), but all the tested modes and programs completely satisfy me in terms of automatism and quality of the result (both baking and dough).

You are now terribly upset because of the failure with the cake, it's a pity that this happened. Now I looked in the instructions - the cake is there on the whole-grain mode, which I have not tried, so I cannot give any advice regarding it. But I would probably bake such a recipe on the Normal one with raisins, where the size and color can be adjusted.

In general, try ordinary white bread, according to the very first recipe. If you measure the food correctly, the result is 100%. And the mood will improve.

What a bummer after so many months of waiting! How could I not have thought of studying the instructions in detail, but believed the admiration of users? Naive ...
How do you like Panasonic USERS get out of this situation. I am now also doomed to get out. Maybe I'll also understand all the charms of this miracle unit. Help!!!

So ... the main thing is calmness))) Well, a person is not perfect, everything is not so for him. Just your expectations exceeded the capabilities of this stove. Let's look at this problem from the other side - now you will pay more attention to the stove and be distracted from everyday worries and problems. Well, but seriously, I think that the voice of the people is not mistaken - your Panas is a good stove. I here on many branches read the same advice from different people - you need to get used to each thing and so that it gets used to you. Try to follow this advice. I am, however, the owner of Mulinex. I only have it for a few days and there is a lot I don’t understand about it ... but this is not yet a reason to panic. Hold on! As soon as you have a good product in Panas, you will immediately like it IMHO!

As soon as you have a good product in Panas, you will immediately like it IMHO!

You are now terribly upset because of the failure with the cake, it's a pity that this happened

Thank you very much girls! In general, I am happy with the cake that came out in P255. It is wonderful in everything except the crust, but maybe on butter dough and you don't have to choose. Maybe it turns out either baked with a burnt crust, or raw, but with a normal one. Here I cannot argue that this is not normal, but the fact that there is no adjustment of the crust color is straining! Is it really that Panasonic is so automatic that it regulates it itself? It is doubtful, but why then this function is not provided?

[natalka]

It is wonderful in everything except the crust, but maybe on butter dough and you don't have to choose. Maybe it turns out either baked with a burnt crust, or raw, but with a normal one.

natalka, I am sure that you need to achieve a tasty cake WITHOUT burnt crust.
I think that
one). you need to try simpler bread recipes in order to get some kind of success and believe in yourself
At the same time, on plain bread, it is necessary to exclude the version that the thermostat is faulty in the oven and it is banal to burn the bread.
2). Easter cake - try it on the "basic" mode with a light crust. You can look at this forum in the section "Recipes" and other cakes, try them.

oh, I forgot the option.
You can try the same Easter cake, on the same program, but just turn off the program earlier (reduce the baking time). I did this when I was counting the rye bread recipe to the minimum size.

except for the crust, but maybe on butter dough and you don't have to choose. Maybe it turns out either baked with a burnt crust, or raw, but with a normal one. Here I cannot argue that this is not normal, but the fact that there is no adjustment of the crust color is straining! Is it really that Panasonic is so automatic that it regulates it itself? It is doubtful, but why then this function is not provided?

I don't understand the problem.
Bake all the baked goods in the usual mode, the crust is regulated there, and the crust has been discussed more than once on the kulich: You need to put it light and you can put it in 10-15 minutes. turn off before the end ... or, even easier, add less sugar. The crust is burning sugar, not the oven.
And some programs are really completely automatic, and you do not need to choose a color, and are designed for a specific weight of the product.
So you don't need to be afraid. just not yet accustomed to and all the time comparing with another stove, as soon as you stop comparing, you will begin to enjoy this particular stove.
It's always difficult to get used to something new, but then ...

Natalka, here the topic of Easter cake was discussed:
https://Mcooker-enn.tomathouse.com/in...mf&Itemid=99&topic=1842.0
There, when baking, it must be turned off 7-10 minutes before the end of the program.

Well? I bought the second HP - Panasonic 255. I tried to get on it (not really straining - I’ll get it, I don’t get it, then it’s not time) for almost four months. Of course, the quality of performance is much higher,
which pleases. I used to think: the buckets in all stoves are the same made of pressed (or what is it called?) Aluminum, but here it is cast! But this is the only thing that made me happy, disappointments followed ...
The crust color is regulated only on one "Basic" program, there is also on the "gluten-free" program, but only medium or dark. What about everyone else? I'm shocked! I baked a cake according to my own recipe, but it turned out with a clearly burnt crust, it would reduce the degree of its friedness, but no - there is no such possibility. Even in my old Mulineshka, this function works on all programs except one, and in Delongy 125 it is generally regulated everywhere.
But that's not all ... It turns out that weight is not regulated everywhere. It's just that there are three sizes (M, L, XL), but in fact, in many programs there is a standard. The size is set only in "Basic" and "Diet".
What a bummer after so many months of waiting! How could I not have thought of studying the instructions in detail, but believed the admiration of users? Naive ...
How do you like Panasonic USERS get out of this situation. I am now also doomed to get out. Maybe I'll also understand all the charms of this miracle unit. Help!!!

Why didn't you make a logical "upgrade" - you would switch from the 3000th model to the 5002. And there would be no negative emotions. None...

natalka, well, do not be discouraged, I assure you that I have reviewed many stoves and re-read all the topics of choice ,,, I take this matter quite seriously and, you know, I realized that when buying various equipment, the first thing is that there are really sensible and high-quality models and brands are always visible by such trifles as the same cast bucket, assembly, etc., secondly, there are a minimum of bells and whistles in these things, only the most popular functional, and a bunch of different bells and whistles just say that this product not aerobatics, but all these things serve as an elementary enticement, IMHO ... I encountered such a phenomenon when I recently chose a stove, eventually stopping for burning, although there was a great temptation to take the oversized Kaiser. This is my personal IMHO, absolutely whatever.
And you just need to get used to the stove, and that's right, the color of the crust depends on sugar, or rather its amount.I also think that it is better to bake the cake in the main mode, or, alternatively, turn it off in advance when you see that the crust color has reached the desired one.
And yet, my neighbor recently bought an inexpensive stove, I don’t remember the model, so what’s the result, but in the end she didn’t get a single bread ... I saw a bucket from this stove, frankly cheap.

I tried Easter cake from the recipe for the 255th model. Really darkish comes out. I think it’s not the stove, but the recipe. Try Elena Bo's cake, the recipe is on the website. It tastes much better !!!

Crust color and size in French and rye are not adjustable, but automatic selection is quite good. You just have to get used to this fact.

Over time, you will love your stove and everything will work out! Good luck!

[natalka]

natalka don't be upset, try the cake from Xentia Lopez:
"quick yeast for baking 2.5 tsp.
wheat flour 400 gr
salt 0.5 tsp
sugar 5 tbsp. l.
vanilla
butter 2 tbsp. l.
eggs 3 pcs
milk 170 ml
raisins
mode basic fast
The dough turns out to be liquid - this is normal. Warm the milk a little.
_________________
Preparation
The main mode is fast - for me it is 1 hour 55 minutes. Average size, light crust. "

It always turns out very tasty. The photo is not very good, but the result

Girls, thank you all very much for participating in my problems. I will try to try all the tips. Turning off in 7-10 minutes is a way out, but if the crust was adjusted here and the problem of keeping track of time would be removed.
Don't think that I am so irretrievably disappointed in her. The appearance, assembly, bucket - the top of the art of baking, and it works like a whispering song (compared to those known to me) and the result on ordinary bread made me very happy, and the cake was generally very tasty, but its crust ... crust ... I repeat myself again, but do not swear, I just do not understand the manufacturers. Of course, you can reduce the amount of sugar, but what if I want sweet pastries. I understand that you are now again giving a bunch of advice and I will obey and adhere to proven recommendations, but why did the manufacturer not take care of this? Here is WHAT I don't understand. Is this a flaw or should the automation control it, but cannot cope?

Oh, this crust ... I repeat myself again, but don't swear, I just don't understand the manufacturers. Of course, you can reduce the amount of sugar, but what if I want sweet pastries. I understand that you are now again giving a bunch of advice and I will obey and adhere to proven recommendations, but why did the manufacturer not take care of this? Here is WHAT I don't understand. Is this a flaw or should the automation control it, but cannot cope?

I understood what the problem is.The Chinese sugar is not so sweet, so it doesn’t burn like that.But in fact, in the original recipe for sugar there are 4 tablespoons, and we put 6 + milk, that's the result, and in my 253rd cake on the main s raisins and a light crust is put there ...

Yes, I still remembered, my friend had LH, so it took 20 minutes. pulls out before the end, so that not only the Chinese have sugar not sweet

Oh, this crust ... I repeat myself again, but don't swear, I just don't understand the manufacturers. Of course, you can reduce the amount of sugar, but what if I want sweet pastries. I understand that you are now again giving a bunch of advice and I will obey and adhere to proven recommendations, but why did the manufacturer not take care of this? Here is WHAT I don't understand. Is this a flaw or should the automation control it, but cannot cope?

natalka,
I think that the manufacturer's mistake here is that the recipe for this cake was printed in the wrong section.
I read it again - I just can't understand why it is in the whole grain mode, the usual baking should be in the "normal" mode.
I wish you with the stove to quickly adjust to each other !!!
I don’t know about others - baking brings me a huge positive charge, I get great pleasure from this hobby. What I wish you in the coming year!

Actually, in the original sugar recipe there are 4 spoons, and we put 6 + milk, that's the result

natalka wrote that she made Easter cake according to her own recipe, without digressing.

Yes, I love this business too, otherwise I would not buy the third bread maker in my life. I'm so used to it (to the device) that I can't imagine my life without it, but you need to adapt to each one, they are like people, all with their own character.

And I made Easter cake really according to my own recipe, grams per gram. By weights and with measuring spoon and glass.

So she put our sugar, and not their cane

By the way, I use brown cane sugar, if anything. I try not to keep the refined white at home.

By the way, I use brown cane sugar, if anything. I try not to keep the refined white at home.

And we still sell white, it is very yellow and smaller than beetroot, and much less sweetness. Who drinks tea with sugar. then put 2 more spoons

[natalka]

So I'll write about my disappointments.
There is not much to compare with my first stove, but the topic is started natalka'th is very important. Just like natalku, I was upset with the crust of cake, my relatives liked it, but I didn’t, it’s burned and it’s burned and bitter, moreover, there is not so much sugar, I would like it to be sweeter. Well, okay, I'll try again in the future, taking into account the advice of all members of the forum.

Second point. Upset the rye bread recipes. I didn't really like it, that is, you have to look, and the size is the only huge! in figs I need him if no one except me loves rye? in general look again.

The third point, it seems, the productivity of the stove is 1 kg - a loaf, that is, the maximum load per 1 kg of ingredients, but the dough recipes for dumplings and pizza (the first recipe) do not at all realize these capacities, but I would like to get a bigger lump of dough for one output.

And fourth. Cupcakes. It is necessary to knead somewhere, and then still line the form with special paper ... annoying ... having little experience in baking muffins in a gas oven, I was disappointed in this function, since in this situation it is easier to bake in the oven in ordinary inexpensive muffin tins , which just need to be greased with butter and sprinkled with flour, nothing will burn, and the forms themselves are more interesting and more beautiful than bread.
In general, I really love cupcakes and I will be very glad if someone tells me some less confusing ways of baking cupcakes in the oven.

By the way, I didn't find it in the instructions ... who knows at what temperature the oven bakes?

[About Easter cake]

The third point, it seems, the productivity of the stove is 1 kg - a loaf, that is, the maximum load per 1 kg of ingredients, but the dough recipes for dumplings and pizza (the first recipe) do not at all realize these capacities, but I would like to get a bigger lump of dough for one output.

About Easter cake: throw sugar at least 8 tablespoons (I throw 7), just turn it off earlier and that's it, no problem.
Dough for dumplings well, very cool, and any stove with a kilogram lump will not cope.
And what interferes with kneading the second portion, only 15-20 minutes is needed, you are unlikely to have time with the first portion of the dough.
About cupcakes also read carefully. Many do not line up with paper.
And about the rye- well, put in less flour and everything else, and the loaf will be less.

And in general, it seems to me that your rosaces are from the region: "But she still doesn't run for beer and doesn't wash herself."
If something doesn't work out, it's not the stove's fault, but the one who throws it all at her

And in general, it seems to me that your rosaces are from the region: "But she still doesn't run for beer and doesn't wash herself."
If something doesn't work out, it's not the stove's fault, but the one who throws it all at her

Why so at once?

Just a bread machine - there is a bread machine, it performs the main function of baking bread. And it would probably be more useful if the manufacturer developed this particular direction more carefully than all sorts of gadgets such as cooking jam, etc.

I experiment with rye bread, but I have not yet achieved success, a smaller number of ingredients leads to poor stirring and burning, more and more often the thought comes that without BAZ, Extra-R, Panifarin, etc. i won't get the desired result

Why so at once?

Just a bread machine - there is a bread machine, it performs the main function of baking bread. And it would probably be more useful if the manufacturer developed this particular direction more carefully than all sorts of gadgets such as cooking jam, etc.

I experiment with rye bread, but I have not yet achieved success, a smaller number of ingredients leads to poor stirring and burning, more and more often the thought comes that without BAZ, Extra-R, Panifarin, etc. i won't get the desired result

So I’m not for offense, but that you would look more optimistically at your stove.
And rye will definitely work out. Try Darnitsky from the fugasca, there are no different additives, but it turns out, and read carefully about the formation of a rye bun (slightly sticky, like with a comma)

Eh girls. : :) I started this topic, and now I am more and more convinced that Panasonic is YES. There is no better choice. You can adapt to anyone, but enjoy perfection - only with this one.

Is it one step from disappointment to enjoying perfection?
I am very happy for you and may this oven bring you only joy!